News ISU to allow Russian/Belarusians as neutral athletes

[Mariott]

Sorry, I just had to chuckle allow me a small correction, Cluj Napoca is the second largest city in Romania...Of course Romania is a relativelly mid size country, so it is all matter of perspective

This is not me picking at your viewpoint on the subject, just had to add this as someone who went to university there.

Oh, I didn’t mean to offend you or the residents of Cluj Napoca. I was just comparing it to my residents, so… I’m sorry, it was just a matter of habit and scale. No ulterior motive, you know. By the way, the Romanian school of artistic gymnastics has been one of the best in the world ever since the days of Nadia Comăneci, and we have great respect for that.

 

[Artemisa]

.. As a simple example, I thought Gummenik was vastly overscored at the Olympics. I'm rather annoyed at what this means for scoring in all four disciplines, hereon. Their skating being rather unattractive even by well-into-the-CoP standards doesn't help matters at all.

In what planet Gummenik was overscored at the Olympics ???

 

[thatdarncat]

Good news for the Russian skaters, shame it isn't happening because peace has been declared, but seems to be the way of the world.

 

[Jontor]

I wonder how the Russians are planning to obtain visas. Most of European countries have restrictions.

Yes, that might be a HUGE problem. So in the end, we might not see that many Russians competing after all...

 

[Jontor]

In what planet Gummenik was overscored at the Olympics ???

Yes, in my book he was criminally underscored. He should have had at least bronze imho.

 

[4everchan]

Yes, that might be a HUGE problem. So in the end, we might not see that many Russians competing after all...

I don't know about the ISU but in general, in sporting federations, organizing countries have to be "welcoming" to all athletes and issue the proper visas timely. For instance, the World Cup right now.

Failure to do so could mean that a GP event may lose their event in a subsequent season.

In the short term, yes it could happen, but not in the long run.

 

[Jontor]

I don't know about the ISU but in general, in sporting federations, organizing countries have to be "welcoming" to all athletes and issue the proper visas timely. For instance, the World Cup right now.

Failure to do so could mean that a GP event may lose their event in a subsequent season.

In the short term, yes it could happen, but not in the long run.

But the ISU is not above the law. If a hosting country has regulations about visas, there is nothing the ISU can do about it. What the ISU can do is to pressure hosting federations to be "open" about visas, but that means that the local federation has to convince their government to change their regulations, which is unlikely.

I don't see that e.g. Finland would lose their GP hosting just because of their visa regulations. ISU just have to suck it up.

 

[4everchan]

But the ISU is not above the law. If a hosting country has regulations about visas, there is nothing the ISU can do about it. What the ISU can do is to pressure hosting federations to be "open" about visas, but that means that the local federation has to convince their government to change their regulations, which is unlikely.

I don't see that e.g. Finland would lose their GP hosting just because of their visa regulations. ISU just have to suck it up.

No. The ISU is not above the law. They cannot force a country to emit visas. However, if Finland wants to keep their GP, they will be told they need to issue visas to these athletes. Then Finland skating federation will need to discuss with their government. The latter will decide whether or not they want to keep their borders closed or if they value hosting sporting events. This will not be only a matter for figure skaters in a country like Finland. It will be a matter for all sports. So at one point, the government will receive pressure from all their sporting federations and will either accept they may lose their events or not granted new ones or will create exceptional visas for athletes. It's the same deal for a lot of countries when it comes to sporting events

 

[Artemisa]

But the ISU is not above the law. If a hosting country has regulations about visas, there is nothing the ISU can do about it. What the ISU can do is to pressure hosting federations to be "open" about visas, but that means that the local federation has to convince their government to change their regulations, which is unlikely.

I don't see that e.g. Finland would lose their GP hosting just because of their visa regulations. ISU just have to suck it up.

I'm not seeing most european countries denning a visa for sports .. gymnastics didn't have any problem or other sports .. and seeing where they will be held .. I doubt china, japan, france , swiss or even canada ... usa ( I don't think trump will buy this war for figure skating) .. Finland they have a exception for sports .. if the federation doesn't write the invitation for the competition .. they will have a big problem .. I don't think they want to buy that problem

 

[Kittosuni]

the ISU eligibility criteria for AIN athlete is pretty much the same as the one with IOC for the olympics so I guess it’s safe to say that Mishina/Galiamov, Valieva and Stepaniva/Bukin will also not get the neutral status.

So far only Petrosian, Gorbacheva, Gummenik, and Dikidzki have that IOC AIN approval. Rumored were the alternates Boikova/Kovlovzki and Kudai/Bazin(now split/retired) got the status but could not participate because the first choice M/G and S/B were denied. They can only replace them because of injury and not when they are found not eligible.

Im guessing Rusfed will submit everyone’s name for the ISU AIN approval even the atheletes that were found not eligible under the IOC AIN criteria.

 

[Lyyli]

AIN athletes are granted visas to Finland. For example, two AIN cross country skiers participated in Lahti World Cup last February. Tourist visas are not accepted.

 

[lariko]

Media: Russian junior test skates will take place 28 - 31 July determing JGP participants.

Open or closed?

 

[lariko]

the ISU eligibility criteria for AIN athlete is pretty much the same as the one with IOC for the olympics so I guess it’s safe to say that Mishina/Galiamov, Valieva and Stepaniva/Bukin will also not get the neutral status.

So far only Petrosian, Gorbacheva, Gummenik, and Dikidzki have that IOC AIN approval. Rumored were the alternates Boikova/Kovlovzki and Kudai/Bazin(now split/retired) got the status but could not participate because the first choice M/G and S/B were denied. They can only replace them because of injury and not when they are found not eligible.

Im guessing Rusfed will submit everyone’s name for the ISU AIN approval even the atheletes that were found not eligible under the IOC AIN criteria.

The problem with mass submission is that it could extend processing time. Unless they do AI check, not human audit of SM. I assume that these 4 have AIN. I hope we'll start hearing who gets cleared and for how long soon.

 

[Mathematician]

I think Visas could definitely be a problem. There are cases of teams/athletes getting cleared by the union but Visas being delayed too long for the athlete in question to compete. Curling for example just this year a couple athletes couldn't make worlds in Edmonton despite full clearance. Canada is very strict on this and I think Finland might be one of the strictest in the world. Now I would be surprised if Adeliia gets completely barred from Worlds or something but bureaucratically in general Visas can be a big problem especially for lesser known athletes trying to fly around for qualifications.

 

[DemTuppesSeine]

Didn't Sofia Samodelkina not get a second GP assignment last season because she had visa problems?

 

[cocteautwin]

Didn't Sofia Samodelkina not get a second GP assignment last season because she had visa problems?

She got assigment but it was last minute so it was probably too little time to get visa rather than other issues. And I think she already had Kazakhstani passport.

 

[brblja]

She got assigment but it was last minute so it was probably too little time to get visa rather than other issues. And I think she already had Kazakhstani passport.

Yes, there’s a big difference between ‘couldn’t get a visa’ and ‘couldn’t get a visa faster than even expedited process’. It remains to be seen how the visa issue shakes out, this will differ both by the hosting country and athlete.

And not to be a wet blanket, but re: Fed needs to put pressure on government - ISU is a relatively tiny sports fed, and we have a live example of how FIFA, one of the biggest of not the biggest sports federation, was not able to exert government pressure re: visas. ISU will never have leverage over local laws and political interests; it will entirely depend on the country’s general stance on visas for Russians.

 

[4everchan]

Yes, there’s a big difference between ‘couldn’t get a visa’ and ‘couldn’t get a visa faster than even expedited process’. It remains to be seen how the visa issue shakes out, this will differ both by the hosting country and athlete.

And not to be a wet blanket, but re: Fed needs to put pressure on government - ISU is a relatively tiny sports fed, and we have a live example of how FIFA, one of the biggest of not the biggest sports federation, was not able to exert government pressure re: visas. ISU will never have leverage over local laws and political interests; it will entirely depend on the country’s general stance on visas for Russians.

What do you mean by Fifa didn't have any leverage ? All the athletes have made it to the USA/CAN/MEX. I think I heard one referee from Somalia didn't manage to get in but the players all did.

 

[4everchan]

That is my interpretation. In theory, this means that there can be more than three AIN athletes at Worlds and Europeans. Being that there is supposed to be no affiliation with country, then this should also mean that skaters will not be selected by the country, as well.

This is not how it's been looking like in other sports. So no, sorry to break it to you but I don't expect more than one participant from each AIN per discipline at championships this year.

 

[ajingmarg]

That's the least attractive part of all this to me... It was sooooooo exhausting to see it, and I was going 'good riddance' when they were tossed to the side.

As for the rest of this conversation... As a simple example, I thought Gummenik was vastly overscored at the Olympics. I'm rather annoyed at what this means for scoring in all four disciplines, hereon. Their skating being rather unattractive even by well-into-the-CoP standards doesn't help matters at all.

The skaters I did enjoy - like Panfilova/Rylov - of course were set aside for their less talented teammates, or happily left to take care of themselves instead of bothering with their federation's bullshit.

How is he overscored in the FS considering all the falls of other men? He is underscored