2019-20 U.S. Ladies Figure Skating

[KatGrace1925]

I loved Mariah's skate and she won the second score, but the first score is where she is always lacking - she really needs to work on increasing her Technical score to be more competitive at Nationals to compete for a gold and at events like Worlds.

I think she very well could do it. She’s clearly worked hard this season to change her training regimens, Adam Rippon working with her has been absolutely incredible for her skating, it’s added a new life and excitement to it. She did state in an interview she was working on a 3A but so is Bradie. I really hope these ladies get those 3A’s cause that’s their only chance to podium in this day and age unfortunately. This ladies technical race only just began and I hate it, I didn’t mind so much when the quad revolution hit mens but it’s just been sad to watch how quickly skating has changed in ladies.

 

[KatGrace1925]

Surely Americans (I am one) can understand why quads and multiple 3A's will win a championship. They know it does when it comes to the men and they need to start learning it will apply to the ladies these days too. And Johnny and Tara kept saying it over and over all night long. Alysa had one under rotation on the quad but she didn't fall and everything else (including 2 3As) was clean. By the rules of skating (again explained over and over) she won fair and square. I do think she was grossly over marked on the PCS but that still wouldn't have been enough for her to lose the title.

Ladies skating has changed. I don't know how many times Johnny, Tara or Terry have to explain and empathize it then they already have. If people still don't get it then they are willingly being ignorant and ignoring what's being told in the simplest of terms.

Not everyone is watching the broadcast with Tara and Johnny. I watched on the goldenskate stream where Tanith was lamenting and ranting about how PCS has long been scored incorrectly and how skaters who have the edges and skating skills should be the ones getting high PCS and others shouldn’t but that PCS now rises along with tech scores which makes PCS pointless.

 

[jenaj]

I would put Alysa down to 6’s in skating skills and other marks. I would have Mariah in the 9’s. That’s just how I see it. A juniorish program doesn’t deserve to get senior level marks. Alysa is such a bore and I see no improvements just more snoozy programs without much content to them aside from jumps. Mariah is a much more beautiful and inspiring skater, but idk I just knew this would happen. I knew Mariah had no chance at winning cause the USFS thinks Alysa can beat Eteri’s girls but I don’t think Alysa has a chance unless she completely changes as a skater in two years.

Your bias is on full display. The idea that Alysa deserves 6s in PCS is ludicrous. She didn’t get anything lower than 7.5 at the JGPF. And we’ll see if Mariah can average 9s in an international event.

 

[chuckm]

I would personally rank them like this on skill level this season and think this is where they might shake out if they all skated clean.

Rika
Kaori
Mariah
Wakaba
Bradie

Wakaba is powerful but personally I don’t like watching her as much as as I like watching Mariah. This is just my opinion.

Uh---Bradie beat both Kaori and Higuchi at Skate America. And Bradie outscored Mariah in the GP 427.45 to 418.56. Bradie made it to the GPF and Mariah was 2nd alternate. Bradie outranks Mariah on World Standings and Seasons Best. Nationals does not count AFA ISU is concerned. Mariah had her Nationals moment, but Bradie has the technical edge and is by far the more consistent performer.

 

[Joekaz]

I would say this is definitely true for Kihira, but only possibly true for Miyahara due to low jump BV and the Americans closing the gap on PCS. I think in particular we might see Bell get a PCS bump at Worlds following Nationals. A clean Higuchi would likely not beat a clean Tennell/Bell in the current environment.

That depends on judging politics and Higuchi pretty much being out of contention the last couple of seasons with injuries and weight issues and how that affects the judges. There is also no guarantee on what form she is in off of only one good competition. However talent wise she is far superior to both Tennell and Bell, so she is a real wildcard.

 

[Greengemmonster]

Why are Alysa's programs allegedly empty?

She's got some lovely transitions, her spins are interesting, fast and look fantastic (for all the jumping hype she's actually a really good spinner). I would have liked for her to hold the spiral longer but what there was, was lovely.

She was emoting and moving her arms and body. She was very very very good!!!

There seems to be this myth that Alysa somehow plows through the ice like a lawnmower and can't skate for sh@t which is completely untrue and made up!

 

[lucyrose]

Mariah's free skate last night was everything I ever want in a program. I started ugly crying after her final lutz. Such an amazing reminder of how beautiful this sport can be. I wish the placements reflected what was put out there, but I really feel that program will be remembered as one of the best of US Nationals of all time. Perfection! Still tear up on rewatch

 

[KatGrace1925]

Your bias is on full display. The idea that Alysa deserves 6s in PCS is ludicrous. She didn’t get anything lower than 7.5 at the JGPF. And we’ll see if Mariah can average 9s in an international event.

I don’t care what they get, the system is clearly broken and has been for a long time. This isn’t the sport I fell in love with when I was 11, and it’s not getting more interesting for having boring jump drills winning competitions. I want to watch more skates like Mariah’s long and Amber Glenn’s short program, not more little girls doing cheated quads and getting PCS marks above 7’s for empty programs just cause they smile their way through.

 

[evasorange]

There seems to be this myth that Alysa somehow plows through the ice like a lawnmower and can't skate for sh@t which is completely untrue and made up!

I don’t think that, I just think her skating is average and very junior-ish, the only way she seems to connect to the music and perform is to smile a lot. Which I do NOT hold that against her!! She’s a junior so of course she has junior-ish skating! But it’s not what I expect or want to see in senior skating. Honestly the more I think about it it’s absolutely ridiculous that juniors who cannot compete in any other senior event are allowed to compete at the senior level at nationals. It’s kind of embarrassing really. Countries really wanna have to send second place to worlds? Can you imagine in the nba playoffs a team winning but then not being able to go the finals because the members were too young?? Why did this rule even come about in the first place?

 

[KatGrace1925]

Why are Alysa's programs allegedly empty?

She's got some lovely transitions, her spins are interesting, fast and look fantastic (for all the jumping hype she's actually a really good spinner). I would have liked for her to hold the spiral longer but what there was, was lovely.

She was emoting and moving her arms and body. She was very very very good!!!

There seems to be this myth that Alysa somehow plows through the ice like a lawnmower and can't skate for sh@t which is completely untrue and made up!

Her spins are nice but she moves slow, the edge quality isn’t there and her transitions are bare minimum especially when the first minute of her program is skating from big element to big element. It’s smooth but it’s juniorish and unexciting. She’s lacking in emotional output and it’s especially glaring when she had to follow up a group of ladies skating with emotion, speed and greater skill in general. My fear is if she keeps adding bigger elements her programs will just end up more empty and her PCS will keep going up because that’s the way our system unfortunately works.

 

[Colonel Green]

Honestly the more I think about it it’s absolutely ridiculous that juniors who cannot compete in any other senior event are allowed to compete at the senior level at nationals. It’s kind of embarrassing really. Countries really wanna have to send second place to worlds? Can you imagine in the nba playoffs a team winning but then not being able to go the finals because the members were too young?? Why did this rule even come about in the first place?

Competing senior domestically is a good way to gain experience before your international senior career starts — and most of the time they wouldn’t be expected to win a domestic senior title; Liu is one of the exceptions because of the big technical gap she represents.

 

[Mishaminion]

I would put Alysa down to 6’s in skating skills and other marks. I would have Mariah in the 9’s. That’s just how I see it. A juniorish program doesn’t deserve to get senior level marks. Alysa is such a bore and I see no improvements just more snoozy programs without much content to them aside from jumps. Mariah is a much more beautiful and inspiring skater, but idk I just knew this would happen. I knew Mariah had no chance at winning cause the USFS thinks Alysa can beat Eteri’s girls but I don’t think Alysa has a chance unless she completely changes as a skater in two years.

Alysa has very much improved, she's faster, has more flow, is interpreting her programs better, is becoming a little more mature (obviously she is not as mature a skater as Mariah who is almost 10 years older than her), like someone else said you are incredibly biased and being very unfair to Alysa and how she has changed in a year

 

[Mishaminion]

I don’t care what they get, the system is clearly broken and has been for a long time. This isn’t the sport I fell in love with when I was 11, and it’s not getting more interesting for having boring jump drills winning competitions. I want to watch more skates like Mariah’s long and Amber Glenn’s short program, not more little girls doing cheated quads and getting PCS marks above 7’s for empty programs just cause they smile their way through.

That is your opinion and is not one that everyone shares. Just remember that.
These "little girls" with "cheated" quads happen to be filling arenas and gaining bigger popularity for ladies figure skating than it had for years...the ISU are not going to do anything to change that and why should they shoot themselves in the foot?

 

[NanaPat]

Did these viewers not see Liu’s gigantic technical score building up on the TES reader?

I think they were watching live; no TES reader or commentary in the arena.

 

[el henry]

That is your opinion and is not one that everyone shares. Just remember that.
These "little girls" with "cheated" quads happen to be filling arenas and gaining bigger popularity for ladies figure skating than it had for years...the ISU are not going to do anything to change that and why should they shoot themselves in the foot?

In other countries maybe. Not in the US of A. And this is the US Ladies’ thread.

I am sure that everyone knows we do not share the same opinions and that is why we offer our opinions.

 

[Mishaminion]

Mariah's free skate last night was everything I ever want in a program. I started ugly crying after her final lutz. Such an amazing reminder of how beautiful this sport can be. I wish the placements reflected what was put out there, but I really feel that program will be remembered as one of the best of US Nationals of all time. Perfection! Still tear up on rewatch

Mariah might have won if it wasn't for her freak SP fall. Alysa had clean 3As and although not on the same level PCS wise Mariah cannot compete with 2 triple Axels. I don't understand why many can't comprehend any of this.

I love Mariah too and am so happy she put together an almost entirely clean and wonderful performance...but Alysa did enough to win.

 

[Mishaminion]

In other countries maybe. Not in the US of A. And this is the US Ladies’ thread.

I am sure that everyone knows we do not share the same opinions and that is why we offer our opinions.

Well more skaters like Alysa, capable of similar stuff to the Russians and that WOULD change.

 

[lucyrose]

Mariah might have won if it wasn't for her freak SP fall. Alysa had clean 3As and although not on the same level PCS wise Mariah cannot compete with 2 triple Axels. I don't understand why many can't comprehend any of this.

I love Mariah too and am so happy she put together an almost entirely clean and wonderful performance...but Alysa did enough to win.

The triple axels didn't look entirely around to me and she is so slow going into them. Quad was clearly underrotated and maybe even downgraded. There's no denying Alysa's technical content is unparalleled but I think her PCS was over scored and I think the quality of her technical elements is lacking as well. I don't think USFS is doing her any favors with this blatant over scoring. She couldn't beat a girl with no quads who was recovering from a broken leg at GPF so clearly there are many aspects of her skating that are not working (yes I know she fell but she also finally got called on her underrotations). I want nothing more than to see a girl from the US on top of an international podium but it's not going to happen if she doesn't get to serious work on her skating skills and speed. This type of scoring is not going to push her.

 

[nataliebunard12]

Tho I noticed in both junior and senior event that some scores were a bit exaggerated or pushed low. It kinda looks like the USFS are playing a favoring game of some sort

 

[Mishaminion]

The triple axels didn't look entirely around to me and she is so slow going into them. Quad was clearly underrotated and maybe even downgraded. There's no denying Alysa's technical content is unparalleled but I think her PCS was over scored and I think the quality of her technical elements is lacking as well. I don't think USFS is doing her any favors with this blatant over scoring. She couldn't beat a girl with no quads who was recovering from a broken leg at GPF so clearly there are many aspects of her skating that are not working (yes I know she fell but she also finally got called on her underrotations). I want nothing more than to see a girl from the US on top of an international podium but it's not going to happen if she doesn't get to serious work on her skating skills and speed. This type of scoring is not going to push her.

She couldn't beat Kamila Valieva (the girl has a name) because she made too many mistakes.

And she HAS worked on her skating skills and speed, she was very noticeably faster and smoother here.

Let's face it there is no way Bradie or Mariah would score as high internationally either or have some errors overlooked either.

It works both ways