Igor Shpilband fired

[Skater Boy]

time will heal wounds; let's just hope the wounds don't get "infected" I don't know what to make about what is conflict of interest or who to beleive or all this speculation even based on deductive thinking for what people allege are facts - Zueva being a bit of a witch with a capital B; Scott and |Meryl being driving forces in winning and strong personalities, Maia you and innocent, naive virgin type it's all a guess. I don't know what to believe other than Igor is gone.

 

[bekalc]

Who says that Igor's new students would be THAT much of a distraction/conflict of interest. It would depend on what kind of student Igor is taking on. Remember when Igor started out, he started out with nothing because nobody knew who he was. So he had all kinds of young teams he built from the ground up. Then as he developed a rep and his skaters started winning, more established ones came to him. Its possible that he misses those days of working with young skaters and wants to do so again. (Is he necessarily taking on people who are really going to take on someone who will compete with the top teams).

Zoueva never really had the built the skaters up from the ground she always worked with more established people who had their basics etc.

 

[nevergonnadance]

bekalc, what does who says have to do with it? He wasn't fired because of assumptions. He was fired because the rink said he wasn't there for them. Why not? Time conflict. It's not a who says, it's a what actually happened. The rink clearly has no problem with new students or his own business, which is pretty leniant of them. They have a problem with his new business affecting the training center business. The "conflict" was literal. It was a time conflict.

What Zoueva said was reported independently and corroborated by Shpilband himself, not through O'Neill, who only said they, he and the rink owner, had no issue with Shpilband taking on his extra students. I suppose they had no legal power in the coaches' business so they stayed away from it.

I don't get how you conclude they had no legal power in the coach's business. Taking on extra students is a separate issue from not being there for the priority skaters. One action (taking on extra students) doesn't have to lead to the other (not being there for the priority teams). That's why the rink said the students as such weren't the problem; it was Igor neglecting the top teams. Is it because he was more focused on his own business? Probably. But the rink said the students weren't the problem. Because, by itself, that's not. However, it is a problem if taking on your own students leads to dereliction of responsibility. It doesn't matter the reason - if you're derelict, you're derelict. However Igor came to neglect the top three, he was fired for that neglect. It was Marina who filled in the reason for his neglect, and, inadvertantly, Igor himself with his comments about having a lot of students. And some posters here who seem to think Igor and Marina have the same job so he can just let Marina do his job while he develops his own clientele on Arctic Edge's other rink.

They said their decision was based on the kids' interests and ultimatum. Charlie's mother denied this and claimed ego clash between the coaches and that the skaters were used as pawns.

nope. Charlie's mom was addressing another comment, not the reporter's article. The comment was bashing the skaters, calling them brats. She refuted that, saying it wasn't the skaters. Which it wasn't. The skaters shouldn't be called upon to mediate a coaching dispute. The skaters' job begins and ends with saying we're not happy with how things are, we need it fixed, we won't continue as is.

The skaters shouldn't be called upon to allow or defend a coach who isn't there for them anymore due to his own business. It appears to me that only Igor has attempted to use the skaters as pawns, by immediately saying he was going to call Meryl and Charlie. If he had been aware of the skaters' attitude early on, he might have appealed to them personally, and IMO they don't want that. They want things as they were, to train in a stable environment, not in a situation where everyone needs to adapt to Igor's side business. His side business isn't the problem - taking time away from the priority skaters is the problem, and, whether or not the poster realized it, expecting that since Marina is there, she can handle "their" business herself while he develops his own is not acting in good faith.

I think we would all be very naive to believe all three teams weren't completely aware of two things - there was a problem. And it could lead to firing Igor, but they left the decision to the rink and Marina. Their only contribution, despite how theatrical Arctic Edge was about it, was they weren't happy with how Igor was managing his availability and they would not continue with the status quo. It was also clear they weren't going to leave the rink if Igor were fired. If he were that important, the skaters wouldn't have said they couldn't work under existing conditions. I believe Arctic Edge wasn't lying at all. They just put it very harshly, not very p.c.

Both D/W and V/M HAVE spoken to the press. Why do we expect more than they have said already? How much has Yuna Kim discussed kicking Orser to the curb? The two teams were very gracious and also very explicit about turning the page. I don't think it's any coincidence the teams were unavailable when the firing happened. Do you know how many times an unpleasant task like that is performed and the boss or client or whomever is AWOL? It's no accident. They may sign off on it, but it's not their job to get in the middle of the drama. That's why the rink has an administration. That's what Marina is for too. Then like magic, the skaters return to the rink when Igor has cleared out.

 

[Dragonlady]

I don't think anything is clear in all of this other than Igor is gone from the Artic club and all three of the top teams are staying with Marina. Anything else is pure speculation.

 

[Violet Bliss]

nevergonnadance, the coaches' partnership agreement and their relationships with the skaters were not the business (figuratively and literally) of the club and the rink management. They did not have any authority to do anything about the conflicts and the rifts but they had the authority on their property so that's how they exercised their rights. They claimed the top skaters would leave if Igor stayed because that made a good business reason they could use to justify their action. They could not justify kicking out Igor because of his conflict of interest in his business. IOW, they could not kick him out because the skaters (and his partner) were unhappy with him but they could kick him out because the preferred customers would leave otherwise. There were careful legal considerations in what they said and claimed. They could also disallow him in the rink if he caused physical damages or disturbances and affected other users of rink but evidently he didn't do those things.

eta Even in claiming their non objection, they only brought up Shpilband's taking on students, on their premises which is their business, not about his business issues.

It's obvious everybody is living with the reality of what has happened and doing their best in the situation.

 

[Mathman]

Could the top skating teams have declined to renew their contract with Shpilband, continued with Zouyeva and perhaps also made arrangements with an additional coach if desired? Could the Arctic Edge then have allowed Shpilband to teach other students at the facility, perhaps concentrating on young developing teams, looking past 2014?

If we are looking at this strictly as a business decision, it seems like the Arctic Edge killed the goose that laid the golden eggs. (In any case, if the Arctic Edge is like most skating rinks in the U.S. they make their money off youth and adult hockey leagues, open recreational skating, learn to skate programs, birthday parties, and the like.)

 

[Violet Bliss]

I think there was an agreement, tacit or otherwise, among all parties except Shpilband - rink management, USFSA, Zoueva, and the skaters - that the quickest cleanest way to salvage the situation (possibly a toxic environment) so everybody could again focus on their career/business was to remove Shpilband. The nice way was probably alright or even preferable to some though it would be awkward and difficult for a while, with unpredictable outcome, but not to the rink management who now saw Shpilband as a strong competitor. Blindsiding him to prevent "poaching" and to delay his business building was what served their interests most. Since it was up to them to do the quick removal, they picked how it was done. Just my view of course.

If we are looking at this strictly as a business decision, it seems like the Arctic Edge killed the goose that laid the golden eggs. (In any case, if the Arctic Edge is like most skating rinks in the U.S. they make their money off youth and adult hockey leagues, open recreational skating, learn to skate programs, birthday parties, and the like.)

But the Arctic Edge Club is not any other club. They are building a legendary reputation they want to preserve and protect. They may look at that reputation as the goose for long term prosperity.

 

[heyang]

Considering that V/M and D/W will likely retire after the next Olympics, it seems that Igor would want to start working on some new teams to ramp them up for 2018!

Regardless, I hope that D/W and V/M aren't disrupted by this change. Some deal better with a shakeup vs others... and sometimes the change can be that 'kick' to get them to the next level. Hoping for the best for the 2 teams and for skating fans.

Note: I omitted S/S because I feel they are part of the 'next' generation.

 

[sillylionlove]

What I am wondering is who were the new teams that he wanted to take on? Also were they coaching any other teams besides the big three (V/M, S/S and D/W)? What are those teams doing?

 

[bekalc]

I think there was an agreement, tacit or otherwise, among all parties except Shpilband - rink management, USFSA, Zoueva, and the skaters - that the quickest cleanest way to salvage the situation (possibly a toxic environment) so everybody could again focus on their career/business was to remove Shpilband. The nice way was probably alright or even preferable to some though it would be awkward and difficult for a while, with unpredictable outcome, but not to the rink management who now saw Shpilband as a strong competitor. Blindsiding him to prevent "poaching" and to delay his business building was what served their interests most. Since it was up to them to do the quick removal, they picked how it was done. Just my view of course.




But the Arctic Edge Club is not any other club. They are building a legendary reputation they want to preserve and protect. They may look at that reputation as the goose for long term prosperity.

And how did Arctic Edge Club get that legendary reputation? Fact of the matter is they didn't build that school-Igor did. Igor was the technical genius behind that program and a very good choreographer too if you want to be quite frank. It would be like a club dumping Frank to keep Michelle or yes Lori.. Do you really think long term that's good for business. Michelle stopped skating years ago, and Frank coached a World Olympic champ after she left not to mention another Olympic medalist.

Its the coaches that produce the skaters not the name of the rink, but the coaches.

Once again who benefits long term Russia. Who happily see who long term the one to get behind-the technical person who created the program.

Good choreographers are great finds but technical coaches are rare. I can't help thinking of Kwan firing Frank in this mess. Its silly to think that the one who built that program over the years and created that program is the one who is expendable. And maybe Zoueva, the rink manager and company should have thought about who would take over Igor's job.....The fact that they are having a hard time finding one is telling.

Igor, on the other, apparently already has ice. And students will flock to him, because HE is the one one who has the reputation of building skaters from the ground up.

 

[Mattieu]

Igor, on the other, apparently already has ice. And students will flock to him, because HE is the one one who has the reputation of building skaters from the ground up.

I heard that he had many offers of ice immediately from other rinks in the area.
I am reliably informed he was teaching almost immediately and also that one visiting foreign skater was delighted they could have more of his time than they expected.

I have no doubt that he will be very successful, he is the man with the reputation, not Zoueva and I agree, skaters will flock to him.
I wouldn't be surprised at all if some of the Canton skaters defect to him once he is up and running, we shall have to wait and see.

 

[dorispulaski]

I had also heard that Igor had already found at least one rink & was in negotiations. I hope that is true.

It is true that it would be hard for me to commit to a coach, however good, if he had no rink, and even if I firmly expected him to get a rink, I would still want to see what the rink was, whether there were the gym, dance, and other facilities I would require available, and whether the commute would be too much of a killer.

Neither Chock/Bates nor Tobias/Stagniunas have said where they are going yet; they may be waiting to see. Both teams really need technical work, and the kind of help Igor can supply is most important to them, I would think.

It's also true that Igor does some interesting choreo-while not a crowd pleaser, D&W's Tango was his work, and there are great elements of surpise and interest in it. I also liked his Eleanor Rigby for D&W. Does anyone know whether Chock/Zuerlein's Caberet, and/or Chock/Bates's Chopin was primarily his or Marina's? I liked the construction of both those programs.

All the Canton teams list Igor & Marina as joint choreographers, so in less it pops up in an interview, it's hard to know who did what for whom.

 

[Dragonlady]

I think that all of this was timed to allow Igor the vacation period to organize new digs for his program.

I'm having a really hard time buying into any of the press releases. The stated reasons for Igor's firing make no sense to me. The obviously managed press releases emminating from the skaters/federations regarding the situation don't even sound like something the skaters would say. And then there's Jacqui White saying that's not what happened at all, the skaters had nothing to do with it. Everyone seems fine with the outcome.

And the most successful ice-dance program of the past ten years has just blown up.

 

[slipslidin]

Whoa! You mean the whole thing was orchestrated by Igor?

 

[Violet Bliss]

Sochi being so urgently important to the Russians, Shpilband could get set up very quickly if/since he has the Russian federation/$ backing him. He would have to have the Russian skaters as the priority though.

Whoa! You mean the whole thing was by Igor?

Interesting to see who is actually more prepared for the split, Zoueva or Shpilband? Neither seem to have overtly prepared for it prior to the actual (orchestrated forced) split.

 

[Mathman]

I'm having a really hard time buying into any of the press releases. The stated reasons for Igor's firing make no sense to me. The obviously managed press releases emminating from the skaters/federations regarding the situation don't even sound like something the skaters would say. And then there's Jacqui White saying that's not what happened at all, the skaters had nothing to do with it. Everyone seems fine with the outcome.

And the most successful ice-dance program of the past ten years has just blown up.

I agree with this post. Nothing that has been said makes sense. The management of the rink would surely make some some efort to work things out with all parties. The only thing that does make sense is what Blades of Passion wrote in post #3 on this thread. Money talks, you-know-what walks.

 

[let`s talk]

Always Russia! Bloody Russia!

We rule!


Are you seriously people saying that Canton, USFS and all other parties involved are so easy to be manipulated? Or that they so much poorer than the Russian offer? Oh wait... "That's not an expensive event," as Putin once said.
I don't mind actually.

 

[ice coverage]

Both D/W and V/M HAVE spoken to the press.

Providing quotes for press releases from USFSA and Skate Canada is not the same as speaking to the press. Not the same at all.
AFAIK, none of the skaters has spoken directly to any journalist. I believe the only "exception" is that when Barnas and the DFP were breaking the story, they reached Davis, who wisely had no comment.
Media outlets covering the Shpilband news have had to rely on the quotes from the skaters in the press releases.

That said, the skaters are perfectly entitled to keep quiet and are smart to do so. The whole situation must be very personal and painful to them, and discussing it with reporters will not change the outcome.

 

[Dragonlady]

Igor made it clear from the beginning he was staying in the area. I had no doubt he would have no difficulty in finding a situation for himself and his skaters.

It's lunacy to think this was orchestrated by the Russian federation, but I'm sure everyone there is absolutely joyous at the news. Think of what happened Morosov and Tarasova split up. Tarasova lost her iron grip on the World's Ice-Dance podium and neither was as sucessful apart as they were together. If Zueva's teams drop in their technical scores or becomes otherwise vulnerable, the Russian federation is well placed to take advantage, both in terms of talent and coaching.

 

[Mathman]

Always Russia! Bloody Russia!

We rule!

Are you seriously people saying that Canton, USFS and all other parties involved are so easy to be manipulated? Or that they so much poorer than the Russian offer? Oh wait... "That's not an expensive event," as Putin once said.

I don't mind actually.

Well, I gave my theory in post 281. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Actually, though, I think people would rather believe that the bad Russians shot us than that we shot ourselves.