- Joined
- Feb 27, 2014
But it would be fabtastic! C'mon Scott - Viva The Musketeerettes!
H@ll yes! The Three Musketeers!
2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating
- Thread starter Spirals for Miles
- Start date
H@ll yes! The Three Musketeers!
- Joined
- Jul 3, 2018
How so? Trusova got 4th place - above many others and with almost the same score as Valieva. What's wrong with her SS then?
SS is more than just speed and crossovers
Interesting analysis with the heat maps showing ice coverage, but I don’t think the results of the top 2 are surprising at all. Nastya Tarakanova and Kostornaia ahead of the pack as expected. I hope Kanysheva has programs that better showcase her SS next season. The chart is not an accurate representation of her abilities.
When Kostornaia takes to the ice for warm up-it is a sight to behold. She flys across the ice. Tarakanova as well. It is just a beautiful thing to behold.
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2006
YES!! Really, to understand when people talk about "Skating Skills" you first need to watch skating in person. I love going to events and just watching practices because the sound and sight of an expert skater with their blades is a near religious experience! I'm going to Skate America, and I've already seen Tuk live and she's unimpressive (like, without that 3axel she's not much of a "skater"). I really hope not to be disappointed seeing Scherbakova live....
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2006
I noticed that too. Are they great friends or something?If this is true, Alina and Aliona will be truly inseparable during the upcomming season
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
They seem to get along fine when we see them together but I don’t think they are BFFs or anything - Alina is close with Diana and Alena is close with Daria (the pairs skater). Remember, they have been competing against each other since the 2014-15 season at COR and other domestic events so even though they’ve only been training together since 2017/18 they’ve known each other for longer. So I’m sure they will get along just fine at all their events next season. They do have very different personalities, though - Alina being more introverted and Alena is known to be very chatty.
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2017
YES!! Really, to understand when people talk about "Skating Skills" you first need to watch skating in person. I love going to events and just watching practices because the sound and sight of an expert skater with their blades is a near religious experience! I'm going to Skate America, and I've already seen Tuk live and she's unimpressive (like, without that 3axel she's not much of a "skater"). I really hope not to be disappointed seeing Scherbakova live....
I'm sure you won't be. Anna may not have the SS, but her musicality is second to none and the performance will be mesmerizing as it already is on the screen.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2014
Soooooooooo true!
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2018
I assume because they wanted to limit travel for Eteri and eventually one of the 3A would likely have to face Alina (since it also doesn't make sense for Rusfed to put the first and third place from worlds in the same competition). It makes sense to pair her with Alena since she's the only one of the 3A without a quad to beat Alina's technical content and its probably assumed her PCS will take a while to rise in seniors.
- Joined
- Feb 18, 2019
True, but I think Trusova's skating skills are vastly underrated - in that people say they're terrible when they're really not. Gaining speed with a small amount of stroking/crossovers isn't all of skating skills, but its a major part of it. And Trusova is clearly able to gain speed from small amounts of stroking/crossovers. Her edges aren't the deepest in the field, but overall she doesn't have bad SS. Not as good as someone like Tarakanova or Kostornaya, but I don't think its as huge of an issue as some make it out to be.
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2018
Pasha Ternov is a very smart person and has a scientific method - he understands how to analyze information correctly, always provides a detailed description of his method, and most importantly, always provides the degree of accuracy of his methods and calculations. Like all scientists, he creates a model of reality. What he honestly warns and honestly talks about all the shortcomings of the methods.
But
But he always presents his final results in the form of beautiful tabs in which there is one number opposite the name of the skater. "Oh! Oh yes! That is clear to me". And people start to fight each other by this tabs - "my skater is on fifth place, and yours is only on the seventh, ha ha, you lost !!"
It's not even the point that these calculations are directly related to only one of the six SS criteria - "speed". Fundamental in the Pavel's calculations were the weights for the steps that he chose quite subjectively. What is he openly speaking about, in this honest passage in the section concerning Tarusina:
"Of course, if we replaced the coefficient for running steps by 1.5 (instead of 2.0), Tarusina’s shares would have grown, but I’m not really sure that 2.0 even is not too small. Maybe for the standard running steps you need to put even 3.0. After all, such a step consists of two accented pushes, while most of the remaining steps consist of one push from a less comfortable position."
But that's not all. There is still such a thing as "inaccuracy" (or "accuracy of calculations"). In his tabs, Pavel never writes accuracy (the average persone doesn't like such complexity). But in the texts always gives them. Example: Trusova has 4.71 +/- 0.19 acceleration. What it's mean? It's mean that her true value of acceleration with a probability of 67 % lies in the range 4.52 - 4.90. Look at the accuracy data to other skaters, look at the proximity of the number for most of them, think. And remember about this when you fight by this table "my figure skater better! No it's mine better!"
But
But he always presents his final results in the form of beautiful tabs in which there is one number opposite the name of the skater. "Oh! Oh yes! That is clear to me". And people start to fight each other by this tabs - "my skater is on fifth place, and yours is only on the seventh, ha ha, you lost !!"
It's not even the point that these calculations are directly related to only one of the six SS criteria - "speed". Fundamental in the Pavel's calculations were the weights for the steps that he chose quite subjectively. What is he openly speaking about, in this honest passage in the section concerning Tarusina:
"Of course, if we replaced the coefficient for running steps by 1.5 (instead of 2.0), Tarusina’s shares would have grown, but I’m not really sure that 2.0 even is not too small. Maybe for the standard running steps you need to put even 3.0. After all, such a step consists of two accented pushes, while most of the remaining steps consist of one push from a less comfortable position."
But that's not all. There is still such a thing as "inaccuracy" (or "accuracy of calculations"). In his tabs, Pavel never writes accuracy (the average persone doesn't like such complexity). But in the texts always gives them. Example: Trusova has 4.71 +/- 0.19 acceleration. What it's mean? It's mean that her true value of acceleration with a probability of 67 % lies in the range 4.52 - 4.90. Look at the accuracy data to other skaters, look at the proximity of the number for most of them, think. And remember about this when you fight by this table "my figure skater better! No it's mine better!"
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2017
I really hope not to be disappointed seeing Scherbakova live....
Actually I dare to not agree with this. Maybe it's unpopular opinion - but I think Anna has pretty good SS - just not in the usual set of values with which people are used to assess SS. While she is not having great speed, glide and flow - she has GREAT multidirectional skating, balance and one-foot skating. All of the above are good SS criterias as well. Can you say that it should have less weight then glide? No, you can't. Moreover, I strongly suspect that most skaters just aren't able to repeat any typical Anna's program skating ever - I mean skating just as she do it. Given huge amount of transitions she uses (which isn't part of SS - but related to it still - as well as to PCS) and very hard entries/exits from/to jumps, body movement and steps - it always gives me the impression as insanely difficult feat. Maybe it doesn't look as impressive to many people as long spirals across the rink - but it looks like that to me.
No. He meant not only speed but also - effortlessness, how easy you get the acceleration (which in turn related to quality of steps, glide, foot precision and balance too) and one of CO criterias - ice coverage. See - it's not only speed there, isn't it?
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2019
Thanks, Orlov.
Pavel's own VK page has more info still: https://vk.com/basevalue
Yes, I'd love to see a projection of the skater's movements vs speed and distance covered.
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2018
No. He meant not only speed but also - effortlessness, how easy you get the acceleration (which in turn related to quality of steps, glide, foot precision and balance too) and one of CO criterias - ice coverage. See - it's not only speed there, isn't it?
It's not even the point that these calculations are directly related to only one of the six SS criteria - "speed".
- Joined
- Jan 12, 2018
If this is true, Alina and Aliona will be truly inseparable during the upcomming season
Well I sure hope it's not true and at least one of my favourite skaters will come to Bratislava..
- Joined
- Jan 18, 2017
I'm going to Skate America, and I've already seen Tuk live and she's unimpressive (like, without that 3axel she's not much of a "skater"). I really hope not to be disappointed seeing Scherbakova live....
Even if you find some aspects of her skating that may let you down, I'm sure you will find some other that you will surprised with. And generally with all the top skaters.
The problem as I've always seen it is: Trusova has a masculine style. She reminds me of Nathan Chen. I kind of love that about her. You would think in our new 'woke' world, this would be ok, but apparently it isn't. She doesn't quite have the speed of Tarakanova or Kostornaya, but she is still in the speedy field. I'm not going to give Eteri credit for this, as it seems to be something Endemic to Russian figure skaters from an early age. Of course in Russia there are some huge ice rinks-maybe this accounts for the speed issue, even with the youngest skaters.
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2018
Full entries for JGP France:
http://www.isuresults.com/events/fsevent03111895.htm
From the first view it seems that Daria and (edited) Aliona should have easy way to podium, but reality can always be different.
http://www.isuresults.com/events/fsevent03111895.htm
From the first view it seems that Daria and (edited) Aliona should have easy way to podium, but reality can always be different.
