- Joined
- Jan 23, 2008
Takahashi splits with Morozov
- Thread starter icebear
- Start date
Most definitely. Can't say it better than that.
An arsenal of technical elements means nothing if Daisuke can't hit those elements when it counts. Sure in 2007 he had wonderful Free program, but that was partly because he was so far behind the pressure was off, and even then he wasn't clean.. He's shown though in the short program in 2007, in his world perforamances this year and just in general that he's not exactly the guy who puts it out there for the big competitions.
Daisuke is a fine skater, but until he learns how to skate cleanly and not Zakada himself he's not going to be a world or Olympic champion. Period.
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2004
Good reasons for a change.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
I think we can say the same about any of the top guys. Joubert (6th in the SP at worlds), Lambiel (7th in the free skate at worlds), Verner (20th in the free skate at worlds), Buttle (lost the Canadian championship), Weir, Lysacek...
Joubert has delivered in major competition far more than Daisuke has. And Daisuke is hardly a spring chicken and also Joubert wasn't as far behind as Daisuke was.. Now sure Daisuke may have a Buttle like competition but the thing is with Jeff, that Jeff didn't think he'd win himself, and didn't have the pressure of the quad. So that was a huge skin of his back.
We've seen time and time again, Daisuke falter in major competitions. The guy averages only one clean competition a year. I like Daisuke but I'm not sure how someone can't say that his worlds wasn't disasterous for a skater at his level. Lambiel has never been the best jumper, but Daisuke is a good jumper.
- Joined
- Feb 11, 2007
Makes me wonder based on what facts and observations the poster made this statement.
- Joined
- Jul 14, 2007
I wonder what led Morozov to take on Oda...Did he already know at that point that Takahashi might leave him after this season? It must have been post-worlds perhaps because Daisuke I'm sure wasn't too happy with not winning at worlds, let alone not medaling. Do any of you guys think it might been like a preemptive thing, to make sure he has at least one top male figure skater at his camp?
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
I believe you are hinting at medals. If so, I can't answer. I kinda judge a skater by the way he moves with the music. Dai is a natural. So is Oda.
Joe
- Joined
- Feb 11, 2007
Sorry, you leave me clueless now. You stated that Daisuke was in top condition before Morozov. Now you're saying you judge a skater by his or her musicality. Where is the connection between a skater's musicality and a skater being in top condition or not? Lambiel is a very musical skater, but his performances in Goteborg was mediocre, I don't think many people would claim he was in top condition at this year's Worlds.
Anyway, I doubt many people had thought Daisuke was in top condition before Morozov got involved. Not even during the Torino Olympic season except at Skate America.
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2006
yeah, that sounds reasonable. He knew that Daisuke was leaving so he offered his services to Oda and Oda agreed.
This link was posted on FSUniverse:
http://www.japantoday.com/category/sports/view/takahashi-parts-with-choreographer-morozov
"Former world silver medalist Daisuke Takahashi said Tuesday he has parted with his figure skating coach and choreographer Nikolai Morozov following Morozov’s recent decision to coach his rival Nobunari Oda as well. ‘‘It’s a bit awkward to have the same coach with my rival. I had expected Nikolai to concentrate on me toward the 2010 Vancouver Olympics,’’ Takahashi said."
Based on that, Takahashi apparently had no intertion to leave Morozov.
Last edited:
That sounds right to me. Why would he leave Morozov just because of one disappointing result after three grand prix golds, two gpf silvers, worlds silver, and world record score?
- Joined
- Jul 14, 2007
I know...but the thing is, I'm pretty sure Morozov would have asked Takahashi ahead of time before making such a decision.....There's no way Morozov would have made such a huge decision (taking on another top skater from Japan no less!) without consulting his pupil....That would have been kind of backstabbing no? Unless Takahashi thought it might be a good thing at first, only to change his mind later....
On a different note, the skater-coach relationship in figure skating continues to fascinate me. What astounds me is the way in which things can unravel so quickly...For instance, the way things happened with Frank Carroll and Michelle Kwan, and also with Robin Wagner and Sarah Hughes....I think Frank and Michelle are on good terms now, but I'm not sure the same is said of Wagner and Hughes. I think things turned sour when Wagner took on Sasha and it struck me as cold when Sarah was interviewed about that and she said that they hadn't spoken in a long time or something like that. IT 's like, cmon! you guys won the olympics together and you don't even speak anymore??
Last edited:
What I find interesting is that it seems that Japanese skaters do not have any loyalty to any coach, let it be non-Japanese coaches or newly adopted Russian/American coaches. To me, it seems as if they bounce around to whomever is coaching 'the flavor' of the time.
For example, Ms Yamada develops all these skating phenoms and then they migrate to someone else... WHY is that?
For example, Ms Yamada develops all these skating phenoms and then they migrate to someone else... WHY is that?
- Joined
- Oct 27, 2006
I think I am losing my mind with all these coaching changes this season!!
:think:
:think:I think he had far more than one clean competition each year... Last season at NHK, Nationals and Winter Universiade he was sparkiling clean... Worlds weren't that bad, either.
His injury/ilnesses also contribute to his poorer record... He had huge problems with boots at Campbells and Skate Canada 2006. At GPF 2006 he caught stomach flu and was barely able to finish his program. At Worlds 2008 again he had problem with boots and injured his foot. Considering that, his performances weren't that bad.
Plus, Dai sticks to technically challenging programs... He didn't back off from challenging two quads and two 3A.
Joubert, on the other hand, prefers to play safe and usually it works. Plus when he's injured/sick, he usually just withdraws without spoiling his wins record.
A lot of the Japanese skaters still occassionaly work with the coaches that helped them to rise in the skating world... Daisuke with Utako, Miki with Yuka, Mao recently worked with Machiko for a short while...
In some cases of very sudden changes (i.e. Shizuka switching to Tarasova), it was the JSF that requested the coaching change.
Sometimes it is the skater that feels that a different coach could help them (Shizuka and Miki moving to Morozov). I don't see how it is much different that skaters from other countries deciding to switch coaches, like Kimmie, B/A, Johnny. Brian Joubert switched coaches like gloves before he found the right one...
Actually, it was because of Machiko's health. She didn't feel that she could accompany Mao and Mai in all the competitions anymore. Plus, Machiko is now working with young talents Kanako Murakami, Sayaka Matsubara and Shouma Uno. She wouldn't be able to give them all the attention they deserve, especially considering Mao's hectic schedule. Not to mention the fact that Mao had troubles finding enough ice time in Japan back then.
I wonder about this as well... The problem is, different newspapers report different things. Some say that Dai didn't know about the coaching change, some say that he has known about Morozov's plans to coach Nobu since Worlds. The TV interview, meanwhile, doesn't make things clear either way.
I find it difficult to believe that nor Morozov, nor JSF would consult Dai about the possible coaching change...
But, considering Dai's latest interview, I wonder if he wouldn't end up switching coaches even if Nobu stayed with Barkell. Dai said that he would like a coach just to himself - but Morozov already coaches Adam Rippon, who will probably also move to seniors sometime soon. (Not to mention Miki and Nikolai's dance teams).
When I heard Dai's interview, it reminded me of Mao, who also wants a coach just for herself, because she wants to stay in Japan. And I wonder if Daisuke doesn't consider staying in Japan as well... He has now two rinks to train at, state-of-art Chukyo Arena (where he trained with Morozov for some time) and the Kansai Daigaku rink. Takeshi Honda coaches there - Daisuke mentioned recently that Takeshi was helping him with jumps. Dai is also starting post-graduation studies, and I think it would be definitely easier for him if he was able to stay in Japan for longer periods of time.
So I wonder if there weren't more factors that contributed to Dai's decision than what the press has reported.
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2006
It's not that they're disloyal to a coach. The JSF actually has a lot of say in who they work with. Remember, Shizuka Arakawa was with Callaghan, and then they just removed her from his care. To "make up" for this loss in revenue for Callaghan (because, let's face it, although the coaches do invest themselves in the skater, it is a business--many are loyal to those paying the bills), the JSF was going to give Callaghan Yoshie Ando, and he turned her down.
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2006
I have noticed that as well. Mao left Rafael very abruptly, Fumie seems to change coaches at least once a season. Miki is back and forth between Morozov and somebody in Japan... Shizuka was working with Terosova until Morozov became the "in" choreographer/coach. Maybe they think they don't really need a coach... it's just a formality and they need someone to choreograph the programs.?
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
For me, musicality is everything otherwise Stop The Music. What's the point of having music in a Sport if it doesn't really matter. I appreciate the Quads but they don't mean that much to me unless there is a skater who can handle them with music. As I said before, Daisuke is a natural with music. That is why he was so good during the Skate America you mentioned.
I am not putting Morozov down, if that is what you are worried about. He wants to be a Master Coach a la Tarassova and Moskvina (who only take on skaters aleady proven to be talented). I think Morozov is doing well in that vane.
Can you name a Master Coach who developed a young skater from scratch?
Joe
This is an opinion and you are entitled to that. There are no written statistics on it, that I've read.
Joe
Similar threads
