- Joined
- Jul 9, 2014
No, it just seems to be solid fact that US ladies skaters are tremendously inconsistent.
Except Bradie. That young woman is a rock.
2018-19 U.S. Ladies' figure skating
- Thread starter Spirals for Miles
- Start date
Except Bradie. That young woman is a rock.
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2017
And Alysa
Speaking of which, next year it will be great to see Alysa on the JGP. Hopefully she can qualify for and do well at the JGPF.
No, it just seems to be solid fact that US ladies skaters are tremendously inconsistent.
Meh. She’s a product of a completely unproductive system that leaves talented skaters woefully underprepared for high level competitions. I have watched club competitions for year and followed so many juniors, including Ting. And the same thing is true. Any novice or junior skater can make any club competition, regional, sectional, or national competition even with a lower difficulty or mistakes. You can hit the podium with no triple triple as long as your artistic. You can bomb your short and still make the podium. You can pop a jump and make the podium. These aren’t fatal problems, just things skaters can brush off.
Now at the junior level, that won’t work. You must be perfect to even get on the podium. Our skaters aren’t used to that. So when they head to the JGP, suddenly they become super conscious of everything. And it terrifies them.
That’s not the case for Russian juniors, who can’t even get a JGP a lot unless they’re perfect. It’s not the case for Korean skaters, who have a three way tie at the top and therefore a strong rival that forces them to improve. We have talented juniors that not only aren’t challenged much before sent abroad, but also deal with lax tech controllers and over eager judges that will ignore underrotations and edge calls and puff of PCS scores. And this is the result.
I seen this so many times with US skaters. Great SP, then bombs the FS. Because they’re so happy to be clean that it freaks them out for the FS. If they had deeper competitions where they got used to skating with that amount of pressure and need more clean programs, this would be a different result all together.
Ting came out of now where last year. She nabbed a JGP slot based on her novice silver. Her score at JW wasn’t just a PB at the international level, but EVERY level. Including club and qualifying scores. That was her best competition she ever skated, and I believe she performed so well because she believed we would lose the second JW spot if she didn’t.
It’s going to take some time and lots of international experience to fix this problem. She has to get used to skating clean for both the short and the long. She has to learn to deal with the pressure. She’s still young and her technique is strong. I believe if she gets more competition under her belt she will finally overcome it.
But what does that mean for other US juniors? Well, I am less optimistic about the program they’re instituting. Camps can’t solve inconsistency. Only competition can do that. Without national championships, there is no winner takes all situation that will challenge them. And allowing them to bypass regionals by letting them go to local competitions is a terrible idea. There a lot of local politics that will allow kids to find favorable judges to boost up their scores. The real preparation for international competition is traveling, being challenged, and dealing with nerves. If it weren’t for the NA Challenger series I would worry that it would create even more marshmallows that can’t handle a little pressure.
I desperately want a junior test skate for qualifying for slots. Yelim had to do this and prove that she was physically and mentally prepared for the season. We use club competitions from different places for that information. Often the girls are skating senior not junior. The junior programs are shorter and often have different layouts. It means girls may be doing their junior FS for the first time right at the JGP! It’s obvious why Ting would skate a SP and not a clean FS, as SP are the same length for juniors and seniors.
Imagine if Ting has skater her junior program three or more times before going to the JGP. That would’ve improved her muscle memory. She would’ve been more confident because she wouldn’t have to think about her layout or any of the changes. But she didn’t. So when she was faced with the knowledge that she needed to be perfect with a program that she wasn’t fully accostumbed too? She folded.
It’s ok. She can focus on improving herself by training with Young and Yelim. With time she will overcome this.
But USFS? This is all on them. You can not produce skaters who are technically strong and hope that’s enough. It does not work.
Let’s not throw out the baby with the bath water. Very disheartened by Ting’s performance but at least she has shown that she is capable to throw down at least one program. She has the technical goods, skating skills, and performance qualities to win and she just turned 16! She also just switch coaches this year so that also takes fine to adjust (Marin cough cough). I agree with everyone that the fed needs to fix the infrastructure for more domestic competitions for our juniors... and frankly... our seniors too.
Oh, my not. I’m just have clearly a lot of pent up frustration with USFS. Sorry for the dissertation post.
I think Ting is amazing and has tons of potential. If she gets used to hearing that SP score, she’ll do fine later on during the season. She just needs more experience.
As for the seniors, that’s a whole other rant. I’m keeping it to one a day.
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2017
usually skater who inconsistent do 1 bad program, bad SP and good FS or good SP and bad FS. Ting does that a lot, also Ashley Wagner, Angela Wang, Mirai sometimes etc.
It's a bit frustrating that over the last decade the most consistent US Ladies have been the ones that maybe were not the most talented. You had Rachael Flatt who was never going to win a world championship also you had Samantha Cesario who hardly ever fell but was limited technically in her skating. Bradie is bit more talented but not as physically gifted as someone like Gracie who was the one US lady that didn't need help to win if she skated clean.
That's actual pretty common. It's only in this quad you have to be perfect to get a medal. During 2010-2014 quad you could get on the podium with fall in the short or long. It's taking our ladies a lot of time to get used to this change.
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2016
I agree that the new system where you can bypass regionals if you do well at club competitions is not good. As you said, skaters need to be in pressure situations often to skate clean often. Take a Japanese skater, Rika Kihira for example. Last season the competitions she did best at were the ones that were close together AKA she had been competing a lot. To make it more clear let me explain. Rika's season went like this:
JGP( very shaky short!! recovered in long)
*break competing*
JGP(good short, shaky, shaky long)
regionals (better than jgps-good!)
sectionals(good)
junior nationals(pretty good!)
JAPAN SR NATIONALS (Really good!)
JGPF(Very good)
*LONG BREAK BEFORE JR WORLDS*
Jr worlds( lowest scores of season by far)
notice: her best competitions, Japanese nationals, and JGPF happened after she competed three times fairly close together. By nats and JGPF she had gotten more accustomed to the adrenaline. Then she took a long break and competed at Jr worlds. By this time she had already "forgotten" in a way how to deal with these nerves.
Rika is just a random example I thought of but ofc so many Russian and Japanese skaters prove the same.
More pressure competitons=more consistency. USFSA seems to be taking away the pressure competitions from their best skaters. Essentially then, our top novice will only get a chance at a high-pressure event ONCE at sectionals. Our top juniors will only get it at sectionals and then AT THE JGPS. This isn't the way to go imo.
JGP( very shaky short!! recovered in long)
*break competing*
JGP(good short, shaky, shaky long)
regionals (better than jgps-good!)
sectionals(good)
junior nationals(pretty good!)
JAPAN SR NATIONALS (Really good!)
JGPF(Very good)
*LONG BREAK BEFORE JR WORLDS*
Jr worlds( lowest scores of season by far)
notice: her best competitions, Japanese nationals, and JGPF happened after she competed three times fairly close together. By nats and JGPF she had gotten more accustomed to the adrenaline. Then she took a long break and competed at Jr worlds. By this time she had already "forgotten" in a way how to deal with these nerves.
Rika is just a random example I thought of but ofc so many Russian and Japanese skaters prove the same.
More pressure competitons=more consistency. USFSA seems to be taking away the pressure competitions from their best skaters. Essentially then, our top novice will only get a chance at a high-pressure event ONCE at sectionals. Our top juniors will only get it at sectionals and then AT THE JGPS. This isn't the way to go imo.
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2017
yeah i know, back then a skater who placed 10th in short can even win the event. i think back then its rare for skater to be so consistent like now putting solid 2 programs in 4-5 event all season.
Actually, Rika had a blade issue at the FS. But the rest of your post is correct. Skaters that are challenged more and skate more often are better at competitions. Bradie was the same way last year. It's frustrating that USFS can't see how having better competition would completely change how our skaters think and handle pressure.
Top scoring novices will go to North American challenge competitions during the summer. And theirs the US Novice and Junior challenge skate for domestic novices. But no nationals. I think it will make skaters race to qualify for novice skate but they will lack the competitive experience to handle the pressure.
I guess sending the top novices from sectionals to junior nationals is suppose to help. But I worry that won't be enough.
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2016
Can anyone link me the page where USFSA explains the new system next year having to do with Regionals-Nationals? I am trying to find it and can't seem to. Thanks in advance.
Here's the PowerPoint.
http://www.usfigureskating.org/content/Competitions%20Task%20Force%20-%20PP%20Presentation.pdf
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2016
Thank you so much!
She had no pressure and no expectations. The last two seasons were a completely different story. Even earlier this season she was pretty inconsistent at her club comps and her junior comp at Asian Open. If the expectations rise, it'll be harder for her to overcome.
And Alysa
Speaking of which, next year it will be great to see Alysa on the JGP. Hopefully she can qualify for and do well at the JGPF.
I agree. I would be shocked if Bradie and Alysa don't go 1, 2 at Nationals. Alysa could win but her PCS will be lowballed since she cannot even go to Junior Worlds till 2020.
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2009
I have an irrational need for Mirai to bookend her first national's gold medal in 2008. She was the youngest lady to win Nationals in, what 50 years? I always wanted her to do it again.
She had so many other so-close but not quite moments
In 2010, her Carmen got 2nd behind Rachel Flatt for some reason???
then 2nd again Miss Saigon at 2018 Nationals
I would love for Mirai to come back and get the National's gold again. It would be a storybook last competitive performance.
Is Mirai even training anywhere under a coach?
She hasn't said she's coming back for Nationals 2019, and if she's not training for it, I can't see her just showing up willy-nilly and winning---that happens only in the movies.
At 2018 Nationals, when a determined Mirai was training heavily day in and day out, she couldn't beat a revitalized Bradie Tennell, who'd finished 9th at 2017 Nationals. And Mirai didn't beat Bradie at Olympics or Worlds, either.
A year later and Mirai has been away from figure skating pursuing red carpet celebrity post 2018 Worlds, while Bradie has been upping her technical and performance skills.
It may be fun to dream about Mirai returning to claim US gold, but the reality is it takes more than just a dream. Mirai put in a lot of work last year to get to the top, and almost made it, but it seems as if she just stopped at that point. Other skaters, not just Bradie, are putting in the time and energy it takes not only to get as high as they can go, and once they get there, to stay there.
Mariah Bell will be replacing Gabby Daleman at the Japan Open next week.
http://www.tv-tokyo.co.jp/japanopen2018/skater.html
http://www.tv-tokyo.co.jp/japanopen2018/skater.html
