Weaver and Poje not ‘placeholders’

gsk8 · Feb 13, 2015

Fresh off winning their first national title, Canadian ice dancers Kaitlyn Weaver and Andrew Poje recently competed at the 2015 ISU Four Continents Figure Skating Championships where they captured the gold. The last time they won gold was in 2010 after they had missed the Vancouver Games.

Although 2010 Olympic champions Tessa Virtue and Scott Moir are sitting out this season, Weaver and Poje are certainly not placeholders.

“In the past, we’ve always tried to get as close as we could to Tessa and Scott,” said Weaver. “Never really knowing when they would retire, we always want to be ready. All those years of always striving to be at the top has paid off. It’s very exciting.

The last time they won gold was in 2010 after they had missed the Vancouver Games.

“That was definitely at a different point in our career,” offered 27-year-old Poje. “We felt deflated. The Four Continents served as our turning point then, and it was our way to prove to ourselves that we wanted to fight and come back from that disappointment. We knew what we wanted from that point on. We are a different team from back then and now things have come full circle.”

What are your thoughts?

Mathman · Feb 13, 2015

Excellent and timely article. They're looking good heading into Worlds.

anyanka · Feb 13, 2015

They have been developing technically and artistically. This season's programs may not be as experimental as previous years, but they have come into their own. Congratulations on the 4CC win, they are looking great for Worlds. Thanks for sharing!

TontoK · Feb 13, 2015

As much as I'd love to see D/W and V/M return to competition, I really don't think it will happen. It seems like "we're taking a year off and will decide later" really means, "we're done." I think even if they are sincere when they say it, it would be really tough for skaters like V/M and D/W to return to competition... they've spent years in training for hours a day, and surely they are enjoying the break from all that. What's left to accomplish?

But, in another sense, I do think W/P... as well as C/B... are placeholders. They're the best out there currently (with the French) but memories of true greatness are too fresh to think the current state of ice dance is as good as it can get.

Someone will step up and reinvigorate the discipline. We're just marking time until they do. One man's opinion.

rosacotton · Feb 13, 2015

TontoK said:
As much as I'd love to see D/W and V/M return to competition, I really don't think it will happen. It seems like "we're taking a year off and will decide later" really means, "we're done." I think even if they are sincere when they say it, it would be really tough for skaters like V/M and D/W to return to competition... they've spent years in training for hours a day, and surely they are enjoying the break from all that. What's left to accomplish?

But, in another sense, I do think W/P... as well as C/B... are placeholders. They're the best out there currently (with the French) but memories of true greatness are too fresh to think the current state of ice dance is as good as it can get.

Someone will step up and reinvigorate the discipline. We're just marking time until they do. One man's opinion.

I agree with you. I think I've been quite spoiled by D/W and V/M and greatness they put out on the ice time and time again, that I feel the quality of ice dance has gone down a notch this season for me. As of right now, I don't see either W/P or C/B ever getting to the level of those two teams; I don't think they are going down in ice dance history, whereas the great rivalry between V/M and D/W will be remembered for a long time.

TontoK · Feb 13, 2015

The only team currently competing that I think has an excellent shot at being that good... eventually... is Hawayek and Baker. (I'm never sure if I'm spelling her name correctly) The bones are there for this team to really develop and grow into something spectacular... given 5 or 6 years.

Of course, one of the allures of this sport is that something special can happen without warning. Outrageous new talent can appear at any season. Or, reasonable talent can suddenly blossom and the pieces come together to make magic.

I'm reminded that John Curry was a bit of an also-ran before everything fell into place in 1976, and he became a legend.

peg · Feb 13, 2015

rosacotton said:
I agree with you. I think I've been quite spoiled by D/W and V/M and greatness they put out on the ice time and time again, that I feel the quality of ice dance has gone down a notch this season for me. As of right now, I don't see either W/P or C/B ever getting to the level of those two teams; I don't think they are going down in ice dance history, whereas the great rivalry between V/M and D/W will be remembered for a long time.

I think it's quite common for the first year or two of the new quad for there to be a bit of a drop in calibre. That said, for me, I'm not sure anyone can measure up to V/M. They made me start to enjoy ice dance and are my favorite team ever. To me, they are pure magic.

sses1 · Feb 13, 2015

They are placeholders. Nevermind the absence of V/M & D/W (teams W/P could never beat, which already gives you your answer), W/P are just a slghty above- average team. The teams younger than them still need to develop, even though many have already showed their potential, so that's why they're on top *for the moment*. I've been a fan of many of their programs but their skating isn't perfect and their presentation is almost always lacking something. I don't know if it will ever be possible for an old team to dominate ID again like back then because the sport is ultra competitive now and if you don't have it by 25 then you will get passed by the younger teams for sure.

GF2445 · Feb 13, 2015

Well it is important for Kaitlyn and Andrew that they can believe that they can achieve more and be more than placeholders until something better comes along.
Even if they are, for them to succumb to this can defeat them mentally.

All we want from them is their best.

Coltrocks12 · Feb 19, 2015

I think the fact that they had to "raise awareness" that they are not placeholders suggests the truth that they really are placeholders. While I don't think they are as meh as C/B they are not in the class set by the previous top of the pedestal (D/W & V/M) and even though they are improving I don't see them rising to the D/W V/M level at this time. The only current senior level team I have seen that kind of potential with is H/B though a lot can change with them since they are so young. Everybody loves the French team but they to me are on par with W/P and slightly better than C/B. We really were spoiled there for a while.

GF2445 · Feb 20, 2015

Being a placeholder- a very cruel reality. I feel sorry for them but there are people who are not sorry as well.
Very complex

TontoK · Feb 20, 2015

I guess you're right. Actually, I hope they win WC, if only because they were so close last year, and I think how hard it would be in later years to think back on how close they were.

And even while I pine away for V/M and D/W... they're not here this year. They probably will never be back. The door is open for new champions, and it looks like they'll take that opportunity. Who can blame them.

On the plus side: I'm not as disinterested in this event as I am the ladies. So, there is that bright spot.

rvi5 · Feb 20, 2015

I think we have been too spoiled by V/M and D/W. Look at the results of Worlds for the last quad (as if V/M and D/W did not exist)...

2014 = Cappellini/Lanotte, Weaver/Poje, Pechalat/Bourzat.
2013 = Bobrova/Soloviev, Cappellini/Lanotte, Weaver/Poje.
2012 = Pechalat/Bourzat, Weaver/Poje, Ilinykh/Katsalapov.
2011 = Shibutani/Shibutani, Pechalat/Bourzat, Weaver/Poje.

Can anyone say any couple would have clearly dominated that quad? If not, then wouldn't they all basically have been place holders?

How about the quads before? ...

2010 = Virtue/Moir, Davis/White, Faiella/Scali.
2009 = Domnina/Shabalin, Belbin/Agosto, Virtue/Moir.
2008 = Delobel/Schoenfelder, Virtue/Moir, Khoskhlova/Novitski.
2007 = Denkova/Staviski, Dubreuil/Lauzon, Belbin/Agosto.

2006 = Denkova/Staviski, Dubreuil/Lauzon, Belbin/Agosto.
2005 = Navka/Kosomarov, Belbin/Agosto, Ruslan/Goncharov.
2004 = Navka/Kostomarov, Denkova/Staviski, Winkler/Lohse.
2003 = Bourne/Kraatz, Lobacheva/Averbukh, Denkova/Staviski.

2002 = Lobacheva/Averbukh, Bourne/Kraatz, Chait/Sakhnovski.
2001 = Fusar-Poli/Margaglio, Anissina/Gwendal, Lobacheva/Averbukh.
2000 = Anissina/Peizerat, Fusar-Poli/Margaglio, Drobiazko/Vanagas.
1999 = Krylova/Ovsyannikov, Anissina/Peizerat, Bourne/Kraatz.

I think quad dominating teams like V/M and D/W are the rarity, making the majority of couples seem like "place holders" by comparison. In other words, with the retirement of V/M and D/W we are simply back to normal.

donezo · Feb 20, 2015

They may win this year, but in reality they are placeholders. Barring catastrophe, I think the French have the potential to dominate the rest of the quad. Weaver/Poje are quite good, but they're just never going to be that team. It doesn't help that they seem to be skating defensively and conservatively. I miss the passion and intensity of "Je suis malade" and "Maria de Buenos Aires." Those were great programs.

Jammers · Feb 20, 2015

The French team has the charisma and excitement that W/P lack plus they are a much younger team who in 3 years may still not even be at their peak.

Antilles · Feb 20, 2015

rvi5, up until 1998 it was almost always one team dominating for an entire quad. We only seemed to get new champions when someone retired. The only exception I can think of is the Duchesneys displacing K&P in 1991, but that order reverted to the norm in time for the 1992 Olympics. K&O might have continued that trend up until 2002, but injury forced them to retire mid-quad. I'm glad we've seen more movement since then.

rvi5 · Feb 20, 2015

I had not looked back further than the quads from the 2000's. Until V/M and D/W, there were no quad dominating team for about a decade. I wonder why the pattern change? It can't be the implementation of IJS, since that occurred later. It also does not appear to be the collapse of the Soviet Union, since that occurred earlier.

Sandpiper · Feb 20, 2015

Regardless of what the titles were, I don't think anyone considers A/P "placeholders." N/K were also a dominant team, for a few years.

Back to W/P: I hope they win that World title. Even if they won't be spoken of like V/M or D/W, they would make worthy World champions in the current field.

peg · Feb 21, 2015

rvi5 said:
I think we have been too spoiled by V/M and D/W. Look at the results of Worlds for the last quad (as if V/M and D/W did not exist)...

2014 = Cappellini/Lanotte, Weaver/Poje, Pechalat/Bourzat.
2013 = Bobrova/Soloviev, Cappellini/Lanotte, Weaver/Poje.
2012 = Pechalat/Bourzat, Weaver/Poje, Ilinykh/Katsalapov.
2011 = Shibutani/Shibutani, Pechalat/Bourzat, Weaver/Poje.

Sandpiper said:
Back to W/P: I hope they win that World title. Even if they won't be spoken of like V/M or D/W, they would make worthy World champions in the current field.

What's interesting in looking at results minus V/M and D/W is that W/P are the only tea who would have been on the podium every single year in that quad. So they're been very competitive over a number of years now. And I too hope they win Worlds this year. They may not be as magical as V/M, but as Sandpiper said, they would make very worthy World champions in the current field.

belladashwood · Feb 21, 2015

rvi5 said:
I think we have been too spoiled by V/M and D/W. Look at the results of Worlds for the last quad (as if V/M and D/W did not exist)...

2014 = Cappellini/Lanotte, Weaver/Poje, Pechalat/Bourzat.
2013 = Bobrova/Soloviev, Cappellini/Lanotte, Weaver/Poje.
2012 = Pechalat/Bourzat, Weaver/Poje, Ilinykh/Katsalapov.
2011 = Shibutani/Shibutani, Pechalat/Bourzat, Weaver/Poje.

Can anyone say any couple would have clearly dominated that quad?
If not, then wouldn't they all basically have been place holders?

How about the quads before? ...

2010 = Virtue/Moir, Faiella/Scali, Pechalat/Bourzat.
2009 = Domnina/Shabalin, Belbin/Agosto, Virtue/Moir.
2008 = Delobel/Schoenfelder, Virtue/Moir, Khoskhlova/Novitski.
2007 = Denkova/Staviski, Dubreuil/Lauzon, Belbin/Agosto.

2006 = Denkova/Staviski, Dubreuil/Lauzon, Belbin/Agosto.
2005 = Navka/Kosomarov, Belbin/Agosto, Ruslan/Goncharov.
2004 = Navka/Kostomarov, Denkova/Staviski, Winkler/Lohse.
2003 = Bourne/Kraatz, Lobacheva/Averbukh, Denkova/Staviski.

2002 = Lobacheva/Averbukh, Bourne/Kraatz, Chait/Sakhnovski.
2001 = Fusar-Poli/Margaglio, Anissina/Gwendal, Lobacheva/Averbukh.
2000 = Anissina/Peizerat, Fusar-Poli/Margaglio, Drobiazko/Vanagas.
1999 = Krylova/Ovsyannikov, Anissina/Peizerat, Bourne/Kraatz.

I think quad dominating teams like V/M and D/W are the rarity, making the majority of couples seem like "place holders" by comparison.
In other words, with the retirement of V/M and D/W we are simply back to normal.

Ummm, you left out Davis & White winning the silver at 2010 World championships following the Vancouver Olympics.

It should be this: 2010 = Virtue/Moir, Davis/White, Faiella/Scali.

Weaver and Poje not ‘placeholders’

gsk8

Mathman

anyanka

TontoK

Hot Tonto

rosacotton

TontoK

Hot Tonto

peg

sses1

GF2445

Coltrocks12

GF2445

TontoK

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rvi5

donezo

Jammers

Antilles

rvi5

Sandpiper

peg

belladashwood

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