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- Sep 8, 2016
Will the entire junior team consist of Eteri girls, or will the federation not do that? This year, what if they don’t have a choice?
2018-19 Russian Ladies' figure skating
- Thread starter Spirals for Miles
- Start date
- Joined
- Jan 12, 2018
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2017
[emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23]Well, they asked for Sambo's second rink. Cheapest solution?[emoji317]
- Joined
- Jun 27, 2012
Alexei Mishin: Those Who Can’t Show The Power Of The Jump, They Fetish Steps Before The Jump
https://fs-gossips.com/alexei-mishi...f-the-jump-they-fetish-steps-before-the-jump/ - very interesting
https://fs-gossips.com/alexei-mishi...f-the-jump-they-fetish-steps-before-the-jump/ - very interesting
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- Jan 12, 2018
"If you compare Liza’s jumps and her rival’s (Miyahara), then she should get one, or even two points more. How can they get the same bonuses? So she (Miyahara) should get at least 7 points less in technique."
:thumbsup:
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2018
Who am I to disagree with Mishin, but well I disagree. Liza’s setups before jumps are noticeable to me as a new fan and distract from the program. It feels like she is putting the program on hold to prepare for a jump. I’m not sure but maybe a good choreographer could time the music to make this less noticeable? Zagitova is an excellent jumper and her programs don’t have this problem before jumps.
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- Aug 25, 2017
But it does feel like Liza is the only one that is getting punished for long jump set-ups, so I'd rather see them not punish her than only punish her.
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- Jun 27, 2012
Did you read the whole article?
" If we continue to talk about transitions into jumps, many skaters having a bad double axel start to make a spread eagle before it. This is done in order to hide the low quality of axel. And all these transitions help the athlete to make a small jump, not a big and chic one."
"There’s also an artistic value in a powerful run-up before the jump. It happens that a skater makes a chic spread eagle and a chic triple axel after it, but in many cases people just hide the poor quality of the jump with such approach."
"Those who can not show the power of the jump, they fetish steps before the jump. But the jumps don’t turn out so bright."
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2018
Yes, which is why I used Zagitova to counter. She does very powerful run-ups before the jump and the jumps are still great, its not hiding anything. I mean, I get if Mishin is criticizing Satoko. But that to me was more about her home field advantage. Although Liza's jumps didn't received what they deserved this time around and scores should hopefully increase, but I can see why she wouldn't get as good scores as someone like Zagitova who has more complicated and powerful setups.
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- Feb 17, 2010
I think he said at the end that students of Eteri were the exception to this and could still perform high quality elements and difficult transitions but may be wrong due to the translation.
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- Apr 20, 2018
Thanks I see that now. The translation was worded in a confusing way but I get it now.
When Kostner did jump setups that were much longer than Liza's (well, maybe except for the 3A one, which is indeed LONG), people were screaming in extasy how artistic and beautiful is to spend 20% of your program on jump setups.
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- Mar 26, 2014
That's because Kostner is supposedly an outstanding artist and Liza is not. Quod licet Jovi, non licet bovi....
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- Jan 25, 2013
Liza's technique is textbook on many of her jumps, but yes the telegraphing is obvious - especially obvious with her triple axel. And not all of Liza's jumps are textbook execution every time (for example her 3S with the lean -- and on her 2A+3T the 3T looked UR). People can complain about an extra half turn on a spin, but the reality is all skaters make small errors here and there that cost levels. Miyahara still got several tech calls, including edge calls on her lutzes (which is rare) and URs, her StSq was called level 3 while Liza's was called level 4, so it's not like she was handed the silver and Liza didn't get any generosity herself.
Also, it is painfully obvious that Satoko's free program is fundamentally/choreographically/artistically better than Liza, including things like spins (I would barely classify Liza's LSp as even sideways leaning - IMO, it's an upright spin and getting +3s for that spin is ridiculous). Judge 2's scores were ridiculously generous and I don't have to even look to see which country that's from... (edit: I did - it's everyone's fave, Alla Shekhovtsova!)
If Miyahara should be 7 points behind Tukt on technique as was suggested, she should be 10 points ahead of Tukt on presentation/artistry.
- Joined
- May 11, 2018
I don't see why they wouldn't do that. Sasha, Anna, and Alena will likely sweep the JGP podium and the Rusnats junior podium. Sasha might even win seniors, realistically Alena and Anna have good chances to get on the podium there too. Yes, all three are Eteri girls but they're the strongest girls in the field right now. It doesn't make sense to me why those three wouldn't get sent to junior worlds.
Especially when they can give everyone a run for their money and let the know what's going to hit them next season
- Joined
- Mar 23, 2014
I like a long glide into a 3Lz even if it's too "simple."
I don't mind long jump set-ups that are still well-integrated choreographically and musically.
Agree that there is currently too much focus on transitions into jumps rather than the jump quality - but Eteri is partially responsible for that. While Alina and the junior AAAs are better jumpers than, say, Evgenia, they would probably have improved jump quality with fewer transitions. OR their jumps would be of the same quality but would receive less GOE due to the lack of difficult entry/exit. Evgenia probably benefited the most from difficult transitions into jumps helping her GOE. And Evgenia was incredibly successful - now people are trying to follow Eteri's style, with lots of transitions into and out of jumps.
I have to agree with CSG that while Satoko probably deserved significantly fewer points on jumps than Liza, then Liza deserved significantly fewer points on spins and most PCS categories.
Either way - the scores balance out to being relatively similar to each other, as happened at NHK. When there's less than one point between two placements it's basically a fluke who winds up winning. I think the judges overscored Satoko on jumps and overscored Liza on spins. I think the PCS were about right - I love Liza, but the amount of two-foot skating she does kills me, and she doesn't do much with her edges, either. The program is choreographically simple compared to others, as well, though she interprets and performs it very well. I would be curious to see how Liza's programs compare to others in terms of speed/ice coverage. It's obviously difficult to tell from normal camera angles.
- Joined
- Dec 29, 2013
I think pretty much everyone sees this. What I don’t think people agree on is to what degree. I personally don’t think they balance out. In fact I’d probably give about a 5-10 pt advantage to Liza when considering the total score over two programs. To be more clear what I would remove from Liza’s PCS would be less than what I would take from Satokos TES. I understand this isn’t how judging works so this is just for the sake of discussion this is only my scorecard ...... I realize that. I don’t think it’s unfair and certainly wouldn’t consider it hate. I’m fine with Satoko getting some of the highest PCS and she has several programs high on my favorites list. That doesn’t mean I think she should be so far ahead with PCS in the FS over someone like Liza that Liza’s jumps can’t trump it. I actually think Satoko’s presentation and overall impression is harmed by her jumps the same as I think Liza’s Jumps improve her impression. YMMV
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
Same. I think Satoko and Liza's presentation skills are miles apart. I think Liza's PCS is maybe slightly inflated, but she regularly loses in PCS against better skaters and even good first year seniors, and is always comfortably behind Satoko as she should be. On the jumps, I think they are miles apart, too. Any judge that gives Satoko and Liza the same marks for a clean jump isn't looking enough at the quality of the underlying jump element, IMO. A long entrance doesn't make a good jump mediocre, and a difficult entrance doesn't make a subpar jump ok, but that's how the scores are looking this season. I believe Liza would have come in 2nd if this competition took place anywhere other than Japan, and we always have to accept home cooking as part of the scores. At the end of the day, coming in 2nd instead of 3rd at a GP doesn't matter, especially since Liza will make the GPF anyway.
- Joined
- Dec 29, 2013
I’ve noticed that 5th Element is on TV all the time now at least here in the US. Has anyone else been watching it or finding it on TV a lot recently? I’m so glad Sasha took on this program! It’s such a perfect fit 
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bo9CfdDAQP1/
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bo9CfdDAQP1/
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