Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups

[Jontor]

Well, i'm really not sure about that and all the medicines they are testing, but i'm pretty sure for the regular tests health care can use in everyday life, you can detect simple cannabis even 3 months after you take it

True. So in this case I would smoke my cannabis in September so it won't get detected at Europeans in January...

 

[Baron Vladimir]

WADA seems to have gone with the ISU’s rules for sanctioning doping positives. (I linked them way up thread) Likely because of pervious bad action in speedskating, the ISU starts with requesting a 4 year ban for a doping positive and then reducing from there if there is evidence that the presence of the substance was accidental on inadvertent. And then WADA/CAS didn’t really buy the strawberry dessert story that was given as a reason for accidental ingestion.

I'm all for banning athletes who are taking steroids and similar medicines for 4 years, but medicines for heart disease or asthma which are forbidden by WADA even majority of us are using it in every day life, 4 years just doesn't make sense to me...

 

[Baron Vladimir]

True. So in this case I would smoke my cannabis in September so it won't get detected at Europeans in January...

Yeah, but you will enjoy effects of it only that one day, so its not worthy it at the end

 

[Greengemmonster]

Labs, grandpas, alleged contamination aside, I wonder why they doped her.

She was supremely talented and would have won anyway. Did she need the drugs to practise her jumps and have consistency? I wonder if it was a long term thing, started many years ago and someone made a wrong calculation so she got caught.

Did they dope her without her knowledge? Was she unfortunately a guinea pig for their future line of skaters and didn’t know it.

It’s such a mess and a waste of talent. I remember when she beat Alysa with no quads in juniors. She could have done well even without the quads. I can’t get my head around the entire thing!

 

[Jontor]

Yeah, but you will enjoy effects of it only that one day, so its not worth it at the end

That one day? That whole September would be a blast!

Seriously though, my point is - If you really want to cheat with drugs you have to plan it very very carefully. People are not stupid. And with todays protocols with testing during off seasons, it is extremely difficult to get away with it.
I find it very hard to believe that the Eteri camp, RusFed and other professionals involved would take that risk. It's not worth it, and this situation has become an embarrassment for all of them.
So, what really happened in this case...I don't think we will ever know...

 

[readernick]

Well, i'm really not sure about that and all the medicines they are testing, but i'm pretty sure for the regular tests health care can use in everyday life, you can detect simple cannabis even 3 months after you take it

Obviously each medication chosen has a different length of time where evidence of use will be present in the body. The knowledge required to avoid testing positive is certainly not beyond doctors working with athletes. If they know the time the drug remains in the body they can calculate how long before a competition/ testing use must be stopped. They also know the “at risk” period following use when an athlete may get caught. For cannabis, there is a long period where the drug may detected, TMZ has a remarkably short half life (7 hours in healthy patients if I'm not mistaken). Probably why it was chosen by Valieva's team, unfortunately for Valieva, they likely made a bit of mistake due to weight change ( likely due to starvation for weight loss because most of the supplements she was using are given to anorexia patients to ease symptoms of starving) before Russian Nationals.....

There are constantly new drugs developed that are used for doping and it takes time to develop tests to catch the new methods of cheating. For instance, Eteri's doping doctor has done a lot of experiments with Xenon gas which has been considered doping by WADA since 2014 but no effective test has yet been developed to catch this type of doping.

IMHO doping is doping whether that be steroids or medications used to increase athletic endurance. 4 years is justified not because of Valieva's actions but because failure to properly punish doping in minors will lead to coaches taking more and more risks with their minor students' long-term health and well-being. Doping in minors is a more serious not less serious issue and should be treated as such.

 

[skatingguy]

I'm not sure about WADA using this logic to pin it on Eteri:

This isn't from WADA. The report was written by CAS.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

IMHO doping is doping whether that be steroids or medications used to increase athletic endurance. 4 years is justified not because of Valieva's actions but because failure to properly punish doping in minors will lead to coaches taking more and more risks with their minor students' long-term health and well-being. Doping in minors is a more serious not less serious issue and should be treated as such.

That is absolutely not correct. The same kind of medicine Kamila used other athletes can use due to TUE. Steroids can't be used.
And to punish doping in minors? I mean, by punishing that minor, really? And how coaches are involved in this situation, when the same coaching team had like thousand of athletes internationally in past ten years, being tested the same way Kamila is, so what is the logic behind it? I mean, its just your way to find a logical reason for that kind of punishment, for me personally its an excuse because i don't see it... We don't have to agree on every topic, it's OK But you all coming on this topic with the premise that if an athlete is caught with an illegal substance, that means that must exists some really big doping story going on Ben Johnson or Wes Armstrong style, but in majority of cases it is just one of wrongdoing people do at one point of time...

 

[readernick]

That is absolutely not correct. The same kind of medicine Kamila used other athletes can use due to TUE. Steroids can't be used.
And to punish doping in minors? I mean, by punishing that minor, really? And how coaches are involved in this situation, when the same coaching team had like thousand of athletes internationally in past ten years, being tested the same way Kamila is, so what is the logic behind it?

Correct or incorrect cannot be applied to opinion. The facts I wrote in my post are correct, my opinion and speculation are just that my opinion and educated guesses. I think doping in minors should be viewed as more serious not less. Punishing the minor is a less than ideal method of dealing with this situation, but the only option available to WADA and CAS since the parties in Russia who could investigate the adults involved are uninterested in doing do. About different types of doping, sorry doping is doping. Cheating is cheating, one type isn't better than another. They are all bad, especially when related to the health of a minor athlete.

About other skaters from Eteri's team not being caught, Come on, you can't actually be that naive. Most of that worst doping offenders of all time never failed a test. When you have a whole system on your side and a doctor known for finding ways to dope and not be caught, it's normal to not have positive tests. Until someone makes a little calculation error..... The evidence on how widespread doping has been in Russia, and the almost unbelievable lengths RUSADA went through to help doppers frankly makes it very easy to believe it is a widespread problem. If Eteri's team didn't want people to have this impression, they probably shouldn't have employed a doctor who has focused his research almost entirely on how to dope athletes throughout his career.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

About other skaters from Eteri's team not being caught, Come on, you can't actually be that naive. Most of that worst doping offenders of all time never failed a test. When you have a whole system on your side and a doctor known for finding ways to dope and not be caught, it's normal to not have positive test. Until someone makes a little calculation error..... The evidence on how widespread doping has been in Russia, and the almost unbelievable lengths RUSADA went through to help doppers frankly makes it very easy to believe it is a widespread problem. If Eteri's team didn't want people to have this impression, they probably shouldn't have employed a doctor who has focused his research almost entirely on how to dope athletes throughout his career.

Sorry, but that looks as a simple prejudice for me, to be fair... It is the same if you are talking about aliens existing... I would say its possible, but in reality, its on you thinking about all those things... I would rather keep my state of mind believing that people are generally good, but if some evil doctor exists, then lets be it

 

[beachmouse]

Obviously each medication chosen has a different length of time where evidence of use will be present in the body. The knowledge required to avoid testing positive is certainly not beyond doctors working with athletes. If they know the time the drug remains in the body they can calculate how long before a competition/ testing use must be stopped.

From the Alberto Salazar case-

World’s Most Famous Track Coach Is Banned for 4 Years for Doping Violations

Four years after ProPublica and the BBC detailed allegations of misconduct by Alberto Salazar and his Nike Oregon Project, arbitrators banned him from the sport.

www.propublica.org

The arbitration panel decided that Salazar had committed three anti-doping rule violations: He participated in the administration of a prohibited method; he attempted to tamper with the doping control process; and he “trafficked” in testosterone, a banned substance.

The prohibited method in question was an intravenous infusion of the legal supplement L-carnitine — a naturally occurring amino acid that helps convert fat into energy — but in an amount far in excess of the allowed limit of 50 milliliters per six hours. The tampering charge involved Salazar’s instruction to athletes not to disclose to doping control officers that they had received infusions. The testosterone trafficking charge was the result of an experiment Salazar helped conduct in a lab on the Nike campus in which he applied testosterone gel to his sons to see how much would trigger a positive test.

That is absolutely not correct. The same kind of medicine Kamila used other athletes can use due to TUE. Steroids can't be used.

So why didn’t Kamila’s camp apply for a TUE for medication for her heart condition if it was seen as a necessary medicine?

It’s actually possible to get a TUE for certain steroid classes. Prednisolone, a steroid, is one of the most effective treatments for a Crohn’s disease flare-up. However you do need to have extremely well-documented Crohn’s disease- think a binder full of medical records rather than simple doctor’s note because of the risk of a flare up right before a competition where drug testers will be present.

 

[Minz]

It looks legitimate.

Some of you reacting as though it is impossible for confidential information to be leaked. We have just witnessed a 15 year old girl have her right to privacy and confidentially violated for two years. It was like a frenzy in Beijing everyone seemed to know before she even did.

This is dated July 2022. Valieva was 16 at that point.

 

[Skating91]

This is dated July 2022. Valieva was 16 at that point.

Of course it's just an example of the doping control form they use in Russia.

 

[Skating91]

From the Alberto Salazar case-

World’s Most Famous Track Coach Is Banned for 4 Years for Doping Violations

Four years after ProPublica and the BBC detailed allegations of misconduct by Alberto Salazar and his Nike Oregon Project, arbitrators banned him from the sport.

www.propublica.org

This is testosterone which is proven to work. If you're going to go to such lengths to dope athletes you wouldn't use a common heart drug of questionable benefit an athlete, let alone in a microdose like people were talking about. Microdosing testosterone is what women transitioning into men do, showing how powerful it is. Microdosing TMZ would have almost no effect on even an elderly person with heart disease I imagine.

This is the absurdity of this case it's being equated proof that Russia hasn't cleaned up it's practices since 2014 when they were pumping athletes full of testosterone and then swapping samples. This is a once off positive test for a trace amount of a common heart drug that can be easily bought and questionable benefit to an athlete, making this being the result of contamination most likely. From the very start when the investigation had barely started WADA without the facts was demanding a 4 year ban, which they would never dare do if it was an athlete from elsewhere. WADA never stepped in demanding 4 years when Jon Jones one of the worst dopers on the planet was popped again.

 

[Skating91]

This isn't from WADA. The report was written by CAS.

No, it's from WADA. It's written in the CAS report.

 

[saine]

This is testosterone which is proven to work. If you're going to go to such lengths to dope athletes you wouldn't use a common heart drug of questionable benefit an athlete, let alone in a microdose like people were talking about. Microdosing testosterone is what women transitioning into men do, showing how powerful it is. Microdosing TMZ would have almost no effect on even an elderly person with heart disease I imagine.

That doesn't matter to CAS. From page 116:

The immediate difficulty with this submission is that it is accepted by the Athlete that TMZ is a Prohibited Substance belonging to the S.4 hormone and metabolic modulators class and that its use in sport is banned at all times as it could potentially help the heart to function better. There may be some measure of scientific uncertainty about this but it is of little assistance to the Athlete in showing that she took the drug unintentionally.

It is a banned substance that she tested positive for and accepted that the results were positive in the hearing. It doesn't matter if it worked or not, or if there were better doping strategies. It is still a banned substance.

 

[Skating91]

This. It's ludicrous to read all these lab conspiracy theories. I can assure everyone here that no one in Sweden knows who Valieva is, no one in Sweden knows anything about figure skating. It's more likely that Santa Claus himself was messing with Kamila's sample than some Swedish lab person.

It's a lab that handles Russian samples. I think it would be strange is the senior person there did not have some kind of dialogue with people at WADA, anything odd, suspicious is noted and discussed. WADA would have paid more attention to what's going on at this lab than any other lab in the world I imagine.

As some people have mentioned. The delay was unfortunate, but WHY did RusFed clear Kamila for Olympics when her test wasn't cleared? That is why this mess got so messy.

A positive test is less than 1% chance, and in figure skating this would be much lower since it is so rare. They can't deny someone the opportunity they earned at the Olympics because unprocessed sample that 99.9% of the time would be fine.

The lab had already blamed COVID for the delays when RUSADA was asking for the results, so this information would have been relayed to Kamila and her team. No reason to suspect anything other than the lab being disorganised.

As we now know of course, that was all BS the COVID excuse the lab and WADA used.

It would have been good to have those 7th, 8th and 9th tests retested, but they were destroyed. Retesting would simply confirm that the tests were indeed inconclusive rather than showing a positive or negative (which would have changed everything about the selection of the Olympic team of course). Not that I doubt the lab, but there is always human error.

 

[Skating91]

That doesn't matter to CAS. From page 116:


It is a banned substance that she tested positive for and accepted that the results were positive in the hearing. It doesn't matter if it worked or not, or if there were better doping strategies. It is still a banned substance.

Of course, she failed the test, she believes the test was valid, therefore accepts it was in her system.

Accepting that something exists in her system does not mean she doped, it could have got there via contamination she just can't prove it. She likely genuinely has no idea how it got there.

 

[saine]

It's a lab that handles Russian samples. I think it would be strange is the senior person there did not have some kind of dialogue with people at WADA, anything odd, suspicious is noted and discussed. WADA would have paid more attention to what's going on at this lab than any other lab in the world I imagine.


A positive test is less than 1% chance, and in figure skating this would be much lower since it is so rare. They can't deny someone the opportunity they earned at the Olympics because unprocessed sample that 99.9% of the time would be fine.

The lab had already blamed COVID for the delays when RUSADA was asking for the results, so this information would have been relayed to Kamila and her team. No reason to suspect anything other than the lab being disorganised.

As we now know of course, that was all BS the COVID excuse the lab and WADA used.

It would have been good to have those 7th, 8th and 9th tests retested, but they were destroyed. Retesting would simply confirm that the tests were indeed inconclusive rather than showing a positive or negative (which would have changed everything about the selection of the Olympic team of course). Not that I doubt the lab, but there is always human error.

From page 40:

In the event, during the course of the hearing, and after the examination of Dr Pohanka (from the Stockholm Laboratory) and of Prof. Ayotte (called by WADA) and Prof. Kintz (called by the Athlete), the Athlete withdrew her case in this respect, thereby accepting that the analyses performed by the Stockholm Laboratory was in conformance with the ISL and that the reported AAF was valid and that, accordingly, the Appellants had proven the ADRV. That being so, the disagreement between the Parties related not to whether or not the alleged ADRV had been established but as to the sanctions that should be imposed on the Athlete for that ADRV.

In these circumstances, the Panel will not in this Award outline the Parties’ lengthy submissions in relation to the conduct of the Stockholm Laboratory in its analysis and reporting of the AAF.

She and her lawyers questioned the head of the lab and accepted that the results were valid. The lab needed to prove that they followed all the procedures correctly, or else the case would have been thrown out. That is her right and I am glad that her lawyers followed through on that.

All the stories and theories about the possibilities of how the lab made errors do not matter in the decision. They proved that they followed procedures and their results were accepted.

 

[saine]

Of course, she failed the test, she believes the test was valid, therefore accepts it was in her system.

Accepting that something exists in her system does not mean she doped, it could have got there via contamination she just can't prove it. She likely genuinely has no idea how it got there.

That's correct. The decision is that she couldn't prove that it was unintentional, not that the other parties could prove that it was intentional. Unfortunately for Kamila, she could not prove that it was unintentional when she needed to do that.