2015-16 State of Russian Ladies skating

[sabinfire]

Posted in Yulia's thread, but wanted to bring it over here too:

Yulia Lipnitskaya 'Elvis' SP 2015-2016 (4 screens | 4 competitions)
https://youtu.be/GUmOP1U7S0Y

The new changes to the program at Russian Nationals are very evident!

 

[blue_idealist]

I am afraid her best skates in 2012 would not be enough now.

Well, maybe not enough to podium at her Nationals, but enough to move up higher than 9th place.

 

[Lipea]

I don't think the Russian Fed has any reason to be unfair to Liza. She is the world champ and has a powerful coach. She isn't skating well and has bad programs this season, so the lower TES and PCS is justified.

Well, I was not trying to prove that someone has a reason to be unfair to her. Indeed her PCS were on the same inflated level as of other seniors at Nationals. But I don't understand people here who generilize saying that "she is skating badly so she deserves it", when in actuality she skates well, just not as well as last season. Certain things were UNARGUABLY unfair towards her like that UR call on 3T-3T. Can you argue about that there was actually UR? No. And there have never been. Why did they call on it then? That's what I am wondering about. And yes, they could have counted that combination as a sequence, esp. since it is Nationals and she is a WC; but they preferred to judge it harshly. Why?

Sometimes it looks to me that most of people for some reason dislike Liza as they seem to be so ready to pick on her now as "performing badly" or having "a terrible failure" when she is just not at her best in SP. For instance, someone commented that it is totally fair for her to not get a spot to GPF since it was her fault to perform badly (despite she didn't get a chance to perform LP in which she was consistently good), and that comment got something like 10 likes. I can imagine if that situation would happen to Mao or Yulia the reaction here would be quite different. Or, people don't pick on Elena who performs her best in Russia but at big international starts somehow fails to do the same. A lot of the skaters tend to get in their top shape towards the second half of the season like Denis Ten or Polina Edmunds. There are more than 3 months until Worlds. However, in Liza's case people happily rash to judge her unlike others, to put her down, and I don't see the reason of such an attitude.

Btw. as far as I know that UR call very likely resulted in taking out Liza's stipend from Fed, since being 8th she does not make it into Russian team. :dev2:

 

[Lipea]

Well, maybe not enough to podium at her Nationals, but enough to move up higher than 9th place.

Maybe for this year. But next year it probably will be even harder with more extraordinary juniors. So despite I like Alena I don't see a realistic chance for her to get even close to the podium.

 

[Sugarpova]

Btw. as far as I know that UR call very likely resulted in taking out Liza's stipend from Fed, since being 8th she does not make it into Russian team.

thats the saddest thing to me:sad21:

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

Sometimes it looks to me that most of people for some reason dislike Liza as they seem to be so ready to pick on her now as "performing badly" or having "a terrible failure" when she is just not at her best in SP. For instance, someone commented that it is totally fair for her to not get a spot to GPF since it was her fault to perform badly (despite she didn't get a chance to perform LP in which she was consistently good), and that comment got something like 10 likes. I can imagine if that situation would happen to Mao or Yulia the reaction here would be quite different. Or, people don't pick on Elena who performs her best in Russia but at big international starts somehow fails to do the same. A lot of the skaters tend to get in their top shape towards the second half of the season like Denis Ten or Polina Edmunds. There are more than 3 months until Worlds. However, in Liza's case people happily rash to judge her unlike others, to put her down, and I don't see the reason of such an attitude.

Liza has had some back luck this year, particularly at TEB where she might have gotten her season back on track with a good performance in the LP. Unfortunately, she is Russian so that means you have to be at your best for most of the season to make the world team. She still could have made it on the podium with two strong skates. Although she may not have received marks you think were fair at nationals, the general consensus was that her PCS this season was too high internationally, so these things tend to balance out.

 

[Weathergal]

Posted in Yulia's thread, but wanted to bring it over here too:

Yulia Lipnitskaya 'Elvis' SP 2015-2016 (4 screens | 4 competitions)
https://youtu.be/GUmOP1U7S0Y

The new changes to the program at Russian Nationals are very evident!

Wow, more changes than I have guessed at first! Thanks for the posting.

 

[winky97]

Sometimes it looks to me that most of people for some reason dislike Liza as they seem to be so ready to pick on her now as "performing badly" or having "a terrible failure" when she is just not at her best in SP. For instance, someone commented that it is totally fair for her to not get a spot to GPF since it was her fault to perform badly (despite she didn't get a chance to perform LP in which she was consistently good), and that comment got something like 10 likes. I can imagine if that situation would happen to Mao or Yulia the reaction here would be quite different. Or, people don't pick on Elena who performs her best in Russia but at big international starts somehow fails to do the same. A lot of the skaters tend to get in their top shape towards the second half of the season like Denis Ten or Polina Edmunds. There are more than 3 months until Worlds. However, in Liza's case people happily rash to judge her unlike others, to put her down, and I don't see the reason of such an attitude.

Btw. as far as I know that UR call very likely resulted in taking out Liza's stipend from Fed, since being 8th she does not make it into Russian team. :dev2:

Ok, Sorry, but it is not true that Elena on performs well only in Russia. I think this is the second time that I read this claim. If you look at her history, most her wins have taken place outside of Russia. Last year to my knowledge Elena only had one competition in Russia and that was nationals, yet she won her two Grand Prix events and performed great at GPF and Euros. She had problems at Worlds, which she still medal despite battling the flu. This is actually the only year Elena has had problems and she is actually doing well considering the growth she is going through and the injury she had at the beginning of the season, but she has still managed to medal at all of her events, both in and out of Russia. Just because her two best competition this year occurred in Russia does not mean that that is the only place she can skate well.

I am a huge supporter of Liza, but things are what they are. Last year was her year, but this year was not. Because of the terrorist attacks in France she did not have an opportunity to redeem herself after a flawed short program and she missed GPF. The thing is a skater should can't dig a hole in the short with plans of digging out in the long when they have a strong field of competitors in front of them. Gracie and Ashley do this too and they need to stop. I would love to see Liza on Russia's World team. We will see what happens, but Liza very likely will not be there. I don't think Liza is a failure because of this year. I think so much went into last year that she may Not have had anything left for this year. Skating is about peaks and valleys. Ups and downs. All skaters no matter how great will go through it. Yulia is going through it. Mao is going through it. Elena is going through it. Heck Evgenia will likely go through it.

 

[lavoix]

I don't understand you guys, why you are thinking in a bad way about Anna. She might have bad showings outside the Russia but come on give the girl a chance. You have seen how fierce she was plus she competed very well under pressure. European Championships won't be more difficult than Russian Nationals. I think the bronze is Anna's to lose there. Let's not produce theories of her bombing...

Sorry to ruin your idealistic mindset, but have you seen her skate in the last 3 years? She has had 2 lucky clean skates in her career (albeit at the best possible times to get selected for worlds and Europeans team).

While I agree with the decision to send her to Europeans, I don't agree with sending her to worlds under any circumstance. Maybe team worlds...

 

[lavoix]

IMO: Send Anna to Euros and if she doesn't do well there than rplace her for worlds.

Sotskova anyone? By far of the Russian seniors right now she's one of the most co sistent skaters there, Russia so should invest in her because I see a lot of potential in herm

Why aren't the Russians investing more in her? She's really sublime! When I heard she was a senior I definitely wanted her to get the 3rd sport for Europeans. However she was seriously knocked by the judges at nationals, it was quite disgusting to see.

 

[Li'Kitsu]

Sorry to ruin your idealistic mindset, but have you seen her skate in the last 3 years? She has had 2 lucky clean skates in her career (albeit at the best possible times to get selected for worlds and Europeans team).

While I agree with the decision to send her to Europeans, I don't agree with sending her to worlds under any circumstance. Maybe team worlds...

I get the feeling the person who hasn't watched Anna in the last 3 years is you. There's no denying she has her up's and down's, but she had way more than "2 lucky skates". She made the GPF in her first senior season and was 4th at her first world championships in 2014 - and arguably should have been 3rd. She had awesome skates in Skate Canada 2014 and again made the GPF that year. And this season, she had a clean competition at Mordovian Ornament already additionally to nationals. She's "hit or miss", like honestly quite a lot of skaters, even really great skaters, but she's very far from just "2 lucky skates".

 

[moriel]

Meh, ISU should just remember that russia is located both in europe and in asia, and allow them to participate in both europeans and 4cc.
Then our problem is solved, 3 euros spots and 3 4cc spots shall accomodate most of the fan wishes.

 

[sloveniangirl]

Okay, the only russian i really like is Yulia, but it´s disgusting how people like to bash Adelina. I know, people believe what they want to believe, but it´s ridiculous. After a year off and after injuries, it´s logical to me, that you can not be in a good shape. Saying that "she is showing true colors" ect., wth, i mean, look at Asada. With her bad performances, Is she showing "true colors" too? :dumb:

 

[winky97]

Meh, ISU should just remember that russia is located both in europe and in asia, and allow them to participate in both europeans and 4cc.
Then our problem is solved, 3 euros spots and 3 4cc spots shall accomodate most of the fan wishes.

4CC was established to allow skaters from non-European counties the opportunity at a competition similar to Europeans where they are not eligible to compete. These competitions count point wise in terms of world ranking scores and skaters from transcontinental counties should not be afforded more point scoring opportunities than skaters from non-transcontinental counties.

Besides, even if ISU did this, people would still find a reason to gripe because maybe their favorite was at 4CC instead of Europeans or their favorite did not make Worlds. Russia has fielded a great team for Europeans, that will in all likelihood sweep for the second year in a row, and will likely field a great team for Worlds, which will likely get at least two of the three podiums with Medvedeva and Radionova, but instead of appreciating this people are focused on their favorite not being able to compete.

 

[curious]

Ok, Sorry, but it is not true that Elena on performs well only in Russia. I think this is the second time that I read this claim. If you look at her history, most her wins have taken place outside of Russia. Last year to my knowledge Elena only had one competition in Russia and that was nationals, yet she won her two Grand Prix events and performed great at GPF and Euros. She had problems at Worlds, which she still medal despite battling the flu. This is actually the only year Elena has had problems and she is actually doing well considering the growth she is going through and the injury she had at the beginning of the season, but she has still managed to medal at all of her events, both in and out of Russia. Just because her two best competition this year occurred in Russia does not mean that that is the only place she can skate well.

I am a huge supporter of Liza, but things are what they are. Last year was her year, but this year was not. Because of the terrorist attacks in France she did not have an opportunity to redeem herself after a flawed short program and she missed GPF. The thing is a skater should can't dig a hole in the short with plans of digging out in the long when they have a strong field of competitors in front of them. Gracie and Ashley do this too and they need to stop. I would love to see Liza on Russia's World team. We will see what happens, but Liza very likely will not be there. I don't think Liza is a failure because of this year. I think so much went into last year that she may Not have had anything left for this year. Skating is about peaks and valleys. Ups and downs. All skaters no matter how great will go through it. Yulia is going through it. Mao is going through it. Elena is going through it. Heck Evgenia will likely go through it.

exactly. Can't people understand liza skated in 13 comps last season? I think the girl deserves a REST,but with all the great talent in Russia she can't afford that.

 

[lavoix]

I get the feeling the person who hasn't watched Anna in the last 3 years is you. There's no denying she has her up's and down's, but she had way more than "2 lucky skates". She made the GPF in her first senior season and was 4th at her first world championships in 2014 - and arguably should have been 3rd. She had awesome skates in Skate Canada 2014 and again made the GPF that year. And this season, she had a clean competition at Mordovian Ornament already additionally to nationals. She's "hit or miss", like honestly quite a lot of skaters, even really great skaters, but she's very far from just "2 lucky skates".

But those are just a few highlights here and there! I just don't get her skating, it has no message! I'd rather see a graceful Yulia rather than a falling Anna (and you have to admit that in the last 2 seasons she has fallen at the worst possible times).

 

[Ophelia]

Anna's falls are a spectacle in of themselves and more interesting to watch than some skaters clean programs.

 

[moriel]

4CC was established to allow skaters from non-European counties the opportunity at a competition similar to Europeans where they are not eligible to compete. These competitions count point wise in terms of world ranking scores and skaters from transcontinental counties should not be afforded more point scoring opportunities than skaters from non-transcontinental counties.

Besides, even if ISU did this, people would still find a reason to gripe because maybe their favorite was at 4CC instead of Europeans or their favorite did not make Worlds. Russia has fielded a great team for Europeans, that will in all likelihood sweep for the second year in a row, and will likely field a great team for Worlds, which will likely get at least two of the three podiums with Medvedeva and Radionova, but instead of appreciating this people are focused on their favorite not being able to compete.

Well, still it would make people way happier than it is now - well, at least, i'd basically love to see my left out favorites to compete in first place.
As for non european countries, well... Russia is located both in europe and not in europe, so technically qualifies for both =D

As for the sweep... I'm not a all russian ladies fan, as i guess most fans arent. They actaully care about what russian ladies are on podium, not the sheer number of medal they bring home. I guess this is why people dont appreciate a potential russian sweep - they arent russian fed to appreciate it, they ae fans of specific skaters =D

 

[moriel]

But those are just a few highlights here and there! I just don't get her skating, it has no message! I'd rather see a graceful Yulia rather than a falling Anna (and you have to admit that in the last 2 seasons she has fallen at the worst possible times).

Well, you should compare comparable things. Yulia is graceful when she is on, but when she is not (as she was not on most of this seasons)...
Equally, a clean Anna is better to watch than a meltdown Yulia (and you have to admit that in the last 2 seasons she probably did't skate a decent FS even one).

 

[RemyRose]

Anna's falls are a spectacle in of themselves and more interesting to watch than some skaters clean programs.

Very true!