TT choreographed both MK's LP and a new SP

[mzheng]

It seems no matter how old you are in figure skating, parents have controll most of the time. According to you Tara's mother had control over her at 15, big deal! Michelle is 25 and her father has a certain amount of control over her!

What do you mean by that she was too out of it? Yes, I agree with the statement that she was a wishfull one. She got what she wished for--the OGM.

According to me not that Tara's mother had control over her, she was no control over her at all. Tara's mother should've put her feet down. No more 50 3Loop/3Loop a day....she was a kid back then she might not know what the consequence could be. Or even she knew, she was just not think about it, like all kids do when they were young they don't think about things/consequence beyong ten years.....I gave this to Danny, when MK was very young asked to skate more sessions, Danny said no, no more than 4 sessions a day.....

The ironic is what most ppl take up sports for the purpose of a heath body, IIRC it was reported that Irina and Shen(chinese pair) original took up FS because their parents thought it is good for healthier body (Shen was very weak when she was really young). Then end up with injuried body parts during practice the sports.

You are right, Tara has the OGM. But by the end of day (as of now) MK has the fame (Emmy award invitations, ??) and endorsements (and they are keeping come in).

 

[Piel]

You are right, Tara has the OGM. But by the end of day (as of now) MK has the fame (Emmy award invitations, ??) and endorsements (and they are keeping come in).

mzheng

AND....Michelle is still able to participate in and enjoy the sport she loves. I wonder if given the choice of a very short career with an OGM or to be able to skate for the next 15 to 20 years without an OGM what a skater's choice would be?

 

[Piel]

By the way, at least she got OGM and nobldy can take it away from her, she got it on the first try.

Does this mean if Cohen finally wins a National/World or OGM after her multiple tries it will in some way be less special?

 

[mzheng]

I wonder if given the choice of a very short career with an OGM or to be able to skate for the next 15 to 20 years without an OGM what a skater's choice would be?

For me as logic think would be. If taking up the sport as the short cut to the top of fame then using it as the easier means to achieve more fame and wealthy, then it would be short career in FS with an OGM (this is assume the OGM would lead to the career in other earea like acting, etc. to got more fame and wealth). If taking up the sports and keeping it is really for the love of it, then it would be still able to skate for the next 15 to 20 years without OGM. Not to mention the fame and wealth kept coming in as some bonus.

 

[millie]

For me as logic think would be. If taking up the sport as the short cut to the top of fame then using it as the easier means to achieve more fame and wealthy, then it would be short career in FS with an OGM (this is assume the OGM would lead to the career in other earea like acting, etc. to got more fame and wealth). If taking up the sports and keeping it is really for the love of it, then it would be still able to skate for the next 15 to 20 years without OGM. Not to mention the fame and wealth kept coming in as some bonus.

I don't think (my opinion) that when Tara set out in the sport of figure skatingthat she thought that she would win the Olympics so early. Also who's to say that if Michelle had won the first Olympics that she would be still skating at 25. We don't know. For the love of the sport, that's what I hear a lot; If they didn't love the sport and the thrill of winning and the big money, they wouldn't be at it. Give me a break, that's what they are a striving for, to win, and win at all costs. If it's not their health that suffers, something else does. They can't keep skating forever, father time catches up with them. If they all kept skating and didn't give up when they thought that it was right for them, man, what discussions we would be having now. All those girls going to the Olympics or trying out for the Olympics, just imagine.

 

[Mathman]

I think we are asking the wrong question. No time traveler from the future came up to Tara and said, "I'm your fairy godmother, you have one wish: do you want a gold medal or a healthy hip joint?"

It's like a serving in the army. The recruiter does not say, "Hey, buddy, if you sign up to go to Iraq you will come home in a body bag. Want to enlist?"

But the soldier may be willing to risk injury or death for the sake of patriotism, or from a sense of duty, or simply because he got caught up in policy matters beyond his control. The soldier does not consciously balance the risks against the potential rewards; rather he soldiers on, doing his best to push negative thoughts aside.

Tara stormed the hill, hoping to dodge the bullet with her name on it.

Was it worth it? The alternative is never to test yourself, never to try.

((Cue the background music..."O'er the la-and of the frreeeee!....))

MM

 

[mzheng]

Does this mean if Cohen finally wins a National/World or OGM after her multiple tries it will in some way be less special?

Obviously according to that logic.

 

[millie]

Does this mean if Cohen finally wins a National/World or OGM after her multiple tries it will in some way be less special? [/QUOTE

I think that if she ever won the OGM that it would be just as special as it was to Tara at age 15. The only thing is that she had to skate 5 years longer than Tara did and Michelle had to 10 years longer than if they had won it at 15. Who knows only themselves if they would have continued skating if either one of them had won the OGM!!!! They may all be trying to get into the entertainment industry.

 

[attyfan]

"Originally Posted by Piel
Does this mean if Cohen finally wins a National/World or OGM after her multiple tries it will in some way be less special? "

If it is "less special" for Cohen to win after one (Olys) try, is the "specialness" of winning an OGM lessened further for those who have tried twice, such as Kwan and Slutskaya? Or. does being a multiple Oly medalist count for something?

 

[R.D.]

I don't know if it would be "less special" to them. Only they know. But what I can infer is that if the OGM has diminished THAT much in value to them, why even bother going for it?

 

[attyfan]

I think we are asking the wrong question. No time traveler from the future came up to Tara and said, "I'm your fairy godmother, you have one wish: do you want a gold medal or a healthy hip joint?" ...

Tara stormed the hill, hoping to dodge the bullet with her name on it.

Was it worth it? The alternative is never to test yourself, never to try ...

MM

I vehemently disagree that the alternative to risking one's health is "never to test yourself, never to try ..." Michelle and Irina were both at Nagano; they both did not risk their health; and as a result, they were both at SLC -- and should both be in Torino. They are testing themselves and trying -- without permanent hip injury.

 

[R.D.]

I vehemently disagree that the alternative to risking one's health is "never to test yourself, never to try ..." Michelle and Irina were both at Nagano; they both did not risk their health; and as a result, they were both at SLC -- and should both be in Torino. They are testing themselves and trying -- without permanent hip injury.

I agree that Irina is testing herself but I'm not so sure about MK. She definitely could have tried harder the past three seasons. But it was her choice to coast, and if it means she can skate longer as opposed to being injured, hey, more power to her. But the trade-off here is that by not pushing yourself while on top, you will be passed. And that's what's happening to Kwan right now. Even Cohen has caught up to her in the TECHNICAL category (Kwan has the edge in performance and consistency though). Once again, though, if this was Kwan's intention then that's fine by me.

However ugly this may sound, if MK wants to put herself back in the game, she's got to test herself a little more, which means raising the chance of injury a bit higher. If figure skating is supposed to be a "sport", well, why don't some of the "athletes" treat it like one? All sports carry risk of injury, and to be the best you have to risk injury by pushing yourself forward. It's just the way it is.

I suppose the "line" is formed when you push too hard and end up with a permanent injury. But that's subjective. Some athletes are willing to push themselves that far, and are willing to pay the price- at least for the moment.

 

[Excidra2001]

You are right, Tara has the OGM. But by the end of day (as of now) MK has the fame (Emmy award invitations, ??) and endorsements (and they are keeping come in).

The need to compare Tara to Michelle. Its getting really tiresome to see some Kwan fans still stuck on Tara and winning the Olympic gold. MK is famous, as is Tara, Sarah,Sasha, all four girls could've attended the Emmy pre-party, specially Sarah who is the reigning Olympic champion. All four girls are represented by prestigious talent agency and I don't think it would be hard for these agency to obtain an invite for their client.

I think if Tara was competing today, healthy and all, she would've been the one to beat. She was a strong competitor. She competed in an era where Kwan was dominating the skating world. Leading up to Nagano, all Kwan had to do in the eyes of many was to step on the ice, skate clean and gold would go to her. Michelle did just that and probably even more but Tara came out and totally stood out from the rest and took "Michelle's" gold medal.
Its unfortunate that she sustained such a serious injury because it seemed to me that she had so much competitive drive still left in her. Fifty years later i'm sure her win in Nagano will be remembered by skating fans, thats a performance you just don't forget.

 

[millie]

I vehemently disagree that the alternative to risking one's health is "never to test yourself, never to try ..." Michelle and Irina were both at Nagano; they both did not risk their health; and as a result, they were both at SLC -- and should both be in Torino. They are testing themselves and trying -- without permanent hip injury.

And the thing is that they are both still working hard!!!How do we know what harm they are doing to their bodies and what it is doing to their health. Neither one of them are no spring chicks(not meaning any harm) literallly. Lets get real, they were all and still are skating for the OGM, if they could get it, I would say they probably would give up their hip (there's always the hip replacement)

 

[R.D.]

You are right, Tara has the OGM. But by the end of day (as of now) MK has the fame (Emmy award invitations, ??) and endorsements (and they are keeping come in).

You know what I have to say to this? In the end, all that matters is whether the two of them are happy where they are right now. Right now, it looks to be the case, so it doesn't matter. MK has the fame, medals, whatever, and Tara has the OGM and a few acting gigs. They both seem content with what they've accomplished. Apparently some fans are not... :scratch:

 

[mzheng]

Lets get real, they were all and still are skating for the OGM, if they could get it, I would say they probably would give up their hip (there's always the hip replacement)

May be yes for some, but may be not for some....I doubt at this stage of Kwan's career an OGM is more important to her than a 10th US National title....not to mention destroy the hip for an OGM. (by no means here I implied that Tara is still willing to sacrifying her hip had she know the consequence.)...."An OGM can't make her any more famouse." --- borrow from Peggy.

 

[Excidra2001]

You know what I have to say to this? In the end, all that matters is whether the two of them are happy where they are right now. Right now, it looks to be the case, so it doesn't matter. MK has the fame, medals, whatever, and Tara has the OGM and a few acting gigs. They both seem content with what they've accomplished. Apparently some fans are not... :scratch:

:agree: :agree:

I think thats what some people do not understand, maybe, just maybe Tara is some where in the world laughing away and enjoying life. Maybe, just maybe she doesn't give a hoot about attending some high-profile party.Skating might be the furthest thing from her mind, she has accomplished the goals she set for her self, in terms of figure skating. I'd love to see her be involved in the sport again, she'd be an awsome coach, even though some people might think other-wise.

 

[millie]

For me as logic think would be. If taking up the sport as the short cut to the top of fame then using it as the easier means to achieve more fame and wealthy, then it would be short career in FS with an OGM (this is assume the OGM would lead to the career in other earea like acting, etc. to got more fame and wealth). If taking up the sports and keeping it is really for the love of it, then it would be still able to skate for the next 15 to 20 years without OGM. Not to mention the fame and wealth kept coming in as some bonus.

Ta

The logic is that in figure skating you can take the short cut to fame by working hard, reaching for the top in the process risking your health and winning.
Or, you can take it easy, sit back and watch, not trying to take risks and hoping the other skater is going to make a mistake and you winning!

Which would you think is the better skater and which one deserves to win?
Which one deserves the fame?

 

[Mathman]

Michelle and Irina were both at Nagano; they both did not risk their health; and as a result, they were both at SLC -- and should both be in Torino.

I believe that they both did risk their health, and continue to do so daily. Any time you step onto the ice you might fall and break your neck. That's sports. That's life.

 

[Piel]

Lets get real, they were all and still are skating for the OGM, if they could get it, I would say they probably would give up their hip (there's always the hip replacement)

I am hoping that the means that you don't seriously think that an OGM is worth undergoing major reconstructive surgery?