Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups

[mrrice]

Sigh... I wish PCS actually meant something. Compare Nathan Chen getting such high PCS and skating skills marks. Crazy. You're telling me that his skating skills are as good as Patrick Chan? That's flipping insane. What is the point of developing excellent skating skills and blade control when they're worth less than a double axel difference?!

The Eteri girls do NOT have solid skating skills. Kamila is better than the others, but watch the scraping blade skills and muscled jumps. Watch, for example, Valieva on her combinations. Amazing jump, RESET and SWING whole body into the combination. No flow, often landed on the flat, no running edge, jumps impossible to do without massive prerotation and crazy muscled body swing.

Contrast that, for example to (eg) Osmond. Cp. the height, speed, running edge, flow, etc.

Now, I know we're talking about PCS in general. Eteri skaters typically cover up poor blade skills with excessive amounts of extensions, and scratchy turns.

Judges need to QUIT marking in a tunnel. They should realize that it's totally fine (and the RIGHT thing to do) to be willing to give a skater super strong technical marks, while at the same realizing they have crappy skating skills and components.

It frustrates me to see the top men separated often by 10, 20, 30, or even 40 points in technical scores, yet only a point or two in PCS. Where is the incentive to have Jason Brown-level choreography, or develop Patrick Chan level skating skills? There SHOULD be.

Judges should be willing to give a skater with top 3 technical scores PCS's below the top 10 if necessary.

All that to say that, no, the Eteri girls would NOT be winning non-jumping competitions if skating skills were rewarded as they should be.

I agree, and I've talked about it ever since Med became a star. Granted, I never saw her in person but, I have seen Patrick Chan and Todd Eldredge. They have the deepest edges and along with Plushy, are the best skaters I have ever seen in person. Male skaters...

 

[macy]

I am not a fan of TSL but I have to say Dave hit the nail on the head here. A lot of valid points made.

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[millie]

Sorry but this stinks to high heaven. Sitting on a drug test, wow, just wow.
I can see only one reason and that is to discredit when it has the most impact.
If she can't skate, I am so done with the Olympics and Ice skating.
Beating up on a 15 year old as some of the News Media are doing is
just shameful

The news media has done nothing to this girl, it’s her cronies that has done this to her. Out the blame on them. Sorry, you do the crime, you do the time.
They thought that they could get away with doping but they got caught..
Who would have thought that there would be doping in figure skating. It breaks my heart to see the beautiful art of figure skating dragged through the mud. I have been a fan of figure skating for over 50 years and never have I been more disappointed than I am with this skating scandal. Shame, Shame, Shame..Time for someone to do something about it. Ban them now and from the next Olympics..

 

[Mista Ekko]

A young woman who didn't know the full context lied to an authority figure for her boyfriend... oh my god, crime of the millenium!

I wasn't referring to Carolina by saying that, I was referring to her ex boyfriend,
please understand that or you will have me completely out of context.

 

[Scott512]

I was just thinking when they ended the 6 hour 50 minute meeting with CAS at whatever time in the morning it was why not just send out a statement on if she can skate or not? Don't we think they had their mind made up when they left that nearly 7 hour meeting on whether kV can skate or not? Why make the girl go through another long day of practicing and wondering before the announcement is made in the afternoon in Beijing?

At least a statement will come soon enough but then possibly months of investigations.

 

[cheerknithanson]

I was just thinking when they ended the 6 hour 50 minute meeting with CAS at whatever time in the morning it was why not just send out a statement on if she can skate or not? Don't we think they had their mind made up when they left that nearly 7 hour meeting on whether kV can skate or not? Why make the girl go through another long day of practicing and wondering before the announcement is made in the afternoon in Beijing?

At least a statement will come soon enough but then possibly months of investigations.

Does that mean months of waiting for the medalists of the team event?

 

[Jontor]

Sigh... I wish PCS actually meant something. Compare Nathan Chen getting such high PCS and skating skills marks. Crazy. You're telling me that his skating skills are as good as Patrick Chan? That's flipping insane. What is the point of developing excellent skating skills and blade control when they're worth less than a double axel difference?!

The Eteri girls do NOT have solid skating skills. Kamila is better than the others, but watch the scraping blade skills and muscled jumps. Watch, for example, Valieva on her combinations. Amazing jump, RESET and SWING whole body into the combination. No flow, often landed on the flat, no running edge, jumps impossible to do without massive prerotation and crazy muscled body swing.

Contrast that, for example to (eg) Osmond. Cp. the height, speed, running edge, flow, etc.

Now, I know we're talking about PCS in general. Eteri skaters typically cover up poor blade skills with excessive amounts of extensions, and scratchy turns.

Judges need to QUIT marking in a tunnel. They should realize that it's totally fine (and the RIGHT thing to do) to be willing to give a skater super strong technical marks, while at the same realizing they have crappy skating skills and components.

It frustrates me to see the top men separated often by 10, 20, 30, or even 40 points in technical scores, yet only a point or two in PCS. Where is the incentive to have Jason Brown-level choreography, or develop Patrick Chan level skating skills? There SHOULD be.

Judges should be willing to give a skater with top 3 technical scores PCS's below the top 10 if necessary.

All that to say that, no, the Eteri girls would NOT be winning non-jumping competitions if skating skills were rewarded as they should be.

I firmly believe the judges score PCS just like they did in 6.0 era. Which means they simply compare the skaters as they go. The first skaters is the benchmark and then they work from there. That is why the PCS is always higher the later you skate. (Or lower at the beginning because you need to have some room).

Take the men's free skate as an example. Junhwan Cha had a great skate in the last group, although with a nasty fall. He scored 90.28 in PCS.
Yuzuru Hanyu who skated in the previous group also had a great skate, despite two falls. He scored 90.44.

Well, no one can convince me that Cha has the same level of PCS as Hanyu. But here he clearly had the advantage of skating later...

 

[Tomadeur]

I was just thinking when they ended the 6 hour 50 minute meeting with CAS at whatever time in the morning it was why not just send out a statement on if she can skate or not? Don't we think they had their mind made up when they left that nearly 7 hour meeting on whether kV can skate or not? Why make the girl go through another long day of practicing and wondering before the announcement is made in the afternoon in Beijing?

At least a statement will come soon enough but then possibly months of investigations.

The hearing ended but afterwards was for sure an intern discussion of the CAS and after they made their final decision they had to work out an statement so i think the timeline is quite reasonable.

 

[Scott512]

Does that mean months of waiting for the medalists of the team event?

Probably not but I don't know. Poor KV is probably so worn out mentally from this whole thing. They're going to have to have professional people around her to keep an eye on her and make sure her spirits are up.

 

[PyeongChang2018]

Yeah, I'm having trouble finding the link, but at the end of the live stream outside the appeal room, the man who came out and spoke to the press said they had to discuss.

 

[satine]

Does that mean months of waiting for the medalists of the team event?

Probably. No medals can be awarded until a final decision is made. Since it involves so many athletes, I'm sure it will be fought tooth and nail on all sides.

 

[cheerknithanson]

Probably. No medals can be awarded until a final decision is made. Since it involves so many athletes, I'm sure it will be fought tooth and nail on all sides.

That is just awful.

 

[readernick]

Sigh... I wish PCS actually meant something. Compare Nathan Chen getting such high PCS and skating skills marks. Crazy. You're telling me that his skating skills are as good as Patrick Chan? That's flipping insane. What is the point of developing excellent skating skills and blade control when they're worth less than a double axel difference?!

The Eteri girls do NOT have solid skating skills. Kamila is better than the others, but watch the scraping blade skills and muscled jumps. Watch, for example, Valieva on her combinations. Amazing jump, RESET and SWING whole body into the combination. No flow, often landed on the flat, no running edge, jumps impossible to do without massive prerotation and crazy muscled body swing.

Contrast that, for example to (eg) Osmond. Cp. the height, speed, running edge, flow, etc.

Now, I know we're talking about PCS in general. Eteri skaters typically cover up poor blade skills with excessive amounts of extensions, and scratchy turns.

Judges need to QUIT marking in a tunnel. They should realize that it's totally fine (and the RIGHT thing to do) to be willing to give a skater super strong technical marks, while at the same realizing they have crappy skating skills and components.

It frustrates me to see the top men separated often by 10, 20, 30, or even 40 points in technical scores, yet only a point or two in PCS. Where is the incentive to have Jason Brown-level choreography, or develop Patrick Chan level skating skills? There SHOULD be.

Judges should be willing to give a skater with top 3 technical scores PCS's below the top 10 if necessary.

All that to say that, no, the Eteri girls would NOT be winning non-jumping competitions if skating skills were rewarded as they should be.

I agree with all of this ( although the junior Eteri skaters do actually have much better SS) however, it isn't nearly as important in my mind as the abuse/ doping of teenagers. A score is a score but drugs/ abusive training practices could ruin a young woman's whole life.

 

[Jontor]

The Swedish commentators on Eurosport just said that we should have a statement around 11-12. Swedish time (which is central European time).
And they will address if Kamila can skate or not, and the medal status of the Team event.

 

[beachmouse]

Hypothetically, could Eteri's team be banned by other feds from competing in their countries? US evidently has a law on its books whereby Eteri and her team could be prosecuted if doping impacted US athletes. But maybe there's a more simple route.... Could federations simply ban her team? Even if they allowed her athletes, could they ban coaches? Could US do what Australia did to Djokevic and void a visa?
These are hypothetical questions. But if Eteri's team becomes persona non grata in key countries, they would not be able to support their athletes during competitions abroad. This would presumably have the net effect of shutting them down.

They could refuse to issue Eteri a visa to enter the country on grounds of poor moral character IF she is found to be complicit in a doping event. (And there is currently zero evidence of that) However in international competition her skaters are typically representing the Russian Skating Federation/ROC and not Sambo 70, and general rule and courtesy for such things is that a nation's delegation for a competition should be green lit to attend the competition, pandemic problems with vaccinations and such notwithstanding.

 

[Joe Mendoza]

I'll need my beauty rest (trust me, I need lots of it), so I'll prolly just finish the free dance then see the update when I wake up in the morning.

 

[Amei]

Does that mean months of waiting for the medalists of the team event?

Probably for the ladies event as well if she places top 3 there.

The Swedish commentators on Eurosport just said that we should have a statement around 11-12. Swedish time (which is central European time).
And they will address if Kamila can skate or not, and the medal status of the Team event.

The IOC rep Mark that does the press conferences says to his understanding the decision announced in a few hours is only going to be whether she can skate in the individual event

 

[skatesofgold]

Probably for the ladies event as well if she places top 3 there.

That's awful for her competitors.

 

[zanadude]

Probably. No medals can be awarded until a final decision is made. Since it involves so many athletes, I'm sure it will be fought tooth and nail on all sides.

Which is a shame for everybody, as the value of an Olympic medal goes way down once the Games are over.

 

[cheerknithanson]

Which is a shame for everybody, as the value of an Olympic medal goes way down once the Games are over.

Let them get their medals!