2016 Team Challenge Cup - Gen Info/Pre-chat

[Li'Kitsu]

I wouldn't want Yuzu to decline either if he didn't have that big Ice Show schedule coming up not that long behind... and while there is obviously nobody sitting there with a gun to his head forcing him to do those, I'm pretty sure he feels obligated and the JSF sees nothing but the big fat $$$'s it brings... he really doesn't get a lot of rest.

 

[ice coverage]

Full details of the Team Challenge Cup.

Thx to TGS for posting the full announcement. I have added the link to the OP.

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Unless Australia is part of Team North America. Really they could go either way... and i almost think they should be allowed to play both sides until that becomes an issue.

As TGS previously quoted from the announcement, "Team North America will consist of Skaters of ISU Members from Canada and the United States."

I hope Australian skaters are eligible to compete in general, but doesn't seem as if Team North America is an option for them.

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But can the skaters decline? ...

Skaters are allowed to decline -- as indicated in the announcement, which has lots of language about who will get invited next if skaters who are invited first (either b/c of ISU World Standings or b/c of fan voting) decline.

 

[shiroKJ]

Thanks Golden for the info. So the fact that skaters can decline will change things.. which I reckon a few of the top skaters will.

 

[ice coverage]

So they changed their scoring format. ...

I don't see how the TCC scoring format has changed from when it was originally announced??

This Sep 23 post quoted a summary of the scoring format.

http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sh...ent-in-2016)&p=1225858&viewfull=1#post1225858​

Unless I am missing something, it looks to be the same as what is described (at greater length) in the announcement posted by TheGrandSophy.

 

[Pamigena]

Can somebody use really simple words and explain to me how those "invitations" work here and how skaters are "forced" to participate at WTT? :roll9: I still have no idea how those team events work exactly........

 

[alia jackson]

I don't think he is so delicate, special and fragile that he can't skate one more competition...no moreso than any of the rest of the athletes.

I wouldn't want Yuzu to decline either if he didn't have that big Ice Show schedule coming up not that long behind... and while there is obviously nobody sitting there with a gun to his head forcing him to do those, I'm pretty sure he feels obligated and the JSF sees nothing but the big fat $$$'s it brings... he really doesn't get a lot of rest.

The issue is people want him to be in everything...4CC, Team Challenge, ice shows, commercials, events etc. . Among the male skaters Yuzu has the most packed schedules and it is not just the competitions, it is the ice shows/events/shootings and what not.

Oct 12-15 Autumn Classic
Oct 30- Nov 1 Skate Canada
Nov 27-29 NHK Trophy
Dec 10-13 GPF
Dec 24-27 Jpn Nationals
Jan 9 NHK Exhibition ice shows
Jan 16-17 New Year on Ice shows
Feb 16-21 4CC Taipei
Mar 28 - Apr 3 Worlds
Apr 22-24 Team Challenge
May to Sept : 20-40 ice shows, commercial/magazine shootings, events for lotte/red cross/24hr charity/phiten/etc, tv interviews and training.
Oct: new season starts

 

[shiroKJ]

I don't see how the TCC scoring format has changed from when it was originally announced??

This Sep 23 post quoted a summary of the scoring format.

http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sh...ent-in-2016)&p=1225858&viewfull=1#post1225858​

Unless I am missing something, it looks to be the same as what is described (at greater length) in the announcement posted by TheGrandSophy.

I thought the entire event was going to be based on cumulative IJS scores, but it seems like they're going by ranking system now like WTT? I'm reading the rules on my phone so maybe I'm getting confused lol.

 

[Sugarpova]

Deniss could be nominated! I don't think Daniel Samohin will go to sr. Worlds...but maybe Adian will. I'd vote for him or Deniss (although I've never seen Deniss live so I'd probably vote for him, plus it'd be nice to have more variety of countries). Florent won't be an option any more if he retires before Worlds. Chafik though...& I assume Ivan will be nominated? I like all these guys, but Deniss! Deniss! Deniss!

aw Im all for Dani & Deniss ya know that Im also a huge fan! But how actually popular are they - juniours. Btw last year's Bychenko could have actually a chance too!

Yeah Chafik can be a good candidate! Oh & Ivan our Gypsy king also. If only he had better results
Haha maybe like JO they can invite retired skaters? SO Brian or Strephane can go via fanvote!:luv17:
It can actually be very profitable for the event to have fanvote include the retired ones & someone like Yuna can participate & bring the ppl & $$$$!
I know its not in the rules its just my wishful thinking

Btw Elladj is super entertaining. I'd vote for him for the NA team

 

[ice coverage]

Can somebody use really simple words and explain to me how those "invitations" work here and how skaters are "forced" to participate at WTT? :roll9: I still have no idea how those team events work exactly........

The official TCC language is very straightforward and easy to understand. See the section on "Skater Selection" on the third page of the official announcement.

I encourage you to look up the old WTT announcements if you would like to see the contrast in language. Clearly a higher expectation that skaters who meet the WTT criteria will compete.

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I thought the entire event was going to be based on cumulative IJS scores, but it seems like they're going by ranking system now like WTT? I'm reading the rules on my phone so maybe I'm getting confused lol.

My understanding is:

SPs based on ranking points.
Free skates and FD based on IJS scores.​

 

[shiroKJ]

My understanding is:

SPs based on ranking points.
Free skates and FD based on IJS scores.​

That...is odd. It's like they put the rules for Japan Open and WTT together and got TCC.

 

[Pamigena]

I encourage you to look up the old WTT announcements if you would like to see the contrast in language. Clearly a higher expectation that skaters who meet the WTT criteria will compete.

I have no idea where to find or how to read stuff like that. I tried to figure out WTT with google, but didn't find anything that said "you have to, or else...". And that's what it always sounds like when I read about it on the forum.

 

[shyne]

That...is odd. It's like they put the rules for Japan Open and WTT together and got TCC.

It's just like that~ a fusion of Japan Open and WTT =TCC

 

[ice coverage]

That...is odd. It's like they put the rules for Japan Open and WTT together and got TCC.

For better or worse, I would say that the TCC SPs (only for men and ladies) on Friday are almost a separate comp from the TCC free skates and FD on Saturday.
The SP ranking/scores from Friday do not carry over to Saturday. Separate prize money for the SPs.

The SP portion of TCC seems to have quite a novel format:

Day #1 - Friday, April 22 – Men’s and Ladies Singles –Short Program Competition

o Each Team will decide their entries in order of #1-#3 and submit them in closed envelopes
o A “live” ceremony/event will announce the skating match-ups on Thursday, April 23 [typo for April 21, presumably]
o Skaters #1-3 will skate (3 teams) earning points in their flight for their team; Skaters will earn points for first, second or third (i.e. 12, 10, 8 points)
o Three warm up groups, Men and Ladies will be mixed

 - Warm up Group I (#3 slotted Ladies and Men)
 - Warm up Group 2 (#2 slotted Ladies and Men)
 - Warm up Group 3 (#1 slotted Ladies and Men)​

Mixed warm up groups of Men and Ladies sound fun .​

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I have no idea where to find or how to read stuff like that. I tried to figure out WTT with google, but didn't find anything that said "you have to, or else...". And that's what it always sounds like when I read about it on the forum.

I'm not going to find the exact passages for you, but click on the link below for 2015 WTT. Then open the Announcement to read the official language -- which is quite different from the TCC language.

http://www.isu.org/en/single-and-pa...-of-events/2015/04/isu-world-team-trophy-2015​

 

[MaxSwagg]

With all due respect, Yuzu is a big boy and can take care of himself. He actually has the power, not JSF. If he declines things, what are they going to do? "Off" their top guy? Don't think so.

 

[karne]

Hmm, not sure about that. The announcement says:



and Australia is not in Asia. So unless there is a specific allowance that I cannot see....

How rude. We're not included by any calculation. What a bunch of big-country-centric jerks.

What a joke it is that Paris and Matthew wouldn't get a gig but some North Korean pair who have competed internationally all of once would.

Unless Australia is part of Team North America. Really they could go either way... and i almost think they should be allowed to play both sides until that becomes an issue.

Why on earth would we be a part of Team North America? We're nowhere near North America.

The Australian soccer team participate in Asian Cup， I think it's because their football association is registered with the Asian countries.
There's rumors that Australia would participate in future Asian games, but I don't know how true is it.

Erk, that would be just one set of Games too many, IMO, since Australia does Commonwealth Games as well. Yes, the Socceroos won the Asian Cup. We should be included as part of Team Asia for the purposes of this event, but it's not like it'd make a difference, since this event is just another big-country love-fest and as if Brendan, or Brooklee, or Kailani would defeat Hanyu, Uno, Asada, whatever for the popular vote.

But here is the real question.... if the fan vote for NA includes both Max Aaron and and Brendan Kerry... who will karne support?

I would run around exploding for a bit then figure out a way to vote for both.

I really hope they can do something for Misha. His season was cut short due to Visa issues and I would love to see him finish on a high note.

Ge's season has NOT been cut short due to Visa issues. He will still be at Four Continents and Worlds, presumably. And there's nothing to preclude him skating in more Senior Bs, either!

 

[mrrice]

Ge's season has NOT been cut short due to Visa issues. He will still be at Four Continents and Worlds, presumably. And there's nothing to preclude him skating in more Senior Bs, either!

Thank you for that information, Karne. I look forward to seeing him.

 

[StitchMonkey]

With all due respect, Yuzu is a big boy and can take care of himself. He actually has the power, not JSF. If he declines things, what are they going to do? "Off" their top guy? Don't think so.

I think the ISU could still suspend him. Likewise he could be in trouble with them if he participates in unauthorized shows. He could likely retire thought at this point and have that not matter, but I think he wants to keep.... doing what he is doing.

Why on earth would we be a part of Team North America? We're nowhere near North America.

.... because you are one of the cool countries and maybe North America wants to claim you for our own?

I think a lot of people feel in America have a soft spot for Australia, for lack of a better way to put it, they are a country that would get picked first. I also think they would be great in the Kiss and Cry together... i mean our colors do match... mostly.

Team "North America" is a bit silly only having arguably only two countries... ( I see debate often if Mexico is North or Central America.... can we leave it as debatable rather than debate it) why they did not at least do "Team Americas" I have no idea...at least imply we have a chance to include maybe Brazil. Id like to see "Team North America" expanded to have more countries and Australia seemed like one that maybe we would all get along and enjoy being together. It also might give them a better chance of getting choose. I actually think Brendan Kerry could potentially win the fan vote if he was on the team North America ballot... a lot of fans really do like seeing skating expanded. He would have a much better chance here than in team Asia i suspect. Though now the Dodds may have a better chance in pairs so who the heck knows.

I don't think many people really think of Australia/much of Oceania as Asian so it just comes down to how you want to divide stuff up. Forgive me, but Australia is kinda far from most figure skating. Personally id like to see more skaters have a chance to be seen, so i would like to see these skaters been seen. I would be fine with giving them a choice as it is good for the sport and who really cares if for the first few years there is some experimentation as to where they most synergisticly fit in.

And it is not like i was suggesting it for a league.... rather for a one time event where everyone travels to the same location anyway. I guess i don't see the big deal. Then again if they wanted to randomly assign countries for the event, id like be pretty fine with that too. I think it would be fun to be with the Japanese one year and the Russians the next.

 

[shiroKJ]

I think the ISU could still suspend him. Likewise he could be in trouble with them if he participates in unauthorized shows. He could likely retire thought at this point and have that not matter, but I think he wants to keep.... doing what he is doing.

Why would they suspend skaters when they are allowing them the option to decline?

 

[StitchMonkey]

Why would they suspend skaters when they are allowing them the option to decline?

did we confirm that they are allowing???? I thought that was still being talked about. North Korea... is not the same - they don't exactly have ongoing presences in sports... they come and go. I don't know if there are any countries where skaters have less say in the matter, it is just not a sleeping bear you want to poke. Honestly I am happy that they got to compete at all this year and hope relations allow it to continue.

I was talking in broader terms that while I do agree Yzuru has power, he does still have rules he needs to follow.

Basically they don't want top skater skipping comps to get paid in shows as that can cause issues for the sport. It is a long and convoluted issues that honestly I don't know i understand well enough to want to say much on.

 

[shiroKJ]

did we confirm that they are allowing???? I thought that was still being talked about. North Korea... is not the same - they don't exactly have ongoing presences in sports... they come and go. I don't know if there are any countries where skaters have less say in the matter, it is just not a sleeping bear you want to poke. Honestly I am happy that they got to compete at all this year and hope relations allow it to continue.

I was talking in broader terms that while I do agree Yzuru has power, he does still have rules he needs to follow.

Basically they don't want top skater skipping comps to get paid in shows as that can cause issues for the sport. It is a long and convoluted issues that honestly I don't know i understand well enough to want to say much on.

"Invitations will be sent by U.S. Figure Skating to the relevant ISU Member. Those invited on January 1, 2016 will have until February 10, 2016 to accept the invitation. If an invited entry declines the invitation, the ISU World Standings of January 1, 2016 will be used to invite the next highest ranked Skater. Invitations will continue in the same manner until each Team completes their first eight (8) entries."

Sounds like its allowed. Of course every skater has to follow ISU rules, but its a (unfortunate?) reality that some skaters have more say in their participation in specific events than others. (ex. Top Russian pairs) and it works the other way around too. Some top skaters are obliged to attend shows/events due to their status even if they're not willing hwell: