2018-19 Russian Ladies' figure skating

[Spirals for Miles]

it's so weird when people who don't know a skater personally use diminutives...

Wait, so I shouldn't say Zhenya instead of Evgenia? Or Sasha instead of Alexandra? or is that okay?
EDUCATE ME!!

 

[Spirals for Miles]

It's ok, but just feels strange sometimes In some cases it just might sound like someone knows a person personally, like they're relatives or close. May be it's just me though



btw do people usually use diminutives in US/Canada when talking about someone they don't know personally? just curious

Yes, if they've espoused that they go by it, like Bill Gates. But I wouldn't greet a stranger whose name is William with "Hi Will!"

 

[moriel]

Well, I am impressed that it took only two girls to get the ISU change the rules (or even just one if we count only full backloading). Evgenia started the trend with doing most of the jumps in the 2nd half and Alina took it further by performing them all at the end of the programme. I think that the main reason for changing the bonus thing would be the fact that those two girls get 20+ points above everyone and they just try to make the gap between them and other top skaters smaller.



Evgenia -> Zhenya
Elena -> Lenok/Lena
Daria -> Dasha
Dimitri -> Dima
Mikhail -> Misha

As far as I know those are not literally diminutives but just shorter versions of their real names (nicknames?) and anyone can call them like that. For a comparison, the diminutive of Evgenia would be Zhenechka (like Alina -> Alinka).

Overall, i would also put Lenok together with the Alinka and Zhenechka.

There are some common form nicknames which may or may not coincide with what close people call a person.
For example, my name is Tatyana. The nickname for that is Tanya, and I´m fine with random people calling me that. My family also calls me Tanya.
But overall, I would be quite uncomfortable if some random unrelated person would call me Tanechka or Tanyusha.

I think it is fine to call skaters by the nickname, such as Zhenya, Lena, Dasha and so on.
But i think we only should use different forms, such as Zhenechka or Alinka if skaters made clear they are fine with it (for example, when they use it as instagram nickname or something). It is not bad or disrespectful, but its just a bit weird.

 

[Spirals for Miles]

Is Alenka bad?
It's in her IG name...

 

[Kirpich]

Is Alenka bad?
It's in her IG name...

This all is just a pointless conversation.. It's okay, cause it's not the same as if you called her this way personally.

 

[russianfan]

Wait, so I shouldn't say Zhenya instead of Evgenia? Or Sasha instead of Alexandra? or is that okay?
EDUCATE ME!!

Zhenya, Sasha, Nastya are all just short versions. Some names like Alina dont have a short version, being short enough I was talking only about some diminutive forms(and my post doesn't mean to be offensive as some try to picture it), which usually used to comfort a person, show high level of empathy, greet or show some closeness to a person, like Alinochka, Lenok(tbh i think this version of "Elena" is quite weird in general), Sashenka or something like that. I'm also not trying to forbid something, and not even talking about "Alinka", but more in general. I think those diminutives don't make much sense when being transliterated and used by foreigners

May be i'm being too grumpy though It's off-season now, so not much other topics to discuss anyways

P.S. Alinka sounds like a version one would use for his little daughter

 

[tars]

CSKA fs school promo.

 

[lavenderblossom]

Zhenya, Sasha, Nastya are all just short versions. Some names like Alina dont have a short version, being short enough I was talking only about some diminutive forms(and my post doesn't mean to be offensive as some try to picture it), which usually used to comfort a person, show high level of empathy, greet or show some closeness to a person, like Alinochka, Lenok(tbh i think this version of "Elena" is quite weird in general), Sashenka or something like that. I'm also not trying to forbid something, and not even talking about "Alinka", but more in general. I think those diminutives don't make much sense when being transliterated and used by foreigners

May be i'm being too grumpy though It's off-season now, so not much other topics to discuss anyways

P.S. Alinka sounds like a version one would use for his little daughter

I see! You're right, the usage doesn't translate very well. In western fandom people often have affectionate nicknames for their favourites (once on Twitter I saw Shoma referred to as shooms ) When they see a short name for their fave from a different fandom they'll adopt it because they think it's cute. I don't think they look into the origin or the exact usage very hard (that this is exclusively for personal friends, I didn't know). Hence the confusion.

Elena uses lenok_radionova for her instagram handle, I think that's why some people use it.

 

[russianfan]

CSKA fs school promo.

this movie is so bad i don't even know where to start

 

[tars]

this movie is so bad i don't even know where to start

Really? The last scene is epic.

 

[iorii]

There's an excellent post by a Russian who explains the usage of diminutives. There are apparently several levels of diminutives http://niedolia.tumblr.com/post/158793053134/psa-for-the-yoi-fandom-russian-names-how-to-use the post uses Russian characters on Yuri on Ice specifically but it's a good read.

A bit from the post :

t’s not just a nickname; it’s not a childhood nickname, it’s not cute or childish or anything like that. Diminutives are used at all ages in casual settings.

Though it doesn't answer if it's okay for fans to call skaters with their diminutive, but I've seen Japanese fans do it and Yulia calls Shoma 'Shomachka' on TV, so I'm assuming it's okay (Evgenia is simply too long...). It's not like the skaters can read my locked tweets mentioning their name in diminutive too.

Oh, some Japanese fans call Evgenia Zhenya and some Med-chan/Medo-chan メドちゃん (from Medvedeva).

 

[russianfan]

There's an excellent post by a Russian who explains the usage of diminutives. There are apparently several levels of diminutives http://niedolia.tumblr.com/post/158793053134/psa-for-the-yoi-fandom-russian-names-how-to-use the post uses Russian characters on Yuri on Ice specifically but it's a good read.

A bit from the post :


Though it doesn't answer if it's okay for fans to call skaters with their diminutive, but I've seen Japanese fans do it and Yulia calls Shoma 'Shomachka' on TV, so I'm assuming it's okay (Evgenia is simply too long...). It's not like the skaters can read my locked tweets mentioning their name in diminutive too.

Oh, some Japanese fans call Evgenia Zhenya and some Med-chan/Medo-chan メドちゃん (from Medvedeva).

i bet, this is how non-russians look trying to understand all this stuff with diminutives

P.S. good article btw!

 

[moriel]

i bet, this is how non-russians look trying to understand all this stuff with diminutives

P.S. good article btw!

and that article doesnt even cover some weird nuances, like creating pet names from patronyms

 

[Spirals for Miles]

Zhenya, Sasha, Nastya are all just short versions. Some names like Alina dont have a short version, being short enough I was talking only about some diminutive forms(and my post doesn't mean to be offensive as some try to picture it), which usually used to comfort a person, show high level of empathy, greet or show some closeness to a person, like Alinochka, Lenok(tbh i think this version of "Elena" is quite weird in general), Sashenka or something like that. I'm also not trying to forbid something, and not even talking about "Alinka", but more in general. I think those diminutives don't make much sense when being transliterated and used by foreigners

May be i'm being too grumpy though It's off-season now, so not much other topics to discuss anyways

P.S. Alinka sounds like a version one would use for his little daughter

OHHH I thought all diminutives were the same, haha
Clearly not

 

[Tyranid]

Using Russian diminutives is perfectly fine... unless you are CLEARLY insulting that perso. But then it doesn't even matter because an insult is an insult regardless of use of diminutives.

I hope this question is settled.

 

[russianfan]

OHHH I thought all diminutives were the same, haha
Clearly not

it's soooo complicated

 

[alvina9894]

it's so weird when people who don't know a skater personally use diminutives...

It's not like we call Dick Button "Richard" anyways... and I swear I don't know him in person

 

[iorii]

and that article doesnt even cover some weird nuances, like creating pet names from patronyms

There's such thing? Sounds super interesting.

 

[moriel]

There's such thing? Sounds super interesting.

Yep. I mostly seen it between older people tbh, folks that are 50+ now.
For instance, a guy called Viktor (name) Aleksandrovich (patronym) is called Sanych (derivative from Aleksandrovich) by his buddies.
Another guy, lets say Ivan Anatol'evich is called Anatol'ich.
And so on.

This stuff is reserved for people of their own age, so a 30 years old hanging out with that group would be called by a diminutive of his 1st name.

 

[vitamintea]

Reading this thread reminds me of when I tried to read Tolstoy and got confused between all the different ways there are to refer to characters—because he adds in French names too!