2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Happy Skates]

Oh dear.

If that is true? I don't always believe everything I read.


Rodina likes to stir #$&@

On the one hand I feel sorry for Darya that she was probably just used by that God awful woman. She tricks people in to saying things and turns it in to drama when it was probably meant perfectly innocently.


On the other hand, surely she or someone close to her knew what she was getting in to.

I'd be surprised at Alina to be that petty, deleting Darya off her Instagram, doesn't sound like Alina to me.

I don't think its petty to unfollow Darya, I mean IIRC Darya reposted something on her story with Rodina, someone who apparently has actively gone after Alina and said some hurtful things. If Alina doesn't want to see that on her feed, she doesn't have to. In fact, good for her for getting rid of that, you shouldn't be forced to look at someone who's said horrible things about you on your Instagram feed. That being said, we have no idea why she actually unfollowed her, as she's unfollowed people for no reason before. Even people she seems to still be friends with.

 

[Scott512]

I certainly am aligned with your reasoning. While I immensely disliked the RusFed's decision last year to set aside Liza Tuks for Zhenya, I do understand the rationale despite the former having overall better results in the 2018/19 season. The main issue that tripped Liza Tuks up was her bout of pneumonia so close to Worlds and the resultant hesitancy among the powers that be about whether she had recovered to her full potential pre-pneumonia. The federation's job is not to keep fans happy but to do whatever is needed to bring forward a team that can bring home as many medals as possible. Pretty sure that without the pneumonia, Liza Tuks will have been skating at Worlds 2019 but alas.

As for Masha, posters have basically said she should not go to the GP - look how badly she botched things up, not a single clean jump pass. Tl;dr = some posters felt she should not have been given this chance. Unfortunately, the rules are clear, Masha earned her spot based on the previous year's rules. I also did not like this decision but I have to respect that RusFed played by the rules and agreement. I am sure that next year, Masha will not be given this free pass, as she did not earn them this year (caveat: assuming the rules stay the same).

Per ISU's Grand Prix Designation of Skaters:

1. Seeded Skaters (#1-6 at Worlds) will be assigned 2 spots.

Alina & Zhenya each get 2 spots​

2. Invited Skaters (#7-13 at Worlds) will be guaranteed to be selected for 2 spots.

Sofia gets 2 spots​

3. Invited Skaters with ISU World Standing Top 24 and ISU Season Bests Top 24 (who aren't already in WS Top 24) will be guaranteed 1 spot. This excludes seeded and invited skaters above.

Guaranteed 1 spot: Maria (WS #9), Stasya (WS #13), Liza (WS #16), Sasha (WS #24); Shcherbakova (SB #9), Kostornaia (SB #11), Serafima (SB #18), Tarusina (SB #20, but stayed Junior), Gubanova (SB #21), Kanysheva (SB #22, but stayed Junior)​

4. Invited Skaters who were medallists at Junior Worlds, or the gold medallist at Junior GPF will be included in the selection process. Note that the rule says included, and not guaranteed.

Included: Sasha (Worlds), Shcherbakova (Worlds), Kostornaia (GPF)​

From my understanding, Feds are mandated to select from the seeded skaters (Worlds #1-6), then the invited skaters (Worlds #7-12), then the remaining invited skaters (WS & SB Top 24). Only after all those skaters have been invited to their guaranteed spots, can they move onto the general pool (Junior Worlds Medallists, JGPF Gold, Season Best Top 75).

Sasha gets her 2nd spot (JWGM), Shcherbakova gets her 2nd spot (JWSM), Kostornaia gets her 2nd spot (JGPFGM). Then, Liza gets her 2nd spot (SB #2). And I'm assuming RusFed selected Stasya as the host spot for her 2nd spot, although her SB #23 was enough for a 2nd spot.​

After all aforementioned skaters have been invited in that order, feds are then supposed to confirm if the invited skater will participate in the GP.

Therefore, Gubanova was mandated to be selected for a 1st spot before a 2nd spot could be given to anyone but Alina/Zhenya/Sofia. I'm guessing RusFed decided not to confirm her selection.

Disclaimer that I do not think Maria should have been denied her GP spot. I'm just confused when people state her World Standing (WS) as the reason why she deserved the spot over others. While it's true that her WS earned her a guaranteed spot, we should remember that Gubanova's Season Bests (SB) also guaranteed her a spot. ISU did not state that WS takes precedence over SB.

If we argue that Maria earned her guaranteed spot, then we must also say Gubanova earned her guaranteed spot. Since she was not given her earned guaranteed spot, RusFed effectively chose Maria over Gubanova - which then somewhat legitimizes the question as to why Maria deserved it more than Gubanova?

This is the one of the most detailed and interesting post I have read in nearly five years at this forum.

There is a lot to take in here but what strikes me most is your pertinent point about how Anastasiia Gubanova was mandated 1 Grand Prix spot by her SB. you also say this was mandated and earned by Nastya. But the Russian Federation decided not to go by the ISU rules THEN and did NOT confirm her Grand Prix spot. How nice. Lol. But in reality it's sad. Nastya has inexplicably gotten the shaft at every big moment in her career by her own countrys Federation. It kind of makes you go hmmmm.

Thanks again Globetrotter. Getting all of that information is greatly appreciated and should quiet things down here.

Fortunately 4A is incredible and doing their best to keep everybody's mind off the Russian Federation and all the games they play. That one coach and her girls are carrying the entire sport in their homeland.

 

[Mishaminion]

I don't think its petty to unfollow Darya, I mean IIRC Darya reposted something on her story with Rodina, someone who apparently has actively gone after Alina and said some hurtful things. If Alina doesn't want to see that on her feed, she doesn't have to. In fact, good for her for getting rid of that, you shouldn't be forced to look at someone who's said horrible things about you on your Instagram feed. That being said, we have no idea why she actually unfollowed her, as she's unfollowed people for no reason before. Even people she seems to still be friends with.

Yeah

I was reacting only to the article which was a bit misleading and drama creating itself.

I understand why Alina would react that way now, if indeed she did unfollow Darya because of her Rodina interview and comments

 

[Vandevska]

But I can see how some girls just give up like Polina did at 17. I am concerned about Dasha too.

Polina didn't give up. She wanted to study.

 

[andromache]

It was hardly a smart idea to give an interview to Rodina.

At the same time Alina gave an interview to TASS https://tass.ru/interviews/7075777

Key points:

1. She does not grow any more. She has stopped at 160 cm
2. She won't introduce quads before she loses at least 3 kilos.
3. On Trusova and Co.
"I don't have the goal to compete with them - I go to the ice to skate. I want it more than to be on the podium. The girls' attitude to that is still a bit childish - I understand them as nobody else would. I used to be the same just a while ago. We talk every day on every possible topics including the craziest".
4. On IdF judging:
"It was some serious judging. There were moments that I did not agree with. But in general it all makes sense. They are judges - it was their opinion. Everything changes including the rules of figure skating. These are the conditions we have to live in. One has to be ready to everything".

What a classy thoughtful person at her 17 years of age. And some people keep telling us about "human cost"...

Alina is such a sweetheart. I'm glad she has found internal motivation to continue to compete and develop as a skater.

I will add that I hope she is not actively trying to lose 3 kilos. That is quite a bit of weight for someone who is already so petite.

 

[ruga]

I like Alina's new attitude. Some would think that having 3 new competitors is a curse, but as Alina has won everything, she can now skate just for fun and for the audience, with less pressure. But I'm sure she will try to get high places in competitions as well.

In other news, Evgenia has a new gala
https://www.instagram.com/p/B4ctXAlh2oJ/?igshid=chuki8o381t

 

[Mishaminion]

I like Alina's new attitude. Some would think that having 3 new competitors is a curse, but as Alina has won everything, she can now skate just for fun and for the audience, with less pressure. But I'm sure she will try to get high places in competitions as well.

In other news, Evgenia has a new gala
https://www.instagram.com/p/B4ctXAlh2oJ/?igshid=chuki8o381t

Alina is an amazing ambassador for her sport and country.No matter where she places.

Looking forward to Evgenia's new gala.

 

[Scott512]

It was hardly a smart idea to give an interview to Rodina.

At the same time Alina gave an interview to TASS https://tass.ru/interviews/7075777

Key points:

1. She does not grow any more. She has stopped at 160 cm
2. She won't introduce quads before she loses at least 3 kilos.
3. On Trusova and Co.
"I don't have the goal to compete with them - I go to the ice to skate. I want it more than to be on the podium. The girls' attitude to that is still a bit childish - I understand them as nobody else would. I used to be the same just a while ago. We talk every day on every possible topics including the craziest".
4. On IdF judging:
"It was some serious judging. There were moments that I did not agree with. But in general it all makes sense. They are judges - it was their opinion. Everything changes including the rules of figure skating. These are the conditions we have to live in. One has to be ready to everything".

What a classy thoughtful person at her 17 years of age. And some people keep telling us about "human cost"...

well said by Alina. but how come so many of the Russian girls like this rodina? It really is bewildering.

Hardly petty at all, I’d have done that and a whole lot more myself if I was her. Unfollowing is the least she could do.
If you consider yourself a friend of any sort, on what planet would it be okay for you to give an interview and say unflattering things about your friend to a ‘journalist’ (and i use this broadly) who is known to outright slander and send absolutely disgusting messages about Alina?

I mean, to draw a comparison to illustrate, imagine if Hermione Granger suddenly went up to Rita Skeeter to drop the tea on Harry Potter after Rita Skeeter slanders him in public.

But being unfollowed by the queen of figure skating has to sting if that is indeed the case for Dasha but as you and others have pointed out Alina has unfollowed many people over the years.

It's hard for me to comment on this interview of dashas because we don't really know what was said but I saw on YouTube that it was an hour long. That's a long time. I just hope Dasha did not repeat what Nastya did with her interview with rodina.

 

[Fluture]

Do we even know what Daria said in he interview?

 

[Artemisa]

It was hardly a smart idea to give an interview to Rodina.

At the same time Alina gave an interview to TASS https://tass.ru/interviews/7075777

Key points:

1. She does not grow any more. She has stopped at 160 cm
2. She won't introduce quads before she loses at least 3 kilos.
3. On Trusova and Co.
"I don't have the goal to compete with them - I go to the ice to skate. I want it more than to be on the podium. The girls' attitude to that is still a bit childish - I understand them as nobody else would. I used to be the same just a while ago. We talk every day on every possible topics including the craziest".
4. On IdF judging:
"It was some serious judging. There were moments that I did not agree with. But in general it all makes sense. They are judges - it was their opinion. Everything changes including the rules of figure skating. These are the conditions we have to live in. One has to be ready to everything".

What a classy thoughtful person at her 17 years of age. And some people keep telling us about "human cost"...

I don't like loosing weight in a person that is all muscle to learn a jump

 

[Mishaminion]

Do we even know what Daria said in he interview?

It seems she was asked about her opinions on recent competitions, especially France. And she answered.

I think this Rodina woman comes across as quite manipulative and loves controversy, I'm sure part of what Darya did say was down to the tactics and wording of her questions she uses to get people to say things.

I've seen a lot of that kind of thing in my experiences.

 

[[email protected]]

Do we even know what Daria said in he interview?

Panenkova:
"May be few people see but if one pays attention at first she does inside-outside and in the end when she places the toe she may switch back to inside - you just have to look attentively. Every day fan may not see it.

Flutz can be cured, it depends on the desire and ability of a person. I had the wrong lutz edge but then it was OK.

Alina grows that's why anything can happen, may be she became more reserved that's why she has wrong edge now. But I don't think it's critical, literally it was an accident".


Rodina:

"In the free program she also received unclear edge."

Panenkova:

"It depends on the jump placement. When they made a program for me they placed the flip where I have the wrong edge to the right side to have it farther from the camera. May be she first jumped with the angle where the wrong edge was clear and in the free program judges could not see it. Next time she will jump it where they won't see it at all or make a good jump herself.

I think that they will work on her edge and will correct it. If we look at Alena Kostornaya's lutz she also has the wrong edge. She always had problems with lutz"...


My opnion is it would be just better if she did not say all that to Rodina or not Rodina. It just does not smell good.

 

[Mishaminion]

Panenkova:
"May be few people see but if one pays attention at first she does inside-outside and in the end when she places the toe she may switch back to inside - you just have to look attentively. Every day fan may not see it.

Flutz can be cured, it depends on the desire and ability of a person. I had wrong lutz edges but then it was OK.

Alina grows that's why anything can happen, may be she became more reserved that's why she has wrong edge now. But I don't think it's critical, literally it was an accident".


Rodina:

"In the free program she also received unclear edge."

Panenkova:

"It depends on the jump placement. When they made a program for me they placed the flip where I have the wrong edge to the right side to have it farther from the camera. May be she first jumped with the angle where the wrong edge was clear and in the free program judges could not see it. Next time she will jump it where they won't see it at all or make a good jump herself.

I think that they will work on her edge and will correct it. If we look at Alena Kostornaya's lutz she also has the wrong edge. She always had problems with lutz"...


My opnion is it would be just better if she did not say all that to Rodina or not Rodina. It just does not smell good.

There doesn't seem to be anything nasty about what she said, she seems to be quite respectful and positive about her fellow skaters, defending them even. Because mistakes do happen and she made it clear she has her own edge issues.

But still, it might have been better not to say anything. Somehow it might not have been such a big deal if it wasn't Rodina. An interview with someone else wouldn't have been deliberately trying to get skaters to bash their opponents... as I believe she certainly has such an agenda.

 

[Mishaminion]

That's absolutely clear. But Darya herself implied that Alina has wrong edge, in the free program she could place lutz where the angle was more difficult to see that's why she received just unclear edge. And she said directly that next time Alina may try to hide it even better. These are quite nasty insinuations same as saying that Alena K always had bad lutz. And it does not matter to whom you say it if you know that it is 100% getting public.

Her further words like may be Alina will jump a good lutz on her own sound like clumsy excuses after she realized that she said something very wrong.

Not getting into a fight about if those edge calls were right or wrong but if Darya agrees with them then how is what she said wrong?

You can disagree but you cant say she is wrong

 

[zounger]

Not getting into a fight about if those edge calls were right or wrong but if Darya agrees with them then how is what she said wrong?

You can disagree but you cant say she is wrong

It depends. The funny thing here is that she does her lutz in the same place across the SP and LP. I don't know maybe she has some orientation problems or didn't watch the programs at all. And she does it there for two seasons now. Also, the interviewer talks (if the translation is correct) about unclear edge and she talks about wrong edge, so even there she doesn't agree with them...

But I'm glad that all these people give interviews to Ro...

 

[Scott512]

For me it's not much about RusFed "wasting" spots that but rather: you knew this was going to happen 2 months ago why nobody tried to prevent this, and improve, cause you look at her performances in September and what she did few days ago and not much has changed.

You look at other skaters who also started bad and in 2 months they improved a lot on everything, there was enough time.

My guess is that much like Tsurskaya (who stated during interviews last season that she wanted to move away from the sport, and essentially retired due to lack of interest), she is almost done with Figure Skating, she is probably going to retire after Nationals, so maybe the coach thinks it's not worth to spend much time with her, i don't know.

But even if that is the case, as a coach i'd try everything i can to motivate her to at least end on an high note and not this way, also if she just doesn't want to jump anymore i'd suggest her to move to Ice Dance, cause she has good skating skills, good posture, and good lines.

Truth tolsoj.

as for Alina saying she would have to lose 6 pounds to do quads I don't think I want her to do that. Taking 6 pounds off her body would be a health risk at 17 years old. What she should do is because her legs are much stronger send a couple years ago she should try to do triple axels.

 

[[email protected]]

But is she saying these things and making them up or is it true? Is Dasha saying things to hurt Alina / Alena or she saying professional comments aimed at explaining why they were called for certain things? I don't think her comments were as sketchy as Nastyas were.

I think it's unethical either way. She clearly sets herself apart from us "every day fans who do not see things". Then she says that Alina has issues with lutz edge. Then she implies that before they could hide it like they did it with her flip, etc., etc.

 

[zounger]

I hope Liza has also taken on board the obvious message that she needs to improve in many areas.
I believe she can try different things and improve on what she already has, but Mishin is stubborn and resistant to change. Liza has said it herself, it is hard to change his mind.

There are a lot of areas each skater can work that's true. You never know, maybe she starts working on her lutz too next week.

 

[Scott512]

Vanessa Gusmeroli is the Worlds Bronze medalist in 1997. I remember she was a Tech Specialist at a competition last year where there were lots of debate too, but I can't remember what competition that was.

Edit: It was Worlds.

I guess if she's that way as a judge it's okay if she's that way to all skaters and not just a select few Russian girls. But make no mistake figure skating people around the world are jumping for joy that Alina and Alena got snipped by judges in France. Say hope it continues.

 

[Jontor]

I guess if she's that way as a judge it's okay if she's that way to all skaters and not just a select few Russian girls. But make no mistake figure skating people around the world are jumping for joy that Alina and Alena got snipped by judges in France. Say hope it continues.

If I remember correctly, at Worlds last year there was a UR call on Medvedeva in the short, but not for Bell. Also, almost everyone got level 4 on their StepSeq although many didn't deserve it. Then there were lots of calls that should have been made but wasn't. I think the concensus was that the Tech Panel was useless.

If only Golden Skate Forum Users could judge - then there would be peace in the world...