Mens event at Nationals.

Joesitz (RIP) · Jan 14, 2008

merrybari said:
At Nationals, is the skate order determined by draw for both the short and long programs?

With the change at ISU events I wonder if they had made a change here, too.

Let's review: The ISU order of skate in the SP seems to be based on their World Standings with the highest skating last. The Order of Skate for the LP is in accordance with the results of the SP, with the best SP score skating last.
Am I correct?

I believe the USFS is all powerful in running this Nationals so I am not certain how they will do it. Draw for the SP and follow the ISU system for the LP would suit me.

Joe

merrybari · Jan 14, 2008

Joesitz said:
Let's review: The ISU order of skate in the SP seems to be based on their World Standings with the highest skating last. The Order of Skate for the LP is in accordance with the results of the SP, with the best SP score skating last.
Am I correct?

I believe the USFS is all powerful in running this Nationals so I am not certain how they will do it. Draw for the SP and follow the ISU system for the LP would suit me.

Joe

That's the way I understand the ISU system.

Personally I think I prefer a draw for both at Nationals, but your suggested scenario sounds familiar from last year. Thanks.

Tinymavy15 · Jan 14, 2008

Eddie Lee said:
I believe that the race between Evan and Johnny hinges on the quad--Evan's quad--not Johnny's. Johnny knows that Evan is committed to attempt a quad in both programs. Evan has said so. Rather than attempting one himself, Johnny will hedge his bets on one or more failures on Evan's part rather than taking the risk of making a mistake on his own attempt at one. Johnny also knows that the intense pressure of Evan's defending his National championship, makes the odds of the latter's failure more likely. If Evan skates two clean programs with a quad, he wins! I hope Evan is successful. In doing so Evan will actually be doing Johnny a favor. Because it will finally convince Johnny that he will not have the future of his aspirations unless he steels up and perfects the quad. He'll face the liklihood that he may not gain another National title, and certainly not a World or Olympic gold.
(If Johnny doesn't get the message, his coach will. She's a savvy one--and Johnny's no slouch in that department either!)

:agree:

merrywidow · Jan 14, 2008

Are you all discounting Ryan Bradley being in the mix for a medal? He had better results than Abbott imo during the Grand Prix. At Skate America he scored 181.66 to Abbott's 171.06 at Skate Canada. Later in the season Bradley scored 191.32 at Bompard while Abbott's best was at NHK with a 187.56. Having said all that I do think that Carriere will be 3rd & Bradley & Abbott will battle for the 4th spot.

Joesitz (RIP) · Jan 14, 2008

merrywidow said:
Are you all discounting Ryan Bradley being in the mix for a medal? He had better results than Abbott imo during the Grand Prix. At Skate America he scored 181.66 to Abbott's 171.06 at Skate Canada. Later in the season Bradley scored 191.32 at Bompard while Abbott's best was at NHK with a 187.56. Having said all that I do think that Carriere will be 3rd & Bradley & Abbott will battle for the 4th spot.

Check out Rohene Ward's web site and click on video. It's amazing. My comments are on that page.

Joe

Vodka Shot · Jan 14, 2008

Johnny needs, has to, must go first. If his draw for LP is after Lysacek he's lost before the music starts. I don't know what kind of psychological strength Galina has instilled in Johnny, I can only hope it's at least enough so that if he has to skate last he won't implode.

I would think at his age that putting in a quad toe, and possible a quad salchow would be very difficult indeed if his body does not have the experience of performing one.

I think he's trained the quad in the past enough so that it's not completely unknown to his body. He was training it last season before nationals and has been putting it in his LP run throughs this season as well. Personally, I think it's probably good enough for him to put in competition, but stubbornness and fear keeps him from it.

Mathman · Jan 14, 2008

About skate order, IIRC part of the deal with NBC is that for the LP for the last group to skate, skaters 4-6 have a random draw for order and then skaters 1, 2 and 3 have a separate random draw for skate order for the last three spots. Is that right?

Joesitz (RIP) · Jan 14, 2008

Will someone bring a sign to this effect:

GOLDEN SKATE LOVES ROHENE WARD

Thank you

Joe

Tonichelle · Jan 14, 2008

but does all of GS love him? We don't want to misrepresent

jennylovskt · Jan 14, 2008

I agree that Johnny likes skate earlier than later. Wish him good luck to skate before Evan.

What was the skating order for 2004, 2005, and 2006 Nationals where Johnny had won? I am curious about it but didn't pay much attention at those times. I think Evan skated after Johnny in 2005, but at that time Evan wasn't the biggest rivalry for him.

Tonichelle · Jan 14, 2008

I want to say Johnny skated AFTER Evan in 06... but I can't be sure...

merrybari · Jan 14, 2008

IIRC - Evan skated last in '06.

taylorfax · Jan 14, 2008

jennylovskt said:
What was the skating order for 2004, 2005, and 2006 Nationals where Johnny had won?

Johnny skated last in 2004.

momjudi · Jan 14, 2008

I'm copying this from my dvds of the competition

2004 - skate order: Lysacek, Savoie, Bradley, Jahnke, Weiss, Weir

2005- skate order - Weiss, Savoie, Rogers, Goebel, Weir, Lysacek

2006 - skater order - Ward, Pennington, Smith, Bradley, Goebel, Savoie, Weir, Lysacek, Weiss

jennylovskt · Jan 14, 2008

momjudi said:
I'm copying this from my dvds of the competition

2004 - skate order: Lysacek, Savoie, Bradley, Jahnke, Weiss, Weir

2005- skate order - Weiss, Savoie, Rogers, Goebel, Weir, Lysacek

2006 - skater order - Ward, Pennington, Smith, Bradley, Goebel, Savoie, Weir, Lysacek, Weiss

Thank you so much, momjudi!

I have to say that Johnny did great with many strong competitors skated before him in those three years! In 2004, it was relatively easier than any other National competitions there after since no one expected him to win. In 2005, he did really great! Now I remembered that Weiss and Goebel made some mistakes before Johnny's skating. It might have boosted his confidence at the time. In 2006, he was able to maintain the title in a very little margin. He actually lost LP to Evan, and was in third in LP if I recalled it correctly.

Vodka Shot · Jan 14, 2008

If Lysacek hadn't busted A in his SP in 06' he may have won the title then. It's just speculation though.

merrybari · Jan 14, 2008

In 2006 Lysacek missed the title by .87 points. So by my humble reckoning, had he not fallen in his SP SlStS he would have won by not losing the -1 value of the fall deduction alone, never mind any -GOEs (That's all too confusing for me to figure out.)

Eddie Lee · Jan 15, 2008

Remember 2007 Spokane? Evan had that thunderous ovation after having skated an almost perfect FS program including an opening 4/3 combo. We sat in section 117 near the skaters' entrance to the ice. As Evan was finishing, I caught Johnny in the corner of my eye at the entrance boards. He was observing the last (at least) of Evan's FS and the standing ovation. That was not a good idea--for last year. But that was last year. It seems Johnny is a different skater and may weather this year's National's storm, his recent GP Final notwithstanding. But Johnny does have the wilt factor. He can cave in to pressure in spite of his glibness and bravado "front" on display for the press. (In itself, I think this puts undue pressure on him.) Even so, I wish him to skate his best. And likewise with Evan....It will make for a much finer Nationals, and a great springboard for World's.

Joesitz (RIP) · Jan 15, 2008

I hope you all are going to watch Rohene Ward who may just break up this rivalry we are talking about.

Also check out Adam Rippon in Junior Boys. He has a style similar to Weir's. However, working with Morozov may have changed that style. It was the style that made him special as his technical is just about above standard - not sensational.

Joe

merrybari · Jan 15, 2008

Has Rohene had any GP assignments? I feel like I'm missing something here.

To be honest, I've never paid much attention. He must be doing some pretty amazing things of late. I mostly remember him from last year's interview with Carruthers (tasteless microhone and all) when his mom surprised him there.

After all the promo here for him these past few days, I"ll be sure to watch carefully.

Mens event at Nationals.

Joesitz (RIP)

merrybari

Tinymavy15

Sinnerman for the win

merrywidow

Joesitz (RIP)

Vodka Shot

Mathman

Joesitz (RIP)

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll

jennylovskt

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll

merrybari

taylorfax

momjudi

jennylovskt

Vodka Shot

merrybari

Eddie Lee

Joesitz (RIP)

merrybari

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