Ladies LP

[ehdtkqorl123]

Well, as I wrote in the beginning, I didn't want anyone to make comparison to Kwan because I knew this story will go forever like this. So let's stop talking about that in this thread. To me, it seems like Kwan lovers' best will be Kwan forever and Yu-Na lovers' best will be Yu-Na forever and Mao lover's best will be Mao forever. I also see that some super uber loyal fans are reluctant to admit what's against their belief, and yea that's natural. Just stop undermining other skaters for your favorite skater. Different people think in different ways. Again, every skater is different. Period.

 

[ilunga1965]

Holy, didn't check this thread for awhile and all of a sudden we're talking about Michelle.

While I agree that Michelle will definitely be remembered, I don't think Mao and Yuna will be forgotten. They're still young, and I don't see them as the type of skater who retires after winning a big title. I think they'll stick around and compete as rivals for awhile.

I agree with you. I do not know exactly the situation of Mao in Japan, but here in Korea I don't think that Yuna will retire so soon. Actually she attempted to quit skating several times before(because of the injuries, the financial problem and the horrible training condition here then), but she has continued. When she went to Canada for skating, the Korean coach who had coached her when she was a kid asked Wilson only one thing - to make her a happy skater, and Wilson made it!!

Her short-term goal may be winning in the Olympic games, but she mentioned that that's not her untimate goal. As long as she remains as a happy skater without injuries, the color of medal may not bother her that much.

My Japanese friend has once told me that Mao has grown as a princess on the ice and many Japanese have a high expectation for her. That's why I feel that she will remain on the ice, experiencing ups and downs like the others.

 

[*Sniper*]

Kwanford Wife

Thank you for sharing your insightful view on the subject!
All I can say is that the figure skating was lucky to have Michelle, and I hope the current and future stars can fill her shoes.

 

[Mathman]

There wasn't just one bunch of flowers on the ice but several. I remember a guy sitting two rows below me threw it like a discus thrower to the ice. It wasn't sunflowers, i think, but it was thrown near the spot where yuna later attempted her flip jump. I am not saying yuna missed the jump because of this but i felt uncomfortable by the items thrown unpacked.

To me, the common sense solution would be, don't throw anything onto the ice, period. Instead, why couldn't the fans come down to the boards and hand them to the flower girls and boys.

But then again, it's a tradition (sort of like throwing beer cans at the opposing team's centerfielder in baseball ) It lets the crowd get into the game and show support for their fave. :yes:

...Where I live there's a sizable Korean community. The local Korean newspaper often devotes a whole page to Kim, even for a Grand Prix event. (An acquaintance showed me the page from his current paper. The picture was a gigantic close-up worthy of a Hollywood A-lister.)

My local newspaper, the Detroit Free Press, ran a big picture today of Savchenko and Szolkowy in their SP white-face clown outfits, under the caption, "Mimes on Ice -- and I dare you to think of a better can't miss combination" (snicker, snicker). No mention of the competition, just a picture designed to show how silly the sport is. :disagree:

 

[kyla2]

It's About The Whole Sport

Yes, the Golden Age of Skating= Michelle Kwan. I guess our point is that it doesn't have to be the end of the golden age if a skater would step up to the plate and the ISU backed off. By that I mean put together a program that has music that brings the audience in (something that evokes emotion and not this monotone, uninspiring elevator music that is interesting only as a dissection project to PHD's in music), skate it like you actually have a connection to the music and not going through the motion, and choreograph it with steps that actually relate to the music (not this flailing around with the arm stuff that makes a pretense to graceful and purposeful movement). This is all doable. Without a connection to the audience, a skater will not be memorable. Right now, there is no one with an international connection. So for those of you that are unhappy about Michelle being part of the conversation, too bad, so sad but this will be the case until someone rises to the challenge of making skating a sport people care about.

 

[Mathman]

Long before there was a Michelle Kwan there was...JOANIE WESTON, the highest-paid female athlete of the 1960s.

Joanie was the star of the San Francisco Bombers roller derby team. (She was played by Rachel Welsh in the 1972 movie, "Kansas City Bombers.")

He-e-e-re's Joanie

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

I guess I just don't see how "Danse Macabre" or "Umbrellas of Cherbourg" or "Rhapsody in Blue" "The Piano" are pieces of music of interest only to PHD students. I don't see how something as playful as Kim's Bond piece can described as monotone. I just don't get it. I don't get NEGATIVE comparisons of the current crop of skaters vs. Tara Lipinski (seriously, you lost me utterly with that statement).

I think Figure Skating is essentially a niche sport. Michelle Kwan transcended that and it's to her credit. Yu-Na Kim has transformed herself into the most popular person in South Korea and that's to her credit.

The fact the sport isn't as popular in America now as it was fifteen years ago, well - it's natural. But all this handwringing about the ISU and the current judging system just sounds like empty nostalgia ("Back in the good old days....")

 

[seniorita]

Now that is a real conspiracy!!
I thought a young GIRL cleaned up the mess, not a boy.
So was it a boy or a girl?

there was a girl and a boy, both over the top with flowers and gifts,these suspicious sunflowers were left last cause boy went to pick them and couldnt then girl came to help and clean, but really I didnt pay attention who had what at the end cause they were both up to the sky with gifts, and I had near me fans of Japan who were teaching me words, and then the announcement came not to throw things unwrapped and I took notice..if i knew the whole fuss about it I would have taken serious notes
I dont like the throwing things habit much, especially when you sit and things behind you dont reach the final destination and are dropped on your head But if it is good for the skaters and it gives them a smile it is fine:yes:

MAo was not on the end of exhibition, maybe she left for russia right away?

 

[evangeline]

Yes, the Golden Age of Skating= Michelle Kwan. I guess our point is that it doesn't have to be the end of the golden age if a skater would step up to the plate and the ISU backed off.

I don't think it's that simple. I like Michelle, but she is not the be-all-and-end-all of figure skating. She was the right skater (attractive, talented, and consistently victorious) who, perhaps more importantly, rose to prominence at the right time: when interest in figure skating was coasting at an all-time high thanks to the knee-whack hoopla. Michelle's meteoric rise to fame would perhaps be quite different if she started to work her way up the ranks today.

Popularity, like fame, is often a fickle thing--it comes and goes, especially for a niche sport like figure skating. Figure skating's popularity has indeed waned in the US, and blaming the current figure skaters for having lousy, unmemorable programs that don't connect to the audience does a disservice to the many very talented figure skaters today, and really doesn't answer any questions at all (emotions are subjective, after all).

And really, I don't think you can watch programs like Lambiel's Poeta LP or Yu-Na's Danse Macabre SP and sincerely say that they are unmemorable programs with monotone, uninspiring music and flailing-arms choreography.

 

[*Sniper*]

there was a girl and a boy, both over the top with flowers and gifts,these suspicious sunflowers were left last cause boy went to pick them and couldnt then girl came to help and clean, but really I didnt pay attention who had what at the end cause they were both up to the sky with gifts, and I had near me fans of Japan who were teaching me words, and then the announcement came not to throw things unwrapped and I took notice..if i knew the whole fuss about it I would have taken serious notes
I dont like the throwing things habit much, especially when you sit and things behind you dont reach the final destination and are dropped on your head But if it is good for the skaters and it gives them a smile it is fine:yes:

MAo was not on the end of exhibition, maybe she left for russia right away?

 

[Medusa]

I loved Kim's footwork towards the end of the program, that was excellent, so lovely. Perfectly to the music. Really impressive. There weren't any excessive movements à la Lysacek, Plushenko or even Asada - it simply suited the music amazingly well, so elegant, no awkwardness. Loved it.

I am still miffed about the 5 Triples, but what really bothered me that her skipping the Triple Flip disrupted the program as much as a fall would have. She really just stood there for the seconds the jump would have taken. That was a rather glaring mistake - and should be considered in the marks.

 

[bmelanie]

I am still miffed about the 5 Triples, but what really bothered me that her skipping the Triple Flip disrupted the program as much as a fall would have. She really just stood there for the seconds the jump would have taken. That was a rather glaring mistake - and should be considered in the marks.

How did it disrupt the program (as much as a fall would have)? You never know how bad a fall may be - remember Yukari and her popped arm at the Japan Open - and if Yuna felt that something wasn't quite right for the jump then it was a good decision on her part to not do it. Also, falls often cause the skaters to finish after the music, it disrupts the timing of the entire program, while Yuna simply went on and followed the music.

 

[Moxy]

Hi all - my first post here, although I've been following the forum for a while...

Just wanted to make a quick comment re: the...uh..."sunflower incident" (yikes)

Please let's not take this to ridiculous heights. Kim Yu-Na herself clarified in an interview today:
"I think there was a cavity on the ice - the blade caught it as I went into the three-turn, speeding it up. I lost the timing, so gave up on the jump because I felt that I would probably fall."
And she added:
"It was my mistake, and I don't want to make any excuses. I don't like to place blame."

If you've ever gone skiing or skating (mostly the former for me, not much good at the latter unfortunately), you've probably experienced what she's talking about - catching on a pit on the snow/ice, losing control and falling. It happens. It's a freak accident, no one's fault really. (That said, of course it is important to securely wrap any gifts/flowers to be thrown onto the ice. Yukari was momentarily disrupted because the flower boy/girl/(??) had to clean up the ice, and I can imagine that if I were a skater getting ready to do my free program, I would not appreciate the distraction and the delay.)

Hopefully that clears it up. I think Yu-Na feels uncomfortable about all these wild speculations, as well -- so if you really care about her, please do her a favor and don't go about blowing things out of proportion. I understand that people sometimes want to make excuses for those they care about - but in this case, Yu-Na clearly doesn't want to do that, so let's respect her wishes.

That's all! Happy forum-ing! (I will now revert to my quiescent forum-browsing...)

 

[Daniel5555]

I'm really getting more and more surprised as I come in this topic.
Now we're talking about Michelle Kwan... While it's questionless that she is a legendary skater, she is not the only one who carried out that skating popularity. For the instance, if you ask a regular person in Russia who is Michelle Kwan, no one will remember her, because instead of her they had Irina Slutskaya, as the legendary and best skater for the same time.
Just for being American, Michelle carried out the popularity that others could not and still can not. I wonder how it would be if she was a Chinese skater and how she would be in that case.

But that's not the point. What happens now is the lack of promotion. When Michelle and Sasha left, the channels lost their interest in the sport because there was no other American skaters who could be the same stars as those. That's why there is no interesting in showing figure skating and that's why most of us are forced to watch Asian channels.

kyla2

I sure hope some of you can get a Korean t.v. station in 2 years.

I can get it right now, you know...

Take a look at the stadiums when Yu Na Kim and Mao skate, they aren't even near full, this is internationally. Lot's of empty seats. There is a reason for that. Yes, Yu Na is a star in Korea and Mao in Japan but that's pretty much it. They don't connect with audiences internationally and Michelle did.

Orly?
Somehow both Mao and Yuna got a lot of fans, including some from Spain and Italy. And I, honestly, couldn't care less for skating when Michelle and Slutskaya were around. But not because of them, it was because of me. Watching skating is not the same as watching soccer. It's kind of sport that you have to understand. It's not simple, the competitions are long and it lacks direct confrontation. The biggest part of the audience won't like it just because it is the way it is.

Michelle is gone, and I am ranting (rage, rage against the dying of the light). Yu Na Kim's jumps are textbook, but I find her music and choreography lackluster. I feel like I am watching the same program again and again.

Because you want it to be that way. It's a two way road. While people like me get all their mind excited by her programs others just don't feel it. But that means that this program is actually working on someone, so maybe it's not the program's fault in the first place.

I'm not Asian, nor American, I'm from Spain and from the side I can clearly see what happens. Love it or hate it, but Mao and Yuna already made history. If figure skating is no longer popular in USA, well, let Japan and Korea be the next centres of this sport. I can't care less about that. But the sad thing is that people will always remain their minds close, some to the whole figure skating, others to the certain skaters.

 

[ehdtkqorl123]

I'm not Asian, nor American, I'm from Spain and from the side I can clearly see what happens. Love it or hate it, but Mao and Yuna already made history. If figure skating is no longer popular in USA, well, let Japan and Korea be the next centres of this sport. I can't care less about that. But the sad thing is that people will always remain their minds close, some to the whole figure skating, others to the certain skaters.

:thumbsup:

Let's say we can use a time machine to bring young Michelle back to today and let her skate disguising her face so that nobody can recognize her. I am sure some MK fans will still say, she is good but she can't even get close to our Michelle.

 

[janetfan]

:thumbsup:

Let's say we can use a time machine to bring young Michelle back to today and let her skate disguising her face so that nobody can recognize her. I am sure some MK fans will still say, she is good but she can't even get close to our Michelle.

That's an interesting observation and you might be right.

After watching USA Ladies for the past few seasons I do think almost any new girl that came along, consistently landing 7 triples in an era when the best in the world are landing 4-5 would win over American skating fans pretty quickly.

But there was something special about Michelle - just as there is something special about Yuna and Mao.

And Michelle fans might consider that she seems to be a pretty big fan of Yuna.
And who can blame her?

 

[kyla2]

More.....

Oh Evangeline, yes I can say that and yes I did. Daniel, I am glad you are a happy camper in Spain and you are enjoying figure skating as it currently exists, but it is a niche sport in decline in both the United States and in Europe. The quality of skating and the quality of the programs are in decline. Viewership has tanked. It is a sport in trouble. Daniel, most of us don't get Korean t.v. stations (or want to for that matter). Since you don't live in the U.S. it's kind of a moot point from your persepctive don't you think?

 

[Tigger]

O.k. for those of you that lack historical perspective and don't see the difference in the sport since Michelle skated, I can only assume that you didn't watch figure skating then or you were visually challenged.

Kyla, do you think there's a chance you could make your points in a less offensive and arrogant manner?

I am visually impaired thanks to a degenerative eye disease and I found the quoted material up there more than a tad insulting. We get it. You've more than made your point about what you think. There was a better and less insulting manner to do it though.

 

[Mathman]

Welcome, Macemace1980 and Moxy. Thanks for joining in. Post often, post long. :agree:

 

[demarinis5]

OK How did the Kween get into this thread. I must have missed something. I will have to go back and review.