Changes to Grand Prix structure for 2011-2012

[bigsisjiejie]

Are the new rules going to REQUIRE the seeded skaters to participate in a third GP, or is it up to each skater's/team's discretion? If this is an ISU moneymaking strategy, will they put pressure on Federations to force their top seeded skaters to do a third event, even if the skater(s) don't wish to?

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

Right now, no - the rules won't force a skater to do a third GP event (from my understanding). The pressure? Will definitely be there

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

The more I think of it the more I believe this is a truly destructive change.

 

[colleen o'neill]

I didn't like this the first time around and I don't know how it will be better now.

Of course I wasn't privy to all their thinking ...but it seems to me that they soon decided that audiences were getting bored with seeing the same programs over and over..and then the skaters had to skate two different long programs at the final..

 

[BackStage Barbie]

When Grand Prix events used to be broadcast on tv (ABC/ESPN) I always assumed the reason that top skaters were allowed to do 3 GPs was to increase viewership. Now that the networks no longer broadcast, I guess the same motives apply, but now they'll hope that these top skaters will put "butts in seats" at the actual venues rather than garnering more of a TV audience.

 

[janetfan]

The more I think of it the more I believe this is a truly destructive change.

The more I think of it I see the lack of intere$t from USA as the primary cause of this latest down$izing.

In the future we might expect to see the techpanel reduced from 3 to 2 and the judging panel chopped again.

Apparently the CoP is NOT the world wide success you so often claim it to be.

As a longtime fan I can tell you anonymous judging will never be acceptable to most Americans.

On the other hand, with skating as political under CoP as it was in the past do we need to know which judges marked Alissa high and which one's marked her low at Worlds?

Seems that might have caused a little controversy. From where I sit controversy is preferable to a lack of interest.

But first, people have to actually be watching it on TV. No need for anyone to mock armchair fans. The TV money is what made the sport's growth possible in the first place.

Thinking of Plushy's comments from Vancouver, "they needed it more" he couldn;t have been more WRONG.

USA casual fans who watch skating on TV did not care too much whether Evan won or not.
In USA figure skating begins and ends with the "Ice Princess."

It is about time for ISU to realize this and start scoring our girls higher at Worlds and the Olympics.

What a sport

 

[Bluebonnet]

USA casual fans who watch skating on TV did not care too much whether Evan won or not.
In USA figure skating begins and ends with the "Ice Princess."

It is about time for ISU to realize this and start scoring our girls higher at Worlds and the Olympics.

What a sport

You mean that was what they did in Vancouver for Evan, but Americans care about girls more so it didn't work?

 

[janetfan]

You mean that was what they did in Vancouver for Evan, but Americans care about girls more so it didn't work?

I am just a fan so how can I know what ISU was thinking in Vancouver?

But yes, USA won't come back or even show a rise in interest without an Ice Princess.

Maybe Adelina could switch nationalities and come skate for USA. She seems to have everything USA fans like in a Lady skater ( but she would have to lose the Russian accent ).

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

It's difficult to understand the rationalization of the ISU decisions more often than not. Among the average Fans, they are open for conspiracy theories where an explanation on - WHY - would not be inappropriate.

Is it that the revenues of the ISU are dwindling? and cut backs are necessary? We don't know the Budget of the ISU, and for the most part, we don't care, but a little info on cutting back would be of interest and understanding of the actions.

Are the individual events, if not showing a profit, showing a loss? I'm not sure that cutting down on events is the way to go in a dying sport. Baseball Teams are replaced when it shows that paying fans lose interest in a team, but they are picked up in other venues. Where does Figure Skating go, if all is loss?

How many of the BigSix are losing money by hosting a GP event? Given the huge logistics to host a GP, maybe another country nonBigSix could do it?

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

Quirk for pairs

There are 23 skaters on the SB that qualify. Of those, three teams have split/retired (Denney/Barrett, Y/C and Brodeur/Mattatall). So only 20 teams are eligible for 48 slots. So everyone in the twenty should get two spots. And then there are eight spots left. Assuming the top six does a third competition, you still have two empty slots.

The hosts should definitely consider reserving a slot for a team not eligible via season's best. Maybe even two slots.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

^^^^
but why can't they go on with the competition without filling the slots? and why must they fill the slots with seeded skaters? There has to be other Teams to fill those slots besides the seeded. Some Fans want to know why they must use seeded.

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

Are you asking me? If so, because the ISU instituted a new rule. Is it a good rule? Emphatically not. Can they go on without filling slots? Of course.

 

[chuckm]

Quirk for pairs

There are 23 skaters on the SB that qualify. Of those, three teams have split/retired (Denney/Barrett, Y/C and Brodeur/Mattatall). So only 20 teams are eligible for 48 slots. So everyone in the twenty should get two spots. And then there are eight spots left. Assuming the top six does a third competition, you still have two empty slots.

The hosts should definitely consider reserving a slot for a team not eligible via season's best. Maybe even two slots.

There are always the host picks. I expect Marley/Brubaker will get a host pick at Skate America. Too bad they are not eligible for an invitation from another host (unless the ISU relaxes the 66.6% Seasons Best rule), as they are less than a point below the required minimum.

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

There are always the host picks. I expect Marley/Brubaker will get a host pick at Skate America. Too bad they are not eligible for an invitation from another host (unless the ISU relaxes the 66.6% Seasons Best rule), as they are less than a point below the required minimum.

Exactly. How close is Nebelhorn to Skate America this upcoming season? Because I agree with your earlier comment, that we'll see a swelling of the ranks in early senior B's to get a better result and a placement on the substitution list.

 

[colleen o'neill]

My head is spinning.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

^^^
Mine is in fantasyland. I think this is the first step in replacing the GPs with a pre-Worlds look competition for seeded skater only.

 

[Violet Bliss]

^^^^
but why can't they go on with the competition without filling the slots? and why must they fill the slots with seeded skaters? There has to be other Teams to fill those slots besides the seeded. Some Fans want to know why they must use seeded.

Because the seeded ones are the stars who draw audiences, live and on TV. Other than the most popular team sports, TV shows focus on stars, be they tennis, golf, or car racing. With few exceptions, they don't show non seeded players on TV. The finals and the champions are the highlights or only ones broadcast.

Even ardent skating fans who are online focus on the top skaters, as evident right in this forum. Whom do people want to see or know more about, Yuna Kim or Agnes Zawadzki?

 

[feraina]

There is a new minimum score per discipline, based on 2/3s of the the top Seasons Best total score.
For men, that is roughly 187, which would make only the top 45 men on the SB list eligible for the GP.
For ladies, 134 - top 50 on the SB list eligible
For pairs, 145 - top 23 on the SB list eligible, but Marley/Brubaker (at 24) are not eligible
For dance, 123 - top 35 on the SB list eligible

I think this means Caroline's Season's Best score (133.86) has her just below the cutoff by 0.14 point? Unless she goes to the new Lake Placid senior B event and gets a better score -- then she could get on the substitute's list. Is Lake Placid definitely happening? And Caroline has a tendency of peaking too late in the season, so without the GP's, she'll probably do even worse at National's. This might really be the last year of Caroline's competitive career.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Because the seeded ones are the stars who draw audiences, live and on TV. Other than the most popular team sports, TV shows focus on stars, be they tennis, golf, or car racing. With few exceptions, they don't show non seeded players on TV. The finals and the champions are the highlights or only ones broadcast.

Even ardent skating fans who are online focus on the top skaters, as evident right in this forum. Whom do people want to see or know more about, Yuna Kim or Agnes Zawadzki?

I'm not disagreeing with you. I would say 90% of the fans who post on skating forums are only interested in the top skaters. Few are interested in skating as a whole. That is why I suggested replacing the GPs with Top Seeded Skaters only with a competition of it's own. That doesn't mean 10% of fans who like the GPs will not miss the up-and-coming skaters.

I contend the GP Series is the best pre-worlds interntational competition as the opening of the new season and I think it is FAIR to give many skaters a chance to be seen. Some, may well have improved and worth a look, but we will not be able to see their improvements until Worlds, unless there are youtubes of outstanding nonStar skater in their respective nationals.

Tennis by the way, eliminates large numbers of players as the competitions progress even the Stars, but you knew that didn't you?
Golf has a series of Pro competitions (the PG Tour) which carries a large roster of contestants.

However, since the media forcuses on MONEY, you are correct but that doesn't mean that the media will make room for more skating. Let's see how it works out in producing more media attention.

 

[Sylvia]

How close is Nebelhorn to Skate America this upcoming season? Because I agree with your earlier comment, that we'll see a swelling of the ranks in early senior B's to get a better result and a placement on the substitution list.

Skate America dates are October 21-23, 2011 and 2011 Nebelhorn Trophy will be held September 21-24 -- announcement is published at: http://www.eislauf-union.de/NebelhornTrophy2011.html

I think this means Caroline's Season's Best score (133.86) has her just below the cutoff by 0.14 point? Unless she goes to the new
Lake Placid senior B event and gets a better score -- then she could get on the substitute's list. Is Lake Placid definitely happening?

I don't believe there are any new Senior B competitions scheduled in North America for this season but maybe by next season?

Any new GP selection rules will be published online eventually by the ISU in their 2011-12 Senior Grand Prix Announcement and so, until then, nothing is officially known for certain.