2018-19 Russian Ladies' figure skating

[plushyfan]

What about V/T, S/H, and S/M? I think they are big time artists. No less imo that R/Z were. In fact I cannot take now their prorams very seriously although medal wise they are all time best.

Yes, they are artist. I was talking about the programs. Did you watch Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze video? Or you watch this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gQzbVNzUC4 Gordeeva/Grinkov Moonlight Sonata. You will understand.

Ice dance for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iju_RarH3rk - Bestemianova & Bukin 1985 EC FD Carmen

This is my personal taste.

 

[Spirals for Miles]

Now that we’re more than halfway through the jgp, (only 3 left!!!) is it possible to know whether or not they’ll be an all Russian jgpf?

For sure? No, but I can see it happening.
In order for this to happen, Alena Kostornaya and Viktoria Vasilieva need to take 1-2 at JGP Ostrava next week (Kostornaya will probably take gold, but either order would work). Preferably, Nana Araki would take bronze and Yelim Kim fourth, with Shiika fifth. Could happen but Vasilieva NEEDS to be 100% clean and perform at her absolute best. Kostornaya will then be in, and two girls so far in the final.

Then in week 6, the only other real contenders are Yi Christy Leung and Haein Lee. I can't see either of these girls overtaking Tarusina and Trusova, especially if Tarusina's spin is fixed (it should be by this point). Both of them would make the final (1+1 and 2+2 most likely) and then four girls are in the final.

Week 7 is the other crucial week. There, Kanysheva and Vasilieva (or Tarakanova if Vasilieva is replaced) need to be 1-2 as well. If Araki is only fourth in Ostrava, then she could probably get a silver here and not make the final, but it's better to not question it. Again, Rion could get a medal but probably won't if Araki is there. The Korean girls don't look to be contenders, but technically could be. If Kanysheva and Vasilieva/Tarakanova go 1-2, then both of them are in the final (1+2 for Kanysheva and 2+2 for Vasilieva/Tarakanova hopefully). If Vasilieva is only third in Ostrava, then Tarakanova will definitely be here -- however, it would be crucial for her to get second, because if Vasilieva is third, then either Yelim or Araki would be second most likely.

So we would have this:
Shcherbakova 1+1 (already happened)
Trusova 1+1 (can't see her losing to Tarusina)
Kostornaya 1+1 (can't see her losing to Vasilieva, Yelim, or Nana)
Kanysheva 1+2 (probably will win over Tarakanova but could be close if Tarakanova is clean. If she faces Vasilieva, she'll probably win)
Tarusina 2+2 (will probably lose to Trusova)
Vasilieva/Tarakanova 2+2

Of course, if Yelim does get second at Ostrava, we'd have to rely on both Tarusina and Tarakanova being ahead on tie-breakers, and right now, her second place score is above both of theirs. Tarusina would need to be 5-6 points ahead of Yelim at her second JGP, and Tarakanova would need 1-2. This is why it is crucial that Vasilieva gets second at Ostrava next week (and why she should be replaced with Tarusina there because Tarusina is a much surer bet to take silver, and Vasilieva faces an easier field at Ljubljana than Ostrava).

 

[Jeanie19]

It depends on when you started to watch FS. I restarted since Sochi. For me previous era programs look too empty. Those who followed FS between 2008 and 2014 and are emotionally attached to Yuna and Caro find new style programs too busy.

For me the main problem of the previous school was the combinbation of many crossovers with the preparation for jumps. It took no less than a quarter of the free program time, may be more. I do not count some accompanying arm movement as choreo in that case. When jumps come out of transitions and are immediately followed by transitions (the embodiment of it is Zhenya's 3Lo) that makes a very different impression.

:agree: I started watching in the 1990's and only the last flight was exciting. I can watch all 4-5 flights and really enjoy the competition.

 

[Lester]

Well I thorougly enjoyed the explosive, triumphant character of Alina's DQ. Which by the way benefitted immensly from Alina's energy when she was in her full force (Euros, Olympics) Also,it's odd that you put Alina and Satton against each other since both of them have very intricate programs and both are very meticulous skaters. I also don't understand why you can't judge the program quality if the skater isn't super emotional. I mean, choreography, transitions, music, "plot" progression is still there.

As to my previous point - just imagine DQ, memoirs of a Geisha, Anna Karenina, Skyfall being an expected norm at the competitions ten years ago.

Well it's not about emotion, really. She just doesn't perform the elements. She checks them off. I really like Alina, and when she is on, she is enjoyable to watch. But when she is even a tiny bit off the programs just look disconnected, a series of movements for no apparent reason. There is no program as such, just background music, a costume and a series of difficult elements.

I didn't intend to contrast those two skaters specifically, they are just the most recent ones that I watched and the difference made a great impression on me.

 

[Lester]

It depends on when you started to watch FS. I restarted since Sochi. For me previous era programs look too empty. Those who followed FS between 2008 and 2014 and are emotionally attached to Yuna and Caro find new style programs too busy.

For me the main problem of the previous school was the combinbation of many crossovers with the preparation for jumps. It took no less than a quarter of the free program time, may be more. I do not count some accompanying arm movement as choreo in that case. When jumps come out of transitions and are immediately followed by transitions (the embodiment of it is Zhenya's 3Lo) that makes a very different impression.

I also started following more dedicatedly since Sochi but I prefer less busy programs. Or programs in which the 92384901 transitions included are somehow less... obvious. Too much clutter is confusing.
I don't mind long jump setups all that much. Not every element needs transitions.

 

[typeyournamehere]

brother or sister, i love you.
thanks for not making me feel alone for not seeing beauty in 2 foot skating and jump setups

Well, you aren't alone. I don't see anything special in two-foot skating either. I mean, I can do it. Moreover, some 4 year olds can do that. This doesn't impress me. You know what does? Something that is really hard to do and what sets a skater apart from the rest. What's typical for today's Eteri girls is that almost every one of them has something special. Zagitova has her trademark lutz-loop combos, backloading and other things. Kostornaya has brilliantly performed unique transitions for most of her jumps. Trusova has quads, cantilever entries and other things which you couldn't see in ladies before. That's what makes me like them. I want to see something special, which actually corresponds to "being an elite level athlete".

 

[Vilord]

I think the amount of transitions required depends a lot on the music. A music like Annas short where there happenes something on every high note, Tarakanovas free from last year or Sashas short fram last year (music choise aside) where the music was high intensity to me is only better with a lot of transitions as long as it goes with the music. If the music on the otherhand is slow I think the transitions also should be slow to match the pace of the music. (an unpopular opinion but) I didnt like kostornaias programs that much last year since I didnt think the music required as much transitions as it was in them (part of her short has similair problems this year imo).

I do however think this is a matter of taste and that we will never agree on this. Thats why there are several judges in one competition and not just one!

 

[Reddi]

Well it's not about emotion, really. She just doesn't perform the elements. She checks them off. I really like Alina, and when she is on, she is enjoyable to watch. But when she is even a tiny bit off the programs just look disconnected, a series of movements for no apparent reason. There is no program as such, just background music, a costume and a series of difficult elements.

I didn't intend to contrast those two skaters specifically, they are just the most recent ones that I watched and the difference made a great impression on me.

If you trying to say that Satton is more smooth and elegant, well she got to that point at 19. Although you really need more than awkward moves to ruin the program flow. Yulia Lipnitzkaya once pointed out during her commentary that Alina's programs are difficult in advance, at times beyond her current performing ability and thus they force her to grow as a skater. Sometimes russian coaches do that if they sure enough that skater can handle it.

 

[moriel]

I am somewhat convinced that rusfed will give their girls spots in such a way that only 5 can make the final.

 

[[email protected]]

I am somewhat convinced that rusfed will give their girls spots in such a way that only 5 can make the final.

It is obvious that in addition to Eteri's trio Kanysheva, Tarusina, and Tarakanova are all well positioned for JGPF. Bringing in Vasilyeva to Ostrava seems reasonable.
So far we have:

Tarusina 186 (would be 191 with the invalidated spin)
Kanysheva 192
Tarakanova 190
Yelim Kim 192

So, they are all more or less tied. In Ostrava there are Kostornaya, Nana Araki, Yelim Kim, and Vasilyeva. If the Russians get 1-2 it's all quite easy then as Yelim Kim will have 2-3 (still some JGPF hopes although very small) or 2-4 (she is out of contention). If Yelim is third then Nana is fourth with no JGPFchances. In such a case the only intrigue will be who gets the remaining 3 spots out of 4 Russian contenders.

If Vasilyeva does not deliver and Yelim gets the silver then it will be interesting. Both Yelim Kim and Nana can get JGPF if Nana wins Erevan. Well, 4-2 JGPF will be more fun to watch than 6-0 because we all know that Trusova is going to win anyway with silver and bronze likely going to Scherbakova and Kostornaya.

 

[moriel]

From Trusova's interview: "I simply jump what nobody else jumps, but this does not changes the rules of how the team is selected. I will go through selection during the Olympic year, like everybody else. And if by then everybody will jump quads, i will jump quints".

https://www.sports.ru/figure-skating/1067002508.html

 

[Shayuki]

Well, I really don't think that Trusova winning is an absolute certainty. All it would take is some mistakes on the quads and Anna skating both of her programs clean(With 4Lutz). Indeed, a skater can be extremely consistent with the quads but quads still are quads and mistakes can happen.

If we consider Anna's scoring potential, we could say that the SP could go up to 76 and the FS with a clean 4Lutz + other elements even up to 145 or so, for over 220 points in total. Such a score would still require significant success by Trusova and I doubt it's an absolute certainty.

 

[asingingwife]

From Trusova's interview: "I simply jump what nobody else jumps, but this does not changes the rules of how the team is selected. I will go through selection during the Olympic year, like everybody else. And if by then everybody will jump quads, i will jump quints".

https://www.sports.ru/figure-skating/1067002508.html

Sasha will be 17 by the next Olympics right? A lot can change between now and then but she does have the right spirit to win.

Still hope Evgenia gets a quad and takes the gold but all of these ladies are such hard workers.... it will be fun to watch thats for sure!

 

[TripleAxelQueens3]

From Trusova's interview: "I simply jump what nobody else jumps, but this does not changes the rules of how the team is selected. I will go through selection during the Olympic year, like everybody else. And if by then everybody will jump quads, i will jump quints".

https://www.sports.ru/figure-skating/1067002508.html

Say what you want about her technique, but Sasha’s courage and confidence has no match. Tiny Overlord indeed.

 

[carmening]

Well, I really don't think that Trusova winning is an absolute certainty. All it would take is some mistakes on the quads and Anna skating both of her programs clean(With 4Lutz). Indeed, a skater can be extremely consistent with the quads but quads still are quads and mistakes can happen.

If we consider Anna's scoring potential, we could say that the SP could go up to 76 and the FS with a clean 4Lutz + other elements even up to 145 or so, for over 220 points in total. Such a score would still require significant success by Trusova and I doubt it's an absolute certainty.

I think Anna definitely has a lot of untapped scoring potential, but even last year at the JGP Final, Trusova tried and fell on 2 quads and won over a clean Kostornaya. Admittedly Kostornaya does not have the same TES content of Anna, but she still put up two solid programs and lost by over a point. This year, Sasha's attempting three that look much more stable (and looking to up her technical content later in the season because she isn't real). Sherbakova is a lot more of a wild card in terms of landing her jumps, and then not letting it impact the rest of her content if she falls, like at test skates. Trusova seems a lock for the title.

 

[Supernovaimplosion]

I think Anna definitely has a lot of untapped scoring potential, but even last year at the JGP Final, Trusova tried and fell on 2 quads and won over a clean Kostornaya. Admittedly Kostornaya does not have the same TES content of Anna, but she still put up two solid programs and lost by over a point. This year, Sasha's attempting three that look much more stable (and looking to up her technical content later in the season because she isn't real). Sherbakova is a lot more of a wild card in terms of landing her jumps, and then not letting it impact the rest of her content if she falls, like at test skates. Trusova seems a lock for the title.

Wait, upgrading her content how? 3A or more quads?

 

[moriel]

Wait, upgrading her content how? 3A or more quads?

whatever it is, she got to compete with guys at this point, because its so ridiculous that it is even unfair to everybody else.

 

[sweetice]

Final, Trusova tried and fell on 2 quads and won over a clean Kostornaya.

With GOE -5, it's now more difficult to win when falling on the best elements.

Sasha's performance will decide if the others have or not a chance, but she still can't celebrate.

And ice is slippery, you know. Alina's worlds is a lesson for everyone think to see the medals share before the event.

 

[andromache]

With GOE -5, it's now more difficult to win when falling on the best elements.

Sasha's performance will decide if the others have or not a chance, but she still can't celebrate.

And ice is slippery, you know. Alina's worlds is a lesson for everyone think to see the medals share before the event.

Agreed. The balance of risk versus reward has shifted since last season in Kostornaia's favor. That said, Trusova can afford the risk - with her quad potential, the high PCS she receives, and the fact that she's reigning JW champ - losing an event wouldn't be the end of the world for her. You're going to fall on quads in competition before you land them successfully in competition, and it's better to get all that "practice" in before she goes to seniors.

That said, it is pretty disappointing that she's still likely a predictable winner. If her PCS would be scored more fairly compared to Kostornaia and Shcherbakova, the competition would be closer and more interesting.

 

[hippomoomin]

When would we know for sure whether Tarakanova gets a second assignment? I really think she is the best among all Russian ladies with a silver. I enjoy her programs and would love to see her more in competition.