Gracie was never going to be a great artistic skater she wasn't really musical but she skated big and had big jumps in her prime and speed and power. When she won US Juniors in 2012 she was so superior compared to the other girls just because of her technical abilities which were already senior level and she probably already had more technical ability then all the Senior US girls at the time and she probably would have easily finished top 3 that year even with skating very junior programs and low PCS.
2017-18 State of U.S. Ladies Skating
- Thread starter R.D.
- Start date
Gracie was never going to be a great artistic skater she wasn't really musical but she skated big and had big jumps in her prime and speed and power. When she won US Juniors in 2012 she was so superior compared to the other girls just because of her technical abilities which were already senior level and she probably already had more technical ability then all the Senior US girls at the time and she probably would have easily finished top 3 that year even with skating very junior programs and low PCS.
Precisely, now you have it...
But let’s not lose sight of the bigger picture - that both Wagner AND Nagasu fall short of that ideal...and (barring major changes) therefore seem more or less interchangeable...
In any case, we’ll know next week(!).
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2014
True.....You know who else was a great Junior talent but hasn't gone as far as Gracie yet.....Angela Wang. She was fast, smooth, and had beautiful posture and big jumps when I saw her live as a Junior. I will be cheering as loudly as I possibly can for her this year...
That is where US skating is now. 183 is a respectable score nationally. Internationally, it's nowhere! It's not competitive.
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2014
Bradie broke 200 and earned herself a Bronze in a field that did not include all of the top ladies. 200 might get them in the top 6 but it doesn't secure a medal.
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2014
In a good year at Nationals you would hope to have all the medalists finish between 190 and 210. With Bradie breaking 200 at Skate America, I'm hoping the rest of the field steps it up at Nationals since they know what she's capable of. I hope Bradie stays at this level for the remainder of the year. She's still quite young and for her to make the team would be a huge accomplishment. Last year, both Karen and Ashley broke 200 and Mariah Bell took the bronze with a 197.....Those are great scores and we can only hope the ladies are able bring it this year...
Unfortunately, I don't see any of the US Ladies medaling in Korea. I'm hard pressed to see one of them in the final flight.
- Joined
- Sep 23, 2017
While 185-200 is a very respectable score, watching Japanese and Russian Nats it really seems like the US ladies (minus Bradie if she can be consistent) are really lagging behind this season. I don't think any of then can really hope to medal in Korea when you have Miyahara (214), Medvedeva (231), Zagitova (223), Sakamoto (210), Kostner (215), Osmond (217) and Sotskova (216). Unless one of them really manages to break through.
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2014
^^^Looking at last years scores the Gold and Silver Medalists both broke 200 and bronze medalist Mariah Bell had 197. Those are great scores in any country. Of course, you can't forget about the Nationals Boost to scores.....Karen scored 199 when she went to Worlds and won her Pewter Medal.
Making the US Olympic Team is a huge accomplishment for anyone, regardless of age.
I believe Bradie is 19 so that is not young for a top figure skater. Med is 19, the rest of the Russian ladies are younger. Both Japanese ladies on the Olympic Team are under 20. Gabby Daleman is 19 (Katelyn is 22). Caroline K and Ashley are the exceptions (25+) certainly not the norm.
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2016
US top seniors tend to be older than top Russian and Japanese seniors. I don’t think age really matters if you can do what’s required. Bradie can break 200 internationally and her age doesn’t matter.
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2014
That's true. How old were Tara and Oksana when they won their OGM's ?? They were babies and so was Sarah Hughes!! Tara was 15......Sarah was 16.....Oksana was just 16 as well.
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2007
There's are also some very fine Japanese ladies in need of an Olympic spot..win-win for both nations!
True but historically US lady Olympic team members have still been pretty young. In 2014, Ashley was 22 but Polina was 15 and Gracie was 17 (I think). In 2010, both Racheal and Mirai were in high school.
My guess that is about to change.
What we forget about the Russian ladies is that they tend to mature later in their teens. They become stars early but many fade away and disappear. Where are the two Russian stars of the 2014 Olympics? They've already peaked and faded away. Elena Radionova was too young for the 2014 Olympics, but she was already a big star even then. Now she has grown and matured, but her star has been eclipsed by the many young rising stars of Russia and her time is over.
Medvedeva and Sotskova seem to be the exception, Evgenia because of her consistency, and Maria because of her ability to handle her growth over the years combined with technical consistency.
We should also remember that these young ladies start training and competing intensively from the time they are about eight years old, year in and year out, for about ten months out of a year. It is no wonder that after about ten years of such a regimen, some suffer from injuries (Pogorilaya). Some may be dropped by their elite coaches if the puberty bug curtails their ability to do the most competitive technical moves.
Medvedeva and Sotskova seem to be the exception, Evgenia because of her consistency, and Maria because of her ability to handle her growth over the years combined with technical consistency.
We should also remember that these young ladies start training and competing intensively from the time they are about eight years old, year in and year out, for about ten months out of a year. It is no wonder that after about ten years of such a regimen, some suffer from injuries (Pogorilaya). Some may be dropped by their elite coaches if the puberty bug curtails their ability to do the most competitive technical moves.
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2017
Off topic, but Medvedeva is only 18...
Of course, that just furthers your point. I think Bradie has a huge chance at the team if she can stay calm and not let the pressure to lead the US ladies get to her.
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2013
Good luck to the U.S. ladies next week. I would love to see them "bring it" to Nationals! This would make for exciting times at both the Olympics and Worlds, for North American women.
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2017
the ladies are more seasoned jumping up from juniors.
Now there is an age limit of 15 years. Before no age limit.
Sonya henie i think was 11 when she competed in 1st olympics and 1st world
Cecile College i think was 10 years of age when competed in 1st worlds, olympics.
Peggy, Tenley, Dorothy- i think was 19 years of age when won and even younger when won 1st world medal or title.
Peggy was 15 when won her 1st national title.
Annette potsch and linda was 19 years of age when won/medaled at olympics. linda 16 when won her 1stworld title
i think elaine zayak was 16 years of age when won her world title
yuka sato was 18 years of age.
Carol I think was 20 years of age, Kristi was 20 also i think.
Tara-was 15 when won but a senior seasoned veteran of 2 years however 2 years on junior skating.
Sarah was 16 when won but a senior seasoned veteran of 3 -4 years. she was 13 when she skated in her 1st worlds
Michelle was 13 years of age when competed in 1st world, took too long to win 1st world title at age 15.
Tara was 15 years of age retire due to hip at 16 years of age (injury) yet no one thought if michelle was injured actually called her foot injury for not competing in 1997-1998 fake, false (made up).
now the code of points and the age rules of 15
.
the junior grand prix series, challenges, level b's allow the skaters to be seasoned veterans by the time they jump up to senior level. (scores is exactly the same-they just don't have to do as many jumps)
it isn't age but the veteran (seasoned) -how many times they competed against other skaters outside of their own country-region.
the russian, japanese mature earlier due to their seasoned status as a junior, novice competitions.
the only skaters who i know that was season juniors under code of points is ashley, mirai, caroline, (competed more than 1 competition) before skating senior (ages 13-17)
polina edmunds skated 1 went to nationals worlds, olympics she was 15 years of age
starr andrews competed in 1st internatonal competition at age 15 junior worlds, skated in 1 competition at junior grand prix. now jumped up to senior.
If i am not mistaken adelina, elizaveta, evgenia, alina competed on the junior grand prix circuit 1-2 years -2-4 competitons even possible the level b's at what 13-15 years of age
they are season veterans of skating when jump up. U.S. not so much and they are older also
Now there is an age limit of 15 years. Before no age limit.
Sonya henie i think was 11 when she competed in 1st olympics and 1st world
Cecile College i think was 10 years of age when competed in 1st worlds, olympics.
Peggy, Tenley, Dorothy- i think was 19 years of age when won and even younger when won 1st world medal or title.
Peggy was 15 when won her 1st national title.
Annette potsch and linda was 19 years of age when won/medaled at olympics. linda 16 when won her 1stworld title
i think elaine zayak was 16 years of age when won her world title
yuka sato was 18 years of age.
Carol I think was 20 years of age, Kristi was 20 also i think.
Tara-was 15 when won but a senior seasoned veteran of 2 years however 2 years on junior skating.
Sarah was 16 when won but a senior seasoned veteran of 3 -4 years. she was 13 when she skated in her 1st worlds
Michelle was 13 years of age when competed in 1st world, took too long to win 1st world title at age 15.
Tara was 15 years of age retire due to hip at 16 years of age (injury) yet no one thought if michelle was injured actually called her foot injury for not competing in 1997-1998 fake, false (made up).
now the code of points and the age rules of 15
.
the junior grand prix series, challenges, level b's allow the skaters to be seasoned veterans by the time they jump up to senior level. (scores is exactly the same-they just don't have to do as many jumps)
it isn't age but the veteran (seasoned) -how many times they competed against other skaters outside of their own country-region.
the russian, japanese mature earlier due to their seasoned status as a junior, novice competitions.
the only skaters who i know that was season juniors under code of points is ashley, mirai, caroline, (competed more than 1 competition) before skating senior (ages 13-17)
polina edmunds skated 1 went to nationals worlds, olympics she was 15 years of age
starr andrews competed in 1st internatonal competition at age 15 junior worlds, skated in 1 competition at junior grand prix. now jumped up to senior.
If i am not mistaken adelina, elizaveta, evgenia, alina competed on the junior grand prix circuit 1-2 years -2-4 competitons even possible the level b's at what 13-15 years of age
they are season veterans of skating when jump up. U.S. not so much and they are older also
