Christopher Bowman Died (1-10-08)

[mskater93]

These articles are sad beyond belief, but the situation is what it is. I hope Christopher is at peace and his family will be helped with their loss by the good memories they have of a tremendously talented and unforgettable man. I have new respect for John Baldwin for standing by him as long as he did and for not publicly discussing the identity theft situation. Frank Carroll is a wonderful man who has had some crushing blows to deal with throughout his career coaching skaters. He always maintains his dignity and compassion for people. My admiration for him is profound.

From watching how Frank interacted with Bowman as he came up the ranks and how he interacted with skaters he taught AFTER he and Bowman parted ways, it appears that it always bothered Carroll and he was never as deeply emotionally bonded to any of his skaters after (yes, even Kwan). It's sad to see that he seemed to always with hold something of himself after that.

 

[cassieandcheetah]

Gosh, the Time magazine article on Frank Carroll breaks my heart......That helplessness he's talking about, I can really relate to that.

 

[ManyCairns]

have new respect for John Baldwin for standing by him as long as he did and for not publicly discussing the identity theft situation. .

I was really struck by Baldwin's longstanding loyalty and desire to help his friend, too. Definitely adds a new dimension to my impression of Baldwin and gives me great, great respect for him. Sounds like he quietly supported Christopher as much as he could for a very long time.

 

[Tinymavy15]

Gosh, the Time magazine article on Frank Carroll breaks my heart......That helplessness he's talking about, I can really relate to that.

I had to read it after that remark... here is the link for anyone else interested.

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1703048,00.html?xid=rss-nation


right. very sad. poor Frank.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I had to read it after that remark... here is the link for anyone else interested.

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1703048,00.html?xid=rss-nation


right. very sad. poor Frank.

Thanks Tinymavy for the link.

Here's writer's opening comment which tells it all about figure skaters being bedazzled with sequins to make up for the lack of personality to which I agree.

In a world that blends flamboyant costumes with decidedly bland personalities, figure skater Christopher Bowman stood out for his irrepressible individuality and unapologetic, undisciplined approach to the sport. He was one of the skating world's best performers. "He was an extraordinary talent who had wit, intelligence and charm," said his long-time coach Frank Carroll.

Bowman had it all without the sequins.

Joe

 

[Linny]

Bi-Polar

I wish I knew more about bi-polar disease. I don't think they knew much about it back in 1985-1988 when Chris was coming up through the ranks. I understand that the medication can make the patient feel so horrid that they don't want to take it. And that the medication can also be responsible for the horrid weight gain.

I hate it that the media keeps showing the picture of Chris at his court hearing. I don't think that's the way people want to remember him. I do like the one picture (I forget where I saw it) of an adult Christopher Bowman coaching a young skater. In that picture, it looked like he'd found his calling...

except that, of course, he continue to be erratic. There is a very strong emotional component in the student-teacher dynamic and the teacher really has to be reliable. What a shame that Chris just wasn't able to be there.

Linny

 

[sillylionlove]

I wish I knew more about bi-polar disease. .

Linny

There are two different types of bi-polar (also called manic-depressive for those of you who did not know that). There is bi polar one and bi polar two. For people with bi polar one, they tend to be more manic then depressive. Manic is not being angry or fighting as some people think...manic is doing things like going out and buying 15 pairs of shoes, or taking out three cars loans and things like that. The bi polar two is people who tend to be in a more depressive state most of the time. It's not that the medications make you feel horrid. Sometimes it takes a while to find the right mix of medications, especially when you are taking both a bi polar and an anti depressive. Some medications work against each other, some can't be increased due to an overdose of seratonin, some have side effects that aren't the greatest and I could go on. It's sad becuase people think that they can take these pills and that they will immediately feel better. Mind altering medications (which is what they are as they change your chemical balance in your brain) often take weeks to months to work because that's how long it takes for your brain to change it's chemical balance. People often don't want to wait that long. Also, these pills don't make you "happy", and especially not immediately.. They just make your chemical brain balance the same as a "normal" person who is not depressed. Finally, most people go to a regular doctor for this kind of medication when they should be going to a psychiatrist since they are the ones who understand how the chemicals in the medication affects the brain. Also it helps if the person taking the medication is around someone all the time who might notice differences in the person's mood and mental state since the person taking the medication might not notice any differences but those around them will. But sorry to say there is such a stigma against mental illness in this country.

Hope this information helps.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Thanks Sillylionlove - I think I am more type 1 thant type2. spend far too mch money on figure skating events and too much time on the internet.

In a fit of depression some years ago, I was given some anti depressing pills which after 2 weeks I threw them away. They made me feel nothing and I felt that was worse than facing reality.

Joe

 

[gsrossano]

To add to sillylionlove's comment,

bipolar disorder has been know for a long time, and was described as manic-depression about a century ago. The name was changed to lessen the stigma associated with it (that all mental illnesses have, unfortunately) , so people would be more likely to seek help. It is thought to have an organic origin and may have a genetic component. Among identical twins, if one twin has bipolar disorder, there is a 70% chance the other twin will also.

Bipolar disorder is frequently associated with substance abuse, which make treating both even more difficult. The actress Carrie Fisher (Star Wars) has bipolar disorder and has written about fighting the disease and substance abuse in her youth.

There is also an association of bipolar disorder with creativity. The disease is more common among creative people than the general public.

 

[sillylionlove]

That's very true. Many people use alcohol or illegal drugs to self medicate when they have an undiagnosed mental illness. That's why there are many programs in the country that are MICA programs (that's mental ill chemical abusers.)

And to Joesitz...see you wanted to feel happy after taking them and it didn't work. Trust me...it took my husband about 3 months for this bi polar meds to really kick in and about the same for his anti depressants. He took the pills and was like 3 days later...why am I not happy. I noticed some differences after about 3 weeks or so but he didn't FEEL anything until some months later. But Joesitz...it seems like you have dealt with your problem and for that I am happy.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

That's very true. Many people use alcohol or illegal drugs to self medicate when they have an undiagnosed mental illness. That's why there are many programs in the country that are MICA programs (that's mental ill chemical abusers.)

And to Joesitz...see you wanted to feel happy after taking them and it didn't work. Trust me...it took my husband about 3 months for this bi polar meds to really kick in and about the same for his anti depressants. He took the pills and was like 3 days later...why am I not happy. I noticed some differences after about 3 weeks or so but he didn't FEEL anything until some months later. But Joesitz...it seems like you have dealt with your problem and for that I am happy.

Well, I'm not sure considering the money I spend on and can't get enough of LIVE figure skating.

But I do believe the bit about creativity playing a role. Many of the great writers, composers, singers, did indeed indulge in halucinatory items for their great works. However, booze or whatever, does take it's physical toll.

In Bowman's case he made the quads in his dream state.

Joe

 

[dewey]

Also, bipolar disorder varies in severity. Some people with the right medication can lead relatively normal lives. But I know two people (one a family friend, one my former flute teacher) who have the disorder so severely that they had to go onto disability, and the amount of medication they have to take to control the symptoms does limit how well they function. My flute teacher, for instance, sleeps at least 12 hours a day. Both ladies have trouble maintaining regular jobs - even part time - because they are so vulnerable to anxiety and fatigue. So it's sad that they are limited, but at least they are able to maintain their own apartments and have a little bit of a life - one making jewelry in her home and one teaching and composing a little - rather than being locked up in an asylum.

 

[sillylionlove]

I think with Chris his mental illness problems were masked by the alcohol and prescription drug use. It's a shame really. From reading the article with John Baldwin, I get the impression in my head of a homeless drunk roaming the streets. I know this sounds so cruel but it's not uncommon. It's such a shame. But if he didn't want to help himself, then there was nothing John or Frank or anyone else for that matter could have done.

It kind of makes you think about all the comments we make about Sasha doing acting and other things, Emily going to school, Michelle doing her own thing........

By the way Joesitz...if you can afford to go to these things then you are ok. It's when you go and really can't afford it that's a problem!!

 

[jmld9801]

To add to sillylionlove's comment,

There is also an association of bipolar disorder with creativity. The disease is more common among creative people than the general public.

Hi,

Just wanted to mention an excellent book on this topic:

Touched with Fire: Manic-Depressive Illness and the Artistic Temperament

by Kay Redfield Jamison

 

[Penny]

The Bowman Maria exhibition clip was so beautiful and his performance so musical. It should be required viewing for all young male figure skaters. And notice the full house.

 

[emma]

The Bowman Maria exhibition clip was so beautiful and his performance so musical. It should be required viewing for all young male figure skaters. And notice the full house.

It's a classic, truly beautiful - his line, extension, posture, flow, tempo....I just feel so amazed and week in the knees (even while sitting) when I watch it.

 

[heyang]

I mentioned that my friend's partner is bi-polar. His "high's" aren't extrodinairy. From what I've understood, they tend to be brief periods of uncontrollable laughter. His lows are very infrequent, but they are deep.

He does seem to have a hyper-sensitivity to drugs. Something as simple as a Claritin D can really set him off. As mentioned, his dosage was so low that his psychologist agreed that it would be ok to wean off of meds.

It is also very important that he get enough rest. He said that even just watching shows like Amazing Race can get his heart pumping. After 9/11 (his apartment was just blocks from the WTC), he had anxiety attacks where he would just end up roaming around and not recall where he had been.

He's a dog walker in NYC and collect disability. On one level, I understand how it would be difficult for him to deal with a full time job. However, on another level, I have a hard time because he has money that he hides in order to collect goverment assistance.

 

[gsrossano]

However, on another level, I have a hard time because he has money that he hides in order to collect goverment assistance.

See bipolar people are creative!

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

That camel spin couldn't have been more gorgeous.

How many posters here absolutely need speed in skating? I much prefer skating to the music at the appropriate speed even if it looks slow to others.

The slow revolutions on that camel were totally in sync with the music. That is text book speed at its most goregous.

Joe

 

[sillylionlove]

How many posters here absolutely need speed in skating? I much prefer skating to the music at the appropriate speed even if it looks slow to others.

Joe

I have to agree. They always talk about how Carolina Kostner is really fast on the ice. She is fast but I don't think her skating is that great in my opinion. I prefer someone who is slower but more interpretive of the music and shows more emotion.