2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Edwin]

"Harmonica piece" is like 5 second in the beginning and the rest is HoTRS.

Can we expect a western (cowboy or perhaps better cowgirl ;-) themed routine from Tarakanova?

Once Upon a Time in the West and The Magnificent Seven are iconic westerns with very well known sound tracks, scenes and accompanying tunes.

I think a slightly 'cool masculine' type of routine will fit her athletism well. Anastasiya never looked like a girl for frilly dresses and barbie dolls, but rather riding horseback or a motorcycle.

 

[Vandevska]

Finally watched it, each program twice

In the order I watched:

Maya Khromykh
Nice axel, but weird lutz and almost ! edge. Clearly the Biellmann's not her strong point, lots of travelling. However, I find her appearance very balletic, especially her arm movements. She clearly listens to the music even though she's not very expressive yet.

Anna Frolova
She had a bit of a weird axel, and not a lot of height, especially in the combo. Lotsa travelling in the Biellmann too, and in the combo I spin (I think it's combo, but I haven't properly learnt the names of all spins yet). That spin-like feature in the STSQ was interesting.

Daria Usacheva
I found the program to be a bit boring tbh. The STSQ was iffy, though the Biellmann's superb obviously. Perhaps she's the "weak" link in the Tutberitze group this year.

Ksenia Sinitsyna
Her jumps are beautiful, but the lack of transitions in the combo was very noticeable. She has nice flow and speed, but I found some parts of the program weird, and generally there were too many of them for me to be able to be like "ah it's 1 weird thing, no big deal, it's basically in every program".

Aliona Kanysheva
Today she had the best showing imo. She's a lovely skater, definitely expect her to be the leaders with Valieva, and Tutberitze did a good job by accepting her. This program has just the right amount/type of mime I love

Anastasia Tarakanova
She's clearly a very talented skater. I'm not sure if I like the program, but her jumps have the potential to be the best. I liked the transition out of the combo. She just needs consistency, and by this I mean she needs to stay with one coach otherwise I can't see how can she progress. It's sad seeing such a talented skater "withering" for the wrong reasons.

Kamila Valieva
This was my favourite program last season, but today it felt like I was watching it at 1.25x speed and I didn't really enjoy that. Still a lovely skater, I think we'll see her flourish more once the season starts.

Victoria Vasilyeva
When Kill Bill started I face-palmed. For Sasha it was Kill Bill, but for her it's Kill Victoria. Like, how much do you actually want to be compared to another skater that you'll probably never caught up with, that had a very memorable program (even if it's just for the quads). Davidov made a poor decision imo.

I congratulate Panova on catching up with the modern times. I believe that her group is/will be even more/ part of #ForProgress movement too. Success doesn't come over night, I wish her fruitful work.

Of course, to Team Tutberitze and Davidov too.

 

[Watch]

Till now she is taken as the most serious opponent to the russian girls, deservedly or not, and Kamila is taken (or was) as the best of the upcoming russian juniors. Therefore there were talks about their competition in JGPF, that's the "clash", not Lake Placid. Those objections appeared quite suddenly, through the last season Kamila was the one pre-junior with hundreds of thousands of views of her skating (who in her age can talk about it) and hardly anyone had an objection about it (apart from "losing her lutz", which was disproved easily). Now it is about "being hectic", "not my taste" and all, while there was only a handful people talking about Daria at all (mostly about her inconsistency) and suddely she one. I'm still not used to those changes of moods of the crowd.

That's what always comes with being the recognized favourite, though. People start scrutinizing you a lot more because there's a certain level of expectations, some of which are going to be unrealistic. It's exactly the same mechanics as when you're watching a good movie you haven't heard much about vs a good movie everyone has told you beforehand is supposed to be masterpiece. In the second case, chances are that even if the movie is great, you'll be wondering: "Ok, but is it really THAT great for everyone to be raving about? What about this and that flaw? This could've been done better, and there's that other movie that did it better but no one's hyping it up that much" and so on.

Bottom line, it's always easier to be blown away by something that you didn't expect to be amazing than by something where you come in with a lot of expectations. It colours your perception.

 

[Vandevska]

https://tass.ru/sport/6734918
New interview of Alyona Kanysheva:
she changed the attitude to her skating, she says psychologically it's easier for her to skate now
decided not to include 4T in the coming season, the strategy is to go clean with triples
she's a straight A student, her parents told her if her marks will go down, there would be no figure skating

https://rsport.ria.ru/20190805/1557187170.html
Interview of Kamila:
plans to include 4T, is also learning 4s and 3a
she's fully recovered after her injury last season
Didn't expect Shoma's so short

 

[Yuna Luna]

First of all, wow! Kamila’s skating is absolutely gorgeous, but I agree that she she could use some development where musicality is concerned (but that’s totally okay for someone who has never competed on the international level before) for the reasons mentioned; I also noticed last season that she is sometimes a little off her music / not quite hitting the musical cues on time, but again, she’s so young.

Kamila, to me, seems similar to Alyona - another beautiful skater - in that neither have perfectly refined musicality like Anna Shcherbakova (but Anna is a phenom in this department so I don’t think anyone can compare) but both have very artistic, emotional skating and highly developed skating skills. Because I consider artistry a little bit distinct from musicality, I would say that Kamila has incredibly strong artistry (she can skate so beautifully to a concept as abstract as a painting) with room for improvement in her musicality.

I think Kamila is a much stronger skater than Alysa Liu and I don’t imagine she will have much trouble making JGPF. Even if she doesn’t show us quads in the test skates, it’s so early in the season and there are plenty of opportunities to introduce difficult elements before JGPF rolls around. In my opinion, Kamila has the best shot at being the next junior star.

 

[flanker]

That's what always comes with being the recognized favourite, though. People start scrutinizing you a lot more because there's a certain level of expectations, some of which are going to be unrealistic. It's exactly the same mechanics as when you're watching a good movie you haven't heard much about vs a good movie everyone has told you beforehand is supposed to be masterpiece. In the second case, chances are that even if the movie is great, you'll be wondering: "Ok, but is it really THAT great for everyone to be raving about? What about this and that flaw? This could've been done better, and there's that other movie that did it better but no one's hyping it up that much" and so on.

Bottom line, it's always easier to be blown away by something that you didn't expect to be amazing than by something where you come in with a lot of expectations. It colours your perception.

Not completely right, at least the second point. It's not like people who has never seen Kamila are disappointed when they finally saw her, those are people who knew her and have seen her program(s). They knew what they are buying. And about being recognized favourite - maybe it could be applied if it would come "from above" (like she would have been presented by skating federation etc.), but those were again people, users, who spoke highly about her (and her SP) after they saw her skating and suddenly (nearly miraculously) became critical. I remember that it was nearly needed to defend Daria and Maya on the matters of performance and consistency ("of those three at least Maya and Daria don't seem to me as strong as 3A" - this was quite frequented opinion), while now it's the opposite. Those are shifts in judgement within some groups of fans that I don't understrand.

 

[Edwin]

LOL indeed. Kanyshek has grown tall and willowy, perhaps she is the same height now as Shoma?

 

[theharleyquinn]

First of all, wow! Kamila’s skating is absolutely gorgeous, but I agree that she she could use some development where musicality is concerned (but that’s totally okay for someone who has never competed on the international level before) for the reasons mentioned; I also noticed last season that she is sometimes a little off her music / not quite hitting the musical cues on time, but again, she’s so young.

Kamila, to me, seems similar to Alyona - another beautiful skater - in that neither have perfectly refined musicality like Anna Shcherbakova (but Anna is a phenom in this department so I don’t think anyone can compare) but both have very artistic, emotional skating and highly developed skating skills. Because I consider artistry a little bit distinct from musicality, I would say that Kamila has incredibly strong artistry (she can skate so beautifully to a concept as abstract as a painting) with room for improvement in her musicality.

I think Kamila is a much stronger skater than Alysa Liu and I don’t imagine she will have much trouble making JGPF. Even if she doesn’t show us quads in the test skates, it’s so early in the season and there are plenty of opportunities to introduce difficult elements before JGPF rolls around. In my opinion, Kamila has the best shot at being the next junior star.

You're one of the first people I've seen that's put Anna's artistry over Alena's. I can't quite say I agree, but I think it's an interesting take that's probably defensible.

 

[Vandevska]

Not completely right, at least the second point. It's not like people who has never seen Kamila are disappointed when they finally saw her, those are people who knew her and have seen her program(s). They knew what they are buying. And about being recognized favourite - maybe it could be applied if it would come "from above" (like she would have been presented by skating federation etc.), but those were again people, users, who spoke highly about her (and her SP) after they saw her skating and suddenly (nearly miraculously) became critical. I remember that it was nearly needed to defend Daria and Maya on the matters of performance and consistency ("of those three at least Maya and Daria don't seem to me as strong as 3A" - this was quite frequented opinion), while now it's the opposite. Those are shifts in judgement within some groups of fans that I don't understrand.

Ummm the SP looked a bit different too though? Obviously they needed to to change the flip to a loop, but compare today with this masterpiece: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2XVuXxIyqE

It's what we see, it's right there. And as others said, for sure it's because she was nervous, which is understandable seeing as how hyped she is.

I don't agree about Daria being better though.

- - - Updated - - -

LOL indeed. Kanyshek has grown tall and willowy, perhaps she is the same height now as Shoma?

Maaaaaaybe

 

[Watch]

Not completely right, at least the second point. It's not like people who has never seen Kamila are disappointed when they finally saw her, those are people who knew her and have seen her program(s). They knew what they are buying. And about being recognized favourite - maybe it could be applied if it would come "from above" (like she would have been presented by skating federation etc.), but those were again people, users, who spoke highly about her (and her SP) after they saw her skating and suddenly (nearly miraculously) became critical. I remember that it was nearly needed to defend Daria and Maya on the matters of performance and consistency ("of those three at least Maya and Daria don't seem to me as strong as 3A" - this was quite frequented opinion), while now it's the opposite. Those are shifts in judgement within some groups of fans that I don't understrand.

It's still a bit of the same effect, because when it comes to people here, we know Kamila's program pretty well at this point and it got praised to high heavens for months (deservedly, I might add, it's absolutely perfect to highlight her strength) - which means praising the program again today might feel redundant for most here. And we've seen her skate it to near perfection before - which means every little flaw in today's skate sticks out. And that's pretty much all there is to it. People who know her and liked her from the last season, also have very high expectations and know exactly how well she skated the same program before, so that also colours their perception and leads to nitpicking. And anyway, I haven't seen anyone rip into Kamila's performance today, just a few noting that she wasn't as on point as she could be.

 

[Fluture]

Till now she is taken as the most serious opponent to the russian girls, deservedly or not, and Kamila is taken (or was) as the best of the upcoming russian juniors. Therefore there were talks about their competition in JGPF, that's the "clash", not Lake Placid. Those objections appeared quite suddenly, through the last season Kamila was the one pre-junior with hundreds of thousands of views of her skating (who in her age can talk about it) and hardly anyone had an objection about it (apart from "losing her lutz", which was disproved easily). Now it is about "being hectic", "not my taste" and all, while there was only a handful people talking about Daria at all (mostly about her inconsistency) and suddely she one. I'm still not used to those changes of moods of the crowd.

I just don't get why you always want to see everything as "everyone against the Russian girls". Most on in this forum are skating fans first and foremost. And they judge and discuss what they see. I do not deny that there are some who only want their own girls to win (we have had some pop up in this thread once or twice) but mostly, people that post in here are at least interested in the Russian ladies, if not outright fans of them. The "objections" as you call them that "appeared quite suddenly" aren't objections against Kamila at all, you just choose to see it that way. We all knew Kamila before, exactly because she was the most well-known pre-junior. Because she was so good. People also knew this program before and that's why they have expectations. Personally, I consider this SP an absolute masterpiece simply because I think that the whole concept and idea are absolutely unique. I have never seen something like that in skating before and it fascinated me the first time I saw it. Today Kamila performed the program differently than before. Maybe they made some changes to the choreography that didn't appeal to me, I don't know. I just know that I've always had a bit of a problem with some (!!!) of her movements as they did seem hectic to me. But today it was worse than before, that's why I commented on it. This doesn't mean that I changed my opinion on her. I still recognize her as the talent she is with all the great qualities that make her absolutely unique. But this program today showed me that she has indeed more things to work on than I initially thought. Overall, though, I don't see what there is to get used to to "changes of moods of the crowd". People change their opinions all the time. Compare your first posts on this forum to the ones you make now. I can only speak for myself but mine change all the time as I learn more about this sport and its rules. Maybe today people saw Kamila and Daria after another and Daria's skating appealed more to them. Maybe tomorrow it will be different. I don't see a big deal in that. And I certainly don't see any conspiracies about those users secretly only wanting Alysa to win. Especially not if a few days ago there was quite a thorough discussion on Alysa vs. the Russians and the general consensus was that the Russians (this time around it were Tarakanova and Sinitsyna) were superior in most aspects. But you have a right to your opinion, of course. It just annoys me a bit because frankly, I couldn't care less if those girls were from Russia or Canada or the US. If they have something special and draw me in, I become a fan. Regardless of their nationality.

As for Maya vs. Kamila vs. Daria. I frankly don't have a favourite as of right now. They're all very good but they're yet to touch me with their skating. I think they all have huge potential but at the moment, I really can't say whom I prefer. Kamila has the most interesting SP, though, at least in my opinion. I think it makes her more memorable than the other two. I will have to wait for their FS, though.

 

[Edwin]

New season, new starts, new scores, new sensations.

Only JPG judges scoring and ISU ratings and YouTube viewers count matters now, and most international judges have never seen these junior skaters with their own eyes. "Judging" a routine from a videoclip will never compare to judging from rinkside.

Cannot wait for JGP to start

 

[Alex65]

I love Daria's movement quality and musical timing, and her SP is quite illustrative of that (today she was a little off-timing at the end because she stumbled on one of her steps, but when she's clean her performance is just wonderful). I originally started writing a very long post about Kamila, Daria and Maya's musicality, and how they match up to the 3A (as a part 2 to my other post about the 3A's musicality), but I never posted it. I originally wrote this about Daria because she seriously impressed me. (Beware...very, very long post ahead.)

Aside from inconsistency, Daria's biggest artistic issue is her face. It is blank. She is a gorgeous skater, but she does not skate with her face at all. It often looks odd because her body shows so much passion and her face is just...mismatched. Blank. To dramatic, swelling, cinematic music.

But in terms of range of movement to the music, Daria really, really impresses me. She is twelve. Please Don't Make Me Love You is NOT an easy piece to skate to for a twelve-year-old, because if you pay attention to the song, the mood changes so often. It's not like (for example) Kamila's SP where the mood goes from soft/slow/graceful in the first half to intense/forceful/powerful in the second. Instead, it is constantly moving from one to another and back. The singer's voice goes from loud to soft to loud again, the crescendo comes in and then goes just as quickly and then suddenly it's back again. It requires a twelve-year-old to understand musical phrasing on a relatively intricate level, and Daria does it beautifully. I honestly think that nearly any other girl her age would look like they are skating through that music, but Daria makes it special. And this is coming from someone who does not follow her closely, would not consider herself a Daria fan, etc - I honestly think she has a musical gift. If only she could get more consistency!

If you watch one of those rare occasions where Daria skates her SP clean, you will see that she knows how to be soft and graceful to the soft and graceful parts of the music, and how to be sharp and harsh and quick with the loud, crescendo parts of the music. Which is very impressive considering her music keeps going from one to the other and back again, over and over. It means that this kid genuinely understands music. It's not a front half/back half type affair, which is not easy either but is certainly easier than the constantly changing vibe of Please Don't Make Me Love You.

And as for Kamila, I love, love, love her extensions. I think she is very fluid in her movement, I love the control and flexibility she has in her body at such a young age. I think she is a prodigy and I would absolutely die for her lines. But I think that in terms of actually understanding her music and how it correlates to body movement, she isn't quite on Daria's level (yet), and this is the most apparent at the beginning of her SP, when the music is extremely slow and soft and minimal, yet she is hitting every single movement very sharply, similarly to how she moves in the second half of her program when her music becomes intense. It's not only a matter of how many movements she has to hit in the choreography, it's also about how sharp and powerful she hits each movement - it doesn't correlate to the beginning music at all. Compare her to (clean) Daria, where she will vary her movements between soft, graceful music and intense, powerful music. But when Kamila is older I am sure she will understand the music better, because she is still so young and she has plenty of time. Both Daria and Kamila are beautiful skaters and have so much potential.

You forgot to talk about Maya. Did your bus arrive too early?
Seriously, I see in her something special among all these girls, even if I see that she does not have the qualities of a “child prodigy” like Camila. And I'm interested in your opinion

 

[5Axel]

Probably a very unpopular opinion, but I enjoyed Anna Frolova's program the most. I was very impressed by her beatiful music, which I had never heard of before. The choreography is also really interesting, especially the StSq.
I also liked Daria Usacheva 's program, she has the "it " factor.

 

[icecreamandsprinkles]

Alyona Kanysheva impressed me a lot. She will be a force to be reckoned with. Her skating is so beautiful and it looked like in real time that she had a great, deep lutz edge. Hopefully that will be useful since many other skaters have flat/shallow lutz edges.

I also had never really watched Daria before, but I did like the way she skated. I know consistency is something she has to work on though, from what I’ve heard.

 

[Mr Cat]

I too love Kanysheva. Do we know if she plans 4 toe in the free skate?

 

[ruga]

Does anyone else really like Daria?

My unpopular opinion... I prefer her skating to kamila’s, I think she’s a stunning performer. I also prefer her sp to kamila’s, I think it is elegant and has a great flow and I love the song. And nothing against Kamila, but am I the only one who thinks that her sp has too many leg lifts/kicks/extensions? Like I know she’s got great flexibility, however I think it’s over used in that program of which everyone seems to praise. Obviously the choreo is not Kamila’s fault and she is still an exquisite skater, but I find her short to be slightly over-hyped.

I too think that Kamila is not that much better than all other juniors. I think that she got lots of attention because of her Picasso SP. Portraying a character from a painting is indeed a unique concept, and it overshadowed not only all programs from other girls, but even her own free program. Kamila has great flexibility and nice spins, but her jumps, especially +3T combos, are not my cup of tea. I also agree that there were a bit too many leg kicks in her SP. They sometimes fit the music, but it was weird when the melody was rather calm and she did a bunch of movements. I'm looking forward to her FP though. Exogenesis really fits her IMO.

 

[nussnacker]

I too love Kanysheva. Do we know if she plans 4 toe in the free skate?

She said she won’t be including any quads this season.

 

[Edwin]

She said she won’t be including any quads this season.

Indeed, forgot to add this quote to the Kanysheva thread:
“This season, we decided not to put any quads in the free program, because there was this injury, I could not jump for a while. It’s better to skate cleanly, but without a quad. Take the same Grand Prix Final where Alyona Kostornaya skated cleanly with triple jumps, while Sasha Trusova fell on her quad."

 

[fabienne1996]

I too think that Kamila is not that much better than all other juniors. I think that she got lots of attention because of her Picasso SP. Portraying a character from a painting is indeed a unique concept, and it overshadowed not only all programs from other girls, but even her own free program. Kamila has great flexibility and nice spins, but her jumps, especially +3T combos, are not my cup of tea. I also agree that there were a bit too many leg kicks in her SP. They sometimes fit the music, but it was weird when the melody was rather calm and she did a bunch of movements. I'm looking forward to her FP though. Exogenesis really fits her IMO.

I I looked at the video of her sp, and for me it is also a bit to much leg kicking that absolutely do not go along to the music, and her 3-3 combination is also a it wonky, but she is talented and young