Yes, indeed very similar. OK, I was tripping up a bit because I didn't think Michelle did a program to that music, but I following skating more casually -- watching it on tv when it was on mainly -- back in the 90s.
Carmen Overload
- Thread starter layman
- Start date
Yes, indeed very similar. OK, I was tripping up a bit because I didn't think Michelle did a program to that music, but I following skating more casually -- watching it on tv when it was on mainly -- back in the 90s.
- Joined
- Apr 19, 2011
There's no such thing as Carmen overload! ...its kinda like chocolate overload!! Bring on the Carmens!! Patrick Chan should skate to Carmen too. He's already got the pants from last years costume.
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2011
I'm in a different minority; I rather like to see common pieces of music interpreted by skaters, if they can do a good job with it and perhaps give it their own unique flair. As CAS put very well:
...for me overused music is only boring if the skater/s skating to it are boring
I like to see skaters using great music that is suitable for a figure skating program, and that they can really interpret and perform in a memorable way. Sometimes that's common skating music; sometimes it's unfamiliar music. Sasha Cohen used a lot of familiar skating music, but she did it very well, and I always liked to see what she'd do with it. If I think a skater's going to do a particularly good job with an "overused" piece of music, then I'm eager to see it.
Really the only time I complain about too many programs being done to a certain piece of music, is when I was bored by the music in the first place. And I'm far from bored with "Carmen."
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- Dec 16, 2006
At the competitions, they need to add a separate division: Carmen Interp
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- Jun 21, 2003
But Michelle's actual SP music in 1996, Romanza, did have a Carmenesque vibe to it.
Here she is, age 15. Olé!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1imuQWeIi4Q
Here she is, age 15. Olé!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1imuQWeIi4Q
All Carmen, all the time...that's what figure skating is becoming. The ISU might as well make Carmen mandatory compulsory music for all programs in all skatng divisions. It will be so much easier to compare apples with apples. Why not change the name of the sport from "Figure" skating to Carmen skating?
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- Jun 3, 2009
Oh, come on. We had one competition, and unfortunately we had three Carmens in one day. I get that it's tough to take given how used the music is. But we're getting seven Phantom of the Operas, which is like being bludgeoned to death with a fruitcake. At least Carmen is awesome music.
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
I think the music helps some of the ladies come out of their shell a bit, because they are forced to take on a familiar character to sell the program. I haven't seen a Carmen I've enjoyed as much as Witt's, although Michelle's Fate of Carmen SP comes close.
I guess I'm a fence sitter on this one. I love some of the "war horses" because I love the music. For example, I love, love, love Turandot especially Nessum Duram. I also love the Nutcracker. going to movies - I love the Mission so much it is ridiculous. So, I would miss these.
But I also love variety and range especially, of course, when done well. So, with Michelle - I found her skating to music that was (until later in her career) 'unique' and I loved that uniqueness - as I did, say, last year with Carolina Kostner, and correct me if I am wrong but Dai's choices (some were very familiar with Blues from gymnastics and 1990s ice dance, but I was not, and wasn't familiar with in the garden of souls). Or Jeremy's use of Muse - to me that was such an interesting choice. But back to 'overused' - Chan's Aranjuez - one of my all time favorite pieces ever, I absolutely adored his program, yet, didn't LOVE (as in over the top love, just little love) the particular cuts or version he chose.
Go figure (pun somewhat intended) - I think my point is, that besides intentionally fence sitting on this one, it's the particular version, the particular cuts, and perhaps even the particular choreography for each version taht makes me 'love' or 'hate' a war horse; love or hate something unfamiliar to me as well.
But I also love variety and range especially, of course, when done well. So, with Michelle - I found her skating to music that was (until later in her career) 'unique' and I loved that uniqueness - as I did, say, last year with Carolina Kostner, and correct me if I am wrong but Dai's choices (some were very familiar with Blues from gymnastics and 1990s ice dance, but I was not, and wasn't familiar with in the garden of souls). Or Jeremy's use of Muse - to me that was such an interesting choice. But back to 'overused' - Chan's Aranjuez - one of my all time favorite pieces ever, I absolutely adored his program, yet, didn't LOVE (as in over the top love, just little love) the particular cuts or version he chose.
Go figure (pun somewhat intended) - I think my point is, that besides intentionally fence sitting on this one, it's the particular version, the particular cuts, and perhaps even the particular choreography for each version taht makes me 'love' or 'hate' a war horse; love or hate something unfamiliar to me as well.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
Michelle's 1999 short program was utterly unique in that it did not use the music of Bizet at all. Lori Nichol pieced together material from the "Carmen Suite" by then-avant garde Russian composer Rodio Shchedrin, scored for strings and percussion (mainly percussion
); from the Carmen Fantasy, adapted by Nichol's favorite violinist, Nadia Salermo-Sonnenberg, from the score of the 1947 Joan Crawford movie Humoresque by Franz Waxman; and from the score of the 1983 movie "Carmen" which featured a dual story line of two modern people playing out the Carmen tragedy in real life. Michelle did not try to portray a character of tell a story at all. Unless the story was, awesome athlete tries to win national championship.
Perhaps she did some of the musical selections, but I know that Frank is a classical music buff and has an extensive musical library himself. Over the years, I spoke with him many times on his choices of music for Kwan and how he found them.
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- Nov 7, 2007
Some of Michelle Kwan's music choices under Carroll and Nichol have been AMAZING (e.g. blending together pieces from Gliere and Massenet in Dream of Desdemona), but what happened after? Evan Lysacek's programs under Carroll and Nichol have been nothing but an endless parade of figure skating's most over-used music, and a lot of Mirai's music when she was with Carroll has been less-than-inspiring as well.
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- Mar 23, 2010
I have no problem with Carmen as long as we keep getting the quality interpretation like Scott and Tessa's latest reincarnation. That despite the baggage of the most overused music ever, they still strives to be authentic, original and truthful to the essence of the music. To able to distinct itself as being a definitive version. Quite Brilliant!
Besides, this is figure skating. It is practically a rite of passage, so why break tradition
(Everything else is Judge's problem :sarcasm: Maybe if they should give GOE (grade on expectations) bonuses to award risks, -3 for terrible boring version, no difference on mute, + 3 for great I want to see it again version.)
Besides, this is figure skating. It is practically a rite of passage, so why break tradition
(Everything else is Judge's problem :sarcasm: Maybe if they should give GOE (grade on expectations) bonuses to award risks, -3 for terrible boring version, no difference on mute, + 3 for great I want to see it again version.)
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- Joined
- Feb 27, 2012
"Marina Zoueva, Virtue and Moir’s coach, saw this program as a way to coax a leading lady out of the shadows. In the past, commentary from judges suggested Moir, the 25-year-old from Ilderton, was so much more the visible partner."
http://www.lfpress.com/2012/10/28/sy...-image-is-gone
(Seemed relevant to repeat this quote from my post in the Ice dance and Carmen thread. Count me among the fans of Virtue/Moir's program.)
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2012
Carmen is powerful music but I am not sure other than a lot of blabbing that really C and L or V and M really have added much to the many adaptations of Carmen. I mean this is the second coming of the battle of the Carmens. (Witt v Thomas) And as many critics have said the best Carmen was not even Witt but Bestmianova or Krylova.
- Joined
- Jun 27, 2012
Yes, i agree. But it's a modern Carmen. I love V/M's Carmen. Everything changes. The most important thing is the passion in the Carmen. And they were able to show us that feelings, despite they had difficult choreography, and moviements.
For me, Carmen is totally overused piece.
That said, the music itself is very powerful and inspiring, so if you're going to skate to Carmen, you really have to know your stuff.
I liked C/L version, but LOVED V/M interpretation. Now I know it's still possible to do carmen that I really can enjoy.
But if you want to talk about modern take on carmen, this might be it :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTJECVd-GCM
That said, the music itself is very powerful and inspiring, so if you're going to skate to Carmen, you really have to know your stuff.
I liked C/L version, but LOVED V/M interpretation. Now I know it's still possible to do carmen that I really can enjoy.
But if you want to talk about modern take on carmen, this might be it
:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTJECVd-GCM
There are so many classical pieces of music that are skatable and yet dont get any attention and use.
Carmen is amazing opera. the music is so famous. I always think of Krylova&Ovssianikov free dance to be sure that there can always be something more to it but the well known storytelling. Same goes for their Waltz Masquerade. Very interesting interpretation with slow motion when the music gets more tempo.
Carmen is amazing opera. the music is so famous. I always think of Krylova&Ovssianikov free dance to be sure that there can always be something more to it but the well known storytelling. Same goes for their Waltz Masquerade. Very interesting interpretation with slow motion when the music gets more tempo.
A Fine Romance?
Virtue and Moir attempted a “new” interpretation of Carmen (an oxymoron).
I like the attempt at skating this warhorse in a modern, dare I say “voidy” way but to my eyes it falls flat both technically and artistically.
The lifts ended up looking awkward and borderline pornographic. There’s too much side by side skating, too many hand to hand holds, the dance spins look slow and labored, the gap between the two skaters looks much wider than ever before…technically it’s a step backward for Virtue and Moir who used to skate with so much more technical difficulty than we currently see in (this version of) Carmen.
I appreciate that they were going for something edgy and modern but the chemistry and connection between the two skaters seems greatly diminished in this Carmen program.
Carmen without romance, without passion, without fire or strong connection comes off looking…odd.
Truth be told, Carmen has never worked as an ice dance for me.
The Duchesnays did edgy and modern so, so, so much better (and they had the good sense to avoid Carmen completely).
