RE Jason's costume for his FP this year - it is a perfect homage to Gene Kelly in the movie.
In regard to your dislike of Jason's programs since he began training at the Cricket Club, I'm not sure I understand what you mean exactly, especially since Rohene has been responsible for all of the short programs, which have been enjoyable and successful. Aside from the initial Old Friends fp, Wilson's work on Jason's Schindler's List fp and this season's Slaughter on Tenth Avenue, has been admirable, IMO.
.... The immediate decision to chop Jason's hair off is quite indicative of their safely mainstream approach when it comes to artistic boundaries. ....
It's what Orser wanted. Ofc they might present it as being all Jason's idea, how he saw it as a fresh start, how a new look would help, blah blah, maybe even he truthfully was totally happy about it, but ultimately Orser wanted it anyway. You will not find the truth about such things in a typical interview either.there is no reason for you to know about Jason and his choices, certainly not as much as those of us who read all his interviews, but this is so far from what happened
Jason said in at least a couple of interviews well before 2018 that he would likely get rid of the ponytail after the 2018 OG. He may have been encouraged to go through with it while at TCC but it's not like it was a new idea. He also got it cut right before attending Grant Hochstein's wedding where he was Best Man. That could have been the impetus to do it at that time.It's what Orser wanted. Ofc they might present it as being all Jason's idea, how he saw it as a fresh start, how a new look would help, blah blah, maybe even he truthfully was totally happy about it, but ultimately Orser wanted it anyway. You will not find the truth about such things in a typical interview either.
Either way, it's completely in keeping with the stylistic choices coming out of Cricket Club. We've seen some great programs from there, and they can teach great basic skating, but definitely show a certain lack of range in the types of programs being produced, and have their misses. The styles they are comfortable with are significantly different than the flavor Rohene brings to the ice, and so far, much less inspired to me. Aside from the differences in personality and regional upbringing, a lot of what informs Rohene's skating is ISI influences, where artistry and edginess and unusual moves are highly valued. It's a different thing than the more straight-laced style we see from Orser.
Hanyu was the one who emailed Wilson and begged that he let him use the R&J for the Olympics. Wilson had gone on record saying that.Some notably poor decisions have been made over there, Wilson shoving his horrific Romeo&Juliet on Hanyu in the 2014 Olympic season, refusing to let the immensely better 2012 program be used. Hanyu ended up being able to get results, because of his technical ability and Patrick Chan's inconsistency and similarly bland LP, but his Olympic/World titles that year are painful to watch, when they could have been mesmerizing (even with a fall).
Rohene Ward does not believe that Jason made Nina Simone "white". I loved this article with many quotes from Rohene and Jason, in particular about Sinnerman:
Rohene has been doing choreo for Jason for a long time, it's true, but he also tells it like it is. If he did not think Jason could have done justice to his (Rohene's) heritage, he would not have given him the choreo. (and at the SP presser, Jason specified further that Rohene was drawing on Alvin Ailey, so even more Black heritage).
I guess, turning your interpretation of my words back at you (although to forestall such assumptions in the future, I have never cared about who "should" portray someone's heritage, I give bubkes to that), to you it doesn't matter to take a variety of opinions on who should or shouldn't be expressing certain types of music and who succeeded at it? I didn't know there was only one African-American in existence, nor did I think Ward was some sort of immovable authority on the techniques taught at Alvin Ailey or African-American musicology, nor that his opinion about somebody was the mass, wholesale opinion of a multifaceted American sub-culture. No one else's opinions to "trust" about such a thing? Well, that's mighty white of you! I like individualism of opinions a lot though , so I personally would hate to generalize, much like, of course, "North American culture" isn't a general thing as we once pleasantly discussed.I will trust Rohene to let me know which skaters he believes can bring his heritage and background to the ice.
If, again, you watch the video, you'll see the movement was conceived for... a trio. And for a different vocal recording. Certainly enough of a difference for Rohene and Jason to change the movement? Not that a few of the arm positions and body positions are enough to say it's a reproduction of Sinnerman, more than the Daniil Gleikhengauz placing a few attitude spirals in Zagitova's Don Quixote is enough to call it a reproduction of Petipa on ice, of course. Are the Alvin Ailey dancers doing sit spins and camel spins and change foot combination spins or triple axels (the semblance of the one Brown has, anyway) in their piece? Well, consider me uneducated about Ailey's Sinnerman then!Any issues with the Sinnerman choreo should be taken up with Alvin Ailey, whose dance movements were the inspiration for the Sinnerman SP.
But why Alvin? I didn't know he was involved with the reproduction of his Sinnerman on ice. Did you know that Alvin Ailey used to choose his own dancers for his choreography? He picked the trio for Sinnerman. Did he pick Jason for this? I wasn't aware of his artistic choices being directly involved here Surely he'd have given Brown more direction than what was presented? I take real issue with him if he praised Jason after he tripped in the step sequence! And I hope Rohene calls him out too (I assume you mean publicly? Otherwise I don't expect to see him calling Brown's performance "white" or undercooked... ever).I certainly trust Rohene and Alvin to interpret this powerful piece of Black music, part of their heritage, more than anyone.
I wouldn't go so far as to call it the Horton technique - a mere imitation, since Brown isn't a dancer (the modern dance philosophy of "everyone's a dancer" notwithstanding anyway).I THOUGHT I recognized some Horton technique in there.
Hanyu was the one who emailed Wilson and begged that he let him use the R&J for the Olympics. Wilson had gone on record saying that.
What, so that he can ruin his reputation for quality clean elements by developing a rep as a chronic UR instead?Jason should learn Vincent’s quad technique, if he wants to land a quad soon.
If you and Rohene Ward and Jason Brown sincerely believe that Brown has managed to capture Nina Simone's soul in his performance, then all of you are certainly entitled to your opinion. But I didn't. All I meant was that I didn't find Brown's performances close to the quality of Nina Simone's Sinnerman. Not "Rohene Ward gave it to a white man, why did he do that?! " Or "Rohene Ward doesn't know anything about his own heritage with this program he's made and choosing Brown to do it".
It is incredibly difficult to translate something as outstanding as a seminal Ailey piece to the ice. The arm positions and some of the obviously referential transitions give it away in terms of inspiration - but I would hope they do more than this to translate Nina Simone's Sinner Man to the ice, which is what matters. Otherwise, it's just a poor knock-off. No one really watches Disney on Ice either.I wouldn't get the essence of Nina Simone and Alvin Ailey simply by looking at the way he skated his program.
This. While I think Jason gave a wonderful skating performance, I didn't see any African-American flava. Jason is rightfully praised for his skating skills but I don't see him as versatile, all his programs end up getting the Jason Brown flavor. Not to say these are not wonderful programs, but I wouldn't get the essence of Nina Simone and Alvin Ailey simply by looking at the way he skated his program.
I thought most people opined that Vincent seemed much improved. His artistic presentation in the short and his jump consistency in general. Whether people WANT him to improve is another story. Not sure I'd agree that he's been the consistent #2, because he's been so inconsistent in general.I think he's improved quite a lot with the "second mark" and his newly unveiled 4Z (Rippon)/3T was jaw-dropping.
He's been the #2 US Man fairly consistently for a few years. A hiccup here, a hiccup there... but he seems to be a hard worker and very determined. Even with a sloppy Free Skate, he still had a 15 point margin to maintain the silver medal at US Nats. Tidy a jump or two, and he's back in the hunt for a World medal.
I thought most people opined that Vincent seemed much improved. His artistic presentation in the short and his jump consistency in general. Whether people WANT him to improve is another story. Not sure I'd agree that he's been the consistent #2, because he's been so inconsistent in general.
Whaaat? I can't believe what I'm reading from you and from @Blades of Passion. I don't wish to be unfair in my response, but the comments coming out of you both are so strange. BoP's reference to 'botox' and this overarching dislike of 'Orser's camp,' I find curious at best, and frankly biased at worst, for whatever reason. The other part of this is that there are a variety of different athletes who train at the Cricket Club who have different styles as well as different programs choreographed by different choreographers. What exactly is there not to like??? Cricket Club athletes are NOT all the same.This is what I was thinking before Sinnerman happened. (I don't like Orser camp's programs in general though.)
But after watching it at Nationals, I do think this SP is good - but I will absolutely say that he made Nina Simone white and doesn't really end up getting it. I said it to a friend after ISP, but let it go on the forum because it was the first time he did it. It seems more like I want to watch Rohene do it, instead of it being crafted for Jason specifically?
LP is just kind of there, for me.
Ah, so the more you speak about your views of the Cricket Club, your dislike becomes more specific and clear, which is a good thing. Apparently, you are not enamored of Wilson's choreo in general, and you specifically frown on some of Hanyu's programs, etc.Rohene is still doing his SP's, but he's not in the rink with Jason every day anymore, and Cricket Club has the say on what to do in the end. The immediate decision to chop Jason's hair off is quite indicative of their safely mainstream approach when it comes to artistic boundaries. Some notably poor decisions have been made over there, Wilson shoving his horrific Romeo&Juliet on Hanyu in the 2014 Olympic season, refusing to let the immensely better 2012 program be used. Hanyu ended up being able to get results, because of his technical ability and Patrick Chan's inconsistency and similarly bland LP, but his Olympic/World titles that year are painful to watch, when they could have been mesmerizing (even with a fall).
Old Friends was indeed a waste of time. Schindler's List was fine, not something I would call inspired on Wilson's part, it paled in comparison to Rohene's "The Piano" program, but it did at least let Jason try to aim high. Slaughter on Tenth Avenue is totally forgettable and this music choice and choreography continues to reinforce to me that a lot of their stylistic choices are stuck in the 80's. It's also a cursed music choice, nobody has ever won a major competition with it, and the last time I can remember it used, Rachael Flatt hilariously kept getting 2nd in her 2010-2011 season with it.
Back to Jason/Rohene though, I don't think their SP's have been big successes anyway, aside from "Question of U". So often they went for obviously peppier music and it never totally sang for me, always felt a little too cartoonish (nor was "Writing's on the Wall" able to fully express that song). It's the LP's where I think they've shined. Sinnerman has potential though, it's gotten quite a bite of hype because of the transitional content and song choice, I'm just not sure if they will actually try to make it a bit harsher and angrier.