2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 621 | Golden Skate

2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

I've struggled to see the UR no matter how many times I slow-mo the youtube video. I decided to download the video and run it through more intense slow-motion and I finally see it. The angle of the video is still hard to tell (her boot blocks her blade), with her blade looking like it hits the ice before being fully rotated, but we cannot tell for sure if she was still rotating in the air or on the ice. With a very strict panel, unfortunately no benefit of the doubt for Alena. Without the stumble, I don't think it would've gotten a review as at least to my naked eye, it looked bang clean.


I feel like I am usually pretty good as spotting < even in real time and I was completely confused by the protocol. Upon a more concise review I could see where the toe pick touched early but it was nail biter close. She very well may have just made it past 90 but I wouldn’t say she got the full rotation so I wouldn’t have considered it phantom. I agree that the landing had to have triggered the review and I have definitely seen much more egregious < get by.

I think much of the frustration this evening is that as harsh as the panel seemed on some calls (even if ultimately fair) they were overly lenient on others. Namely the Japanese ladies < and Mariah’s lutz edge. At the same time someone posted a clearer image from a better angle of Alina’s lutz edge on the France Day 1 thread and it blatantly looked flat to me. So now I think I can agree that “e” didn’t make sense at all. So on the surface I can say that the 3A< was “fair” but if they don’t apply the same standard to everyone then not so much.
 
Disagree with the scores for both, Ill leave it at that. Tech caller needs to get his eyes checked. Good luck to the girls in FS.
 
I was watching the NBC coverage of Skate Canada-and Tara actually referred to Veronika-but not by name. Tara said that now, even 11 year olds were doing quads. (This was after her 4S was posted on twitter) Both girls have huge talent, is the younger sister also with Eteri? Also, kudos to their mother who got them to their current level-I don't know anything about the mother's skating career, but she must be a great coach.




I'm wrong, the younger sister is Alёna, not Alina. :laugh: I think Alёna is still training in Severodvinsk, yes, near Arkhangelsk (Archangel), and not officially within Eteri's school yet, but there are clips of her training there alongside Veronika.


She's 9 y.o. Here she is skating her SP two weeks ago (Mayor's Cup of the City of Vologda).
 
I also thought it looked very clean.

Unfortunately, the tech panel has a different camera angle than we do, so we do not know what it looked like from their angle, but the bobble she had on the landing probably made them take a very close look at it.

I think that is the point. If the landing of a jump looks bad you will get that jump reviewed. I saw some of her 3As that were also big and beautiful in practice from another angle than the ISU steam view Some definitely looked a bit UR. So, I think this one likely did too from the angles the technical panel had... Aliona's height and distance on the 3A is beautiful but the air position looks less than ideal and shows down rotation a bit. I am sure her coaches will address the issue and her 3A will certainly be fully rotated more often.
 
Alina always had issues with her lutz but it wasn’t called. Last season she really struggled and there were many discussions about her scores being too high for what she was putting in the ice. I’m not surprised to see judges starting to ding her. That said, there’s no way her PCS should be anywhere near Aliona. I don’t care how big a fan anyone is of Alina—her overall skating is no where near the quality of Aliona.
I wouldn’t be worried about the points deducted as much as they’re continuing to give outrageous scores to Alina. The LP will be interesting and very telling. My guess is Alina wins no matter what.

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I remember the incident with Michelle Kwan. I wonder if that was some kind of a judging conspiracy also? 😉

I think Alena has the best skating skills. But can you point out why Alina's performance and interpretation wouldn't be above Alena's? What else would you add to Alina's performance in this program? It looked beautiful to me and she did very well to express the musical nuances and project the program towards the audience. And I'd say they're about the same with transitions, but Alina does have more doing into and out of her jumps.
 
Her music has the right amount of time. We can hear it from the practice video https://youtu.be/ILOrVKD6QLI?t=179
2:50.
And based on her SP video she didn't go over her music with this final move. Looks like one more wrong call today. :scratch2:

I posted this in the event thread: Has anyone figured out Alina's time violation yet? In the performance, when she lowered her hand on the final pose, it was on the last note of the music, so it doesn't look like she went over it. In morning practice, the announcer said her music time was 2:50. So where did the time violation happen - it should be made to clear to the team because this is an easy fix.

So was her program too long and the announcer got it wrong, or did she start too early (before the music)? Because it looks like she ended on the music.

But her music time was announced as 2:50 by the announcer at the event. So for her competition program to have been 2:52, she would've had to end 2 seconds after the music, or start 2 second before the music. It looks like she ended on the music, so I'm confused.

That means nothing. Music is timed by a volunteer using a stopwatch at practices. It's not binding and it doesn't even necessarily have to be correct. (On a separate note: shall we investigate the volunteer along with the Tech Controller? I vote we lock her up!)

I thought the hand-drop was the final pose, like she starts to reach out but realizes it's hopeless and gives up and drops her hand. She did the same thing at the Russian test skates.

The hand drop is right on the last note of the music, of course it's a part of the choreography/program.

This is apparently not the case.

It said after her final pose she moved in a manner that evidently looked as if her program wasn't finished and thus the violation

It is supposed to be a quote from RusFed but I don't know if it is legit or not, I did not post it

That quote was amazing. The hand drop is clearly on the last note of the music. Whoever it came from, all I have to say is don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. We have eyes and ears and some of us can still form our own opinions based on that we see and hear.

I hope the judges at least explained the violation so that Alina's team can prevent it from happening again.

What boggles my mind is why there's a music time violation to begin with. I think no one should get "more" ice time, but if music is submitted and vetted ahead of time, then that should eliminate these errors. Why are they being told the music is too long after it's used?? Giving point violations to something like music (which could easily corrupt or have a transfer error) isn't related to the skating at all!

It's the skater's/team's obligation to make sure their music time is correct. It doesn't get vetted by the federation, ISU or any panel at each competition. I think there is - or at least was - also a difference between music time and skating time and this is also taken into consideration when it comes to time violations, but I would need to go back and check.

Anyway, if you time the music like they do at competitions - by using a stopwatch - her SP music and skating time is about half a second over 2:50. Also important to note that what is actually measured here really is the music time. If your file contains several seconds of silence before or after the music begins, it does not get counted. Only music time.

This is not the first time a skater received a time violation. I mean last season Samohin showed up with a SP that was like 3.5 minutes long. How does that even happen? I also remember an early competition two years ago where a Serbian skater got a -1 because her program ended up being 2:51 and that is where the skating time came into play as well.

Not trying to defend Mariah, but I believe judges only go back and review jumps if they know something usually goes wrong with a skater's jump, or if they have some weird anomaly. In this case, Alina had a weird +3Lo and sloppy landing, creating more scrutiny. For some other skaters with jumps that look okay to the naked eye, there's simply not enough time to go back and review everything.

I'm not against strict panels, but they should be universally applied. If those are the rules, then apply them by all means, but not applying them to certain skaters cancels out the purpose of the rule!

still mad about Kostornaia's phantom UR call
I'm not sure if they are allowed to go and look at review if they know a skater usually has a problem with a jump. But you're right about the anomaly part - if the landing or another part of the jump looks dodgy, that's grounds for asking for a review.

This thread is a gift that keeps on giving. The order of the skaters after SP seems quite correct and the panel was equally strict across the board. Neither Alina or Alena are at risk of losing their GPF spot over their SP scores here. So let's all untie our panties from that twist they're in right now and watch the free today.
 
Any clips with Alina and Alyona speaking at a press conference or in another capacity from Grenoble?
 
FWIW: Not true at the ISU competitions in the U.S. at which I have volunteered since 2017.

Thanks. This was the case at ISU competitions I worked at in the past. Not in the US and pre-2017. Who did it at competitions you volunteered at, did ISU send a person?
 
I don't think it's fair to drag Alina into the drama about the PCS. She receives such scores because she's just that good. Look at her SP - it's beautifully done and executed, a lot of interesting transitions and a great StepSq. I am on the same page with you though considering Alena's PCS. The problem was that she was underscored and not that Alina was overscored, who btw also got an edge call!!! I mean what!? They gave her 3 Lutz on slow motion, and yes sometimes she tends to get flat before airborn, but never inside. And this was the case here too! And also can someone explain the time violation? She started and finished her skate on time..


All the freakout over one possible harsh call....and her PCS are a joke...she does not have the strongest SS , posture, flow or footwork
 
I think I do

Someone posted a decent quality fan cam video in Alina's fan fest and even when slowed down to 0.25 I really can't say it's clearly the wrong edge. I think it was a harsh call, but the outcry and outrage over it are a bit much. a. Wrong calls happen and no one gets this upset over them and b. the panel was strict here.
 
Someone posted a decent quality fan cam video in Alina's fan fest and even when slowed down to 0.25 I really can't say it's clearly the wrong edge. I think it was a harsh call, but the outcry and outrage over it are a bit much. a. Wrong calls happen and no one gets this upset over them and b. the panel was strict here.

Tech panel is not supposed to be "strict" or leniet. Tech panel is supposed to be precise. It is absurd to apology two completely wrong calls of the tech panel in one SP by "strictness".

As for the angles, I've seen at least three from the all significant directions (forward, backward, right side). Where is the magical angle that would show it different way. This is truly the more absurd with the fact that Mariah's clear flat edge was approved as clean. This is too much for just a coincidence for me.
 
Definitely looks at least !. Look how much she shifts toward the inside just before take off. From this view it looks ! but the technical panel has a different angle. So, who knows?

I'm still waiting for the link where Trusova is using bad language. And I've lost in logo-diarrhea but I noticed colormyworld asked some links. Colormyworld240 don't do the same mistake like me to wait.
 
It's been said in the thread her time in the competition was 2:52 but I don't know how that was arrived at.

I claimed 2.52 based on the isu vid on her skate she starts to move at 0.29 and stops at 3.21 (lowering the hand) which gives a total of 2.52 in skating time. Remember that it isnt the time of the music that counts but the time from the first movement in the program until they come to a complete stop. Either way this is an easy thing to fix and am sure we will never see Alina get a time vio again
 
Tech panel is not supposed to be "strict" or leniet. Tech panel is supposed to be precise. It is absurd to apology two completely wrong calls of the tech panel in one SP by "strictness".

Look, the call has not been and will not be disputed. Let it go. Questionable calls happen all the time. You're claiming bias had a lot to do with these calls and unless you're gonna go review every jump in the ladies SP competition with equal scrutiny... well even if you did go and review each one, there would still be no point. None of us have seen that the panel's replay has shown and cannot with 100% certainty claim the call was lenient, strict or correct.

This happens in skating all the time and whoever it happens to is someone's favorite. Don't expect everyone to get their pitchforks and torches ready just because it happened to yours. It's unlikely Alina and Alena will finish anything other than 1 and 2 in this competition. We'll see in the next one if anyone starts paying more attention to their Lz edges and 3A rotations because of this.
 
Definitely looks at least !. Look how much she shifts toward the inside just before take off. From this view it looks ! but the technical panel has a different angle. So, who knows?
She didn't even change her edge to flat. This is the best angle to see.
 
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