2018-19 Russian Ladies' figure skating | Page 651 | Golden Skate

2018-19 Russian Ladies' figure skating

DenissVFan said:
I think Alena has a realistic shot at winning RusNats and I'm going to put her first in the prediction game.
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Never!

Alina has clearly been Russia's best lady (=they will not lower her scores because of politicking and whatever, if anything she gets overscored), she got ~9pcs even at GPF with nervous performances AND competes a higher BV compared to Alena. This year, they will not give a 'junior skater' the PCS of the OGM and no1 of the russian team, no matter if she deserves it or not.

Alena needs to be clean and Alina, Trusova (and Shcherbakova?) to make major mistakes to get gold. (a 3-1 cascade, 2-3 UR's or one 4Lz fall is not enough)

Hopefully Zhenya is in a better mood. Grenoble was sad to watch, and tbh if Alena gets lower PCS than a Zhenya that does not even try to portray anything at all I'll get salty after all :)
 
DenissVFan said:
I think Alena has a realistic shot at winning RusNats and I'm going to put her first in the prediction game.
Click to expand...

I'm more of "traditional" and will have Alina and Evgenia in 1st and 2nd with 60%, 40% probability. Alexandra, Alena for bronze and Sofia for 4th,5th :biggrin:
 
Tolstoj said:
Agreed with him.

1) Yes of course she is better right now, the difference in the season was very clear. We'll see in the future.

2) I think so, Samodurova deserves more love from the Federation now, considering she is probably the most consistent skater this season in seniors. She's a perfect backup plan in case Zagitova, Tuktamysheva (she is very consistent this season though) or Medvedeva/Konstantinova have one of their bad days.

3) Yes, Trusova and Kostornaia will have their chance in seniors next season, they should stay in juniors up until JW.
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I think some people really don't get how things work.

But lets go. Lets look at Oleg's quote, first:
"There is no meaning in letting both Kostornaia and Trusova compete at senior Russian nationals. I enjoy Kostornaia, I somewhat enjoy Trusova, but they are not yet part of senior skating, I do not understand the meaning of allowing them to compete at senior championship. For what? To worry the girls that can compete? There are already enough good things done to the junior girls, they should let them grow, and then they will fight with the ones who grew up enough for the senior level".

Every word of what you just said.. was wrong.
Lets explain the meaning, for dummies. Competing at senior nationals is good for juniors, and the whole point of this it to allow them and their teams to compare them with the senior ladies at same competition and same judging, to make clear how they fare, and what they need to improve. Also, competing at senior nationals does not mean that they turn senior, or are pushed to seniors. They just compete at russian national championship (which is not even labeled as senior ^^).

Another reason is that, despite the depth of field, with seniors alone, Russia wouldn't have enough participants to have a decent bloodbath nationals. Note that, with the current lineup, 15 out of 18 ladies have SB above 180 points. 8 out of 18 - above 200.
Look at the previous nationals: same thing, 8 ladies scored over 200 and 14 scored over 180 at the actual nationals. Such high level of competition can only be achieved by including juniors. The competition is good for everybody, because we are talking about a sport here, and I mean, mr. Vasiliev can also ask Kihira to retire because she is worrying the other girls. While it is ood for juniors to have a realistic look on how they would stand against seniors, it is also useful to give the senior girls a sneak peek of what is coming next.

Third. I really want someone to explain me how Kostornaia's skating is juniorish. She skates with more maturity than most seniors, with all due respect. If it was just about skating, she could be skating at seniors already. Being 15 / 16 / 18 does not automatically add a +10 to performance, interpretation and all that stuff.

Finally, juniors have been competing at russian nationals since forever. Adelina Sotnikova won rusnats at 12. Kostornaia got bronze last year. Nobody complained.
 
moriel +1 I agree with every word!.
+ let's not forget about funding to the next season and selection the national team.
 
moriel said:
I think some people really don't get how things work.

But lets go. Lets look at Oleg's quote, first:
"There is no meaning in letting both Kostornaia and Trusova compete at senior Russian nationals. I enjoy Kostornaia, I somewhat enjoy Trusova, but they are not yet part of senior skating, I do not understand the meaning of allowing them to compete at senior championship. For what? To worry the girls that can compete? There are already enough good things done to the junior girls, they should let them grow, and then they will fight with the ones who grew up enough for the senior level".

Every word of what you just said.. was wrong.
Lets explain the meaning, for dummies. Competing at senior nationals is good for juniors, and the whole point of this it to allow them and their teams to compare them with the senior ladies at same competition and same judging, to make clear how they fare, and what they need to improve. Also, competing at senior nationals does not mean that they turn senior, or are pushed to seniors. They just compete at russian national championship (which is not even labeled as senior ^^).

Another reason is that, despite the depth of field, with seniors alone, Russia wouldn't have enough participants to have a decent bloodbath nationals. Note that, with the current lineup, 15 out of 18 ladies have SB above 180 points. 8 out of 18 - above 200.
Look at the previous nationals: same thing, 8 ladies scored over 200 and 14 scored over 180 at the actual nationals. Such high level of competition can only be achieved by including juniors. The competition is good for everybody, because we are talking about a sport here, and I mean, mr. Vasiliev can also ask Kihira to retire because she is worrying the other girls. While it is ood for juniors to have a realistic look on how they would stand against seniors, it is also useful to give the senior girls a sneak peek of what is coming next.

Third. I really want someone to explain me how Kostornaia's skating is juniorish. She skates with more maturity than most seniors, with all due respect. If it was just about skating, she could be skating at seniors already. Being 15 / 16 / 18 does not automatically add a +10 to performance, interpretation and all that stuff.

Finally, juniors have been competing at russian nationals since forever. Adelina Sotnikova won rusnats at 12. Kostornaia got bronze last year. Nobody complained.
Click to expand...

With seniors you'd have to allow Sakhanovich and few others that are currently out. Plus i think Russia should totally expand the number of participants anyway given the depth of the field.

Personally i'm conflicted about the idea of allowing junior skaters at senior nationals cause while yes it brings more competition, on the other hand it is pushing every year the idea that new fresh skaters are always better than those who try to compete for many years.

I'm not against it (i'm against the idea of sending Trusova or Kostornaya to senior worlds this year yes) but at the same time i understand where he's coming from.

Nobody complained when Sotnikova won rusnats because the level of seniors was soo weak they had to include juniors, especially cause those juniors were Russia's biggest hope for the Sochi Olympics. Now the situation is very different: you have great senior skaters who try to stay competitive but pretty sure this year Trusova and Kostornaia will take 2 out of 3 medals and the third one is probably Zagitova.

I disagree with those who say that an older skater is artistically better though, as proven many times in the past that's not always the case.
 
I don’t mind Juniors at RusNats but it absolutely adds chaos to the scoring. Skaters often get marks they are expected to receive that are a far greater reflection of politics than their skating. Just look at Gubanova’s scores last year. Masha was going to the Olympics and they weren’t about to let one of Angelina Turenko’s students get a better score let alone a Junior with only one JGP event. Masha pushed the panel’s patience and forgiveness to the brink but if we look at just the actual skating it’s hard not to see that Gubanova clearly beat her fair and square.
 
Arbitrary said:
Oleg Vasiliev (OGM in pars with Valova, and a coach now) shard his thoughts about the RusNats ladies.

1) Zagitova is better than Medvedeva now.
2) Samodurova may have a medal after Tukt withdraw.
3) There is no good reason to push Trusova and Kostornaya to Seniors.

The last he explained as those two are "not ready yet but may scare others". Let them grow up enough to participate as real Seniors and not as Juniors among Seniors.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87y8HV_rdws
(Russian only for now)
Click to expand...
This video - reading of article https://rsport.ria.ru/20181216/1548071887.html
Google translate is understandable.
 
Darya posted an IG story with the hashtag #teamtsareva but she's recently been spotted at CSKA. So is Tsareva at CSKA now or what is going on? I'm confused.
 
DenissVFan said:
Darya posted an IG story with the hashtag #teamtsareva but she's recently been spotted at CSKA. So is Tsareva at CSKA now or what is going on? I'm confused.
Click to expand...

Wow, now I'm confused :laugh:
I want Dasha to go to Davydov. So badly. It's why I was so happy when she was spotted there - Davydov is who she needs right now in my opinion. I still have reservations about Tsareva.
 
While I am familiar with all the girls at nationals, I haven't necessarily watched all of them (a lot, some if at all). With 2 days left I'm torn between watching videos of them too and learning more, or staying oblivious in case I find another girl I really like and make it even harder for me to watch the competition lol :scratch2: :laugh:
 
moriel said:
I think some people really don't get how things work.

But lets go. Lets look at Oleg's quote, first:
"There is no meaning in letting both Kostornaia and Trusova compete at senior Russian nationals. I enjoy Kostornaia, I somewhat enjoy Trusova, but they are not yet part of senior skating, I do not understand the meaning of allowing them to compete at senior championship. For what? To worry the girls that can compete? There are already enough good things done to the junior girls, they should let them grow, and then they will fight with the ones who grew up enough for the senior level".

Every word of what you just said.. was wrong.
Lets explain the meaning, for dummies. Competing at senior nationals is good for juniors, and the whole point of this it to allow them and their teams to compare them with the senior ladies at same competition and same judging, to make clear how they fare, and what they need to improve. Also, competing at senior nationals does not mean that they turn senior, or are pushed to seniors. They just compete at russian national championship (which is not even labeled as senior ^^).

Another reason is that, despite the depth of field, with seniors alone, Russia wouldn't have enough participants to have a decent bloodbath nationals. Note that, with the current lineup, 15 out of 18 ladies have SB above 180 points. 8 out of 18 - above 200.
Look at the previous nationals: same thing, 8 ladies scored over 200 and 14 scored over 180 at the actual nationals. Such high level of competition can only be achieved by including juniors. The competition is good for everybody, because we are talking about a sport here, and I mean, mr. Vasiliev can also ask Kihira to retire because she is worrying the other girls. While it is good for juniors to have a realistic look on how they would stand against seniors, it is also useful to give the senior girls a sneak peek of what is coming next.

Third. I really want someone to explain me how Kostornaia's skating is juniorish. She skates with more maturity than most seniors, with all due respect. If it was just about skating, she could be skating at seniors already. Being 15 / 16 / 18 does not automatically add a +10 to performance, interpretation and all that stuff.

Finally, juniors have been competing at russian nationals since forever. Adelina Sotnikova won rusnats at 12. Kostornaia got bronze last year. Nobody complained.
Click to expand...

How can he say they're too young at 14 and 15 years old to compete in Russian national seniors when Adelina Sotnikova at the tender age of 12 won Russian senior Nationals and went on to become Olympic champion? It's a shame there's such criticism and nitpicking in the Russian figure skating Community towards their own girls when these girls and women are carrying Russian figure skating while the other three disciplines remain mediocre by their high standards.
 
LenaRadiFan said:
Oh okay thank you ^^ Is he considered one of the better coaches at CSKA? I only know Buyanova and she's well nice but not really good
Click to expand...

I mean... in my opinion, he's the best one there - at least for ladies, the discipline I follow most.
 
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