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KVDP fans unite!!!.....

In all of this talk about Lambiel, Plushenko, Joubert, and Lindemann, I should take it upon myself to mention that the much-loved-on-this-forum (well, by some :p ) Kevin van der Perren (the only Belgian skater you will prolly ever see in your lives on the World stage) managed to finish 6th with two clean skates and a clean 3axel in both programmes (all ye naysayers out there)


YAY KVDP!!!!

Edited to add: And a 3sal-3toe-3loop combo in the LP (his trademark) that, if you haven't seen it, :love: :love: .....
 
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Having seen most of this programs I have to say

Plushenko: I really don't know how he did it, because he looked very nervous to me but what a performance!! he slightly two footed the quad but I think the Eurosport guys (brit guys) were too amazed to even care. He has changed some cuts in the music but unless you know the program by heart you won't notice, and he has change some of his jumps. I love his footwork section but I think he needs to fix something because he has music to spare, is the second time that he arrives so fast to his footwork section that he has to wonder around until the music hit the appropiate note. I love the performance, the energy, when the big jumps were over, you could see in his face that he knew that he had that title again and he put it all in the rest of the performance. I love it!! :rock: (then again, being a Plush fan, I always do! :agree: )

Joubert: I was really surprised that I enjoyed this performance. I liked when he had "Time" and "The Untouchables" and I was glad to see his own style back, not completly but returning slowly. He has changed the music cuts in his programs from the middle until the end (it has more choral parts and IMO sounds miles better than his GP performances), his jumps when they are on are always great to watch and he is trying new position to his spins but I think he needs to spin a little faster (excpet for his sit spin that is fast enough). Considering this guy though of withdrawing from this event 'cause his coaches problems, I think this performance was great, although he did look quite tentative to me, like he just wanted to have all the elements done.

Lindemann: I lurve this guy!! and he has the most impressive quad I ever seen, I swear he could have crossed to the other side of the board into the audience if he wanted to. This is a great program by him, it does suit him, it's like a longer version of his SP "Earnest". He fought for the jumps and after the fall he tried not to make any more mistakes. Reaction in the K&C was priceless when he realized that he had won a medal.

Lambiel: I have a problem because I want him and Lindemann on the podium but since Plush and Joubert seem to be a lock in it, one of this two has to be left out. Lambiel has a good program but I hardly think this was it (despite the mistakes). The spins are exquisite as always but I think since this was the first international competition for Lambiel, nerves got to best of him and it showed. I really hope he does better and Worlds where I would have a personal problem trying to decide who I want in a better position, him or Lindemann. I really hope Lambiel does not turn to be like Abt. Euros should really consider giving a pewter medal

Griazev: Kudos for the quad! People say Joubert is a Yagudin's clone but after watching Euros, I have to say that Andrei is, his program, you can easily see Yagudin's style written all over him

I'm already excited for Worlds!!
 
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Matt said:
In all of this talk about Lambiel, Plushenko, Joubert, and Lindemann, I should take it upon myself to mention that the much-loved-on-this-forum (well, by some :p ) Kevin van der Perren (the only Belgian skater you will prolly ever see in your lives on the World stage) managed to finish 6th with two clean skates and a clean 3axel in both programmes (all ye naysayers out there)
YAY KVDP!!! And a 3sal-3toe-3loop combo in the LP (his trademark) that, if you haven't seen it, :love: :love: .....

Ximena said:
Lindemann: I lurve this guy!! and he has the most impressive quad I ever seen, I swear he could have crossed to the other side of the board into the audience if he wanted to. This is a great program by him, it does suit him, it's like a longer version of his SP "Earnest". He fought for the jumps and after the fall he tried not to make any more mistakes. Reaction in the K&C was priceless when he realized that he had won a medal.

The field at Europeans was very deep. The Americans and Canadians are going to have to fight to get a spot on the podium at worlds.
 
brad640 said:
The field at Europeans was very deep. The Americans and Canadians are going to have to fight to get a spot on the podium at worlds.



ITA. It's great to see all these skaters giving the best of them, and I am sure they want to prove that they all deserve to be in the world podium, just like the Americans and canadians will want to prove themselves. Everything is setting up for quite an event at Worlds.
 
Kudos to Griazev for the quad, the two 3As, and not falling apart when it looked like the program could have gotten away from him. Whoever thinks he's a Yagudin clone, whatever. He is 19 years old, finding his own style, and looking a bright future in the face.

Kasey
 
Kasey said:
Kudos to Griazev for the quad, the two 3As, and not falling apart when it looked like the program could have gotten away from him. Whoever thinks he's a Yagudin clone, whatever. He is 19 years old, finding his own style, and looking a bright future in the face.

Kasey

I don't think Andrei is a *clone* of Yagudin, but there are gestures that remind me of him. Maybe he's picking it up when Yagudin's showing him something...?
 
fallsauce said:
I don't think Andrei is a *clone* of Yagudin, but there are gestures that remind me of him. Maybe he's picking it up when Yagudin's showing him something...?

Well Andrei is coached by Tarasova and if I'm not mistaken when Yagudin has time he helped him too, so one can see from where the influence comes from.

All and all this is a good result considering in March, Andrei will for sure get a lot of pressure to keep his result at Euros into Worlds, which would be hard considering that the non-Euro guys will be there.
 
brad640 said:
The field at Europeans was very deep. The Americans and Canadians are going to have to fight to get a spot on the podium at worlds.
Lindemann had very bad skates in the GPs as did Joubert. The Americans and Canadians had very good ones. Why should one competition where they are not entered make you decide the N.Americans will be the only competitors to fight to get a spot on the podium at worlds?

There is a battle for placements in Worlds, true. Just two places. Evgeni is a shoo in. I am hoping for Lambiel, but that is not going to get him on the podium. The fight for the podium is among many skaters not just the N.Americans. Let's see if Li gets good scores. He was not entered in this Euros thing.

Joe

Joe
 
Joesitz said:
Lindemann had very bad skates in the GPs as did Joubert. The Americans and Canadians had very good ones. Why should one competition where they are not entered make you decide the N.Americans will be the only competitors to fight to get a spot on the podium at worlds?

I don't think the North Americans are the only ones who will have to fight. Everyone made mistakes at Europeans and they will have to fight to improve before Moscow. However, I'm concerned because I perceive that Buttle and Weir in particular became over-confident by the success they had in the Grand Prix and possibly believe that they are favored for the podium because of their artistry alone. I do not mean to say that they are weak technically. Weir is the only one of the top competitors who is consistent with the 3a3t so far this season and has had great technique on all of his triples, though the flip was weak at nationals which affected the overall impact of both programs for me. Buttle has the best interpretation of anyone, and I'm glad that the new system has recognized that.

I think that the North Americans seem timid right now about adding the quad because they aren't sure that they will need it to medal at worlds, and from the results of Europeans I think that the odds are good that at least one out of Joubert, Lambiel or Lindemann will complete 3 programs at worlds that include decent (in the minds of the judges) artistry and a quad combination. I was impressed that all three made great improvements for Europeans after the poor Grand Prix that you mentioned and Lambiel's injury. I do feel that Joubert is unfairly rewarded in the PCS scores, but that is all the more reason for Weir and Buttle to match him on jumps to overtake him in the standings.

I see Sandhu differently because he is already risking two quad attempts without much success this season, but the top competitors are always looking over their shoulder at him because he has the potential to skate well and win. As for Goebel, I don't see him medalling unless others have mistakes. He is now only attempting one quad, and though I think the move to Weissiger will be good for his artistry and mental state, the improvements he had at nationals still will not put him ahead of the Europeans. If he were to land three quads in the long again, it could be a different story, but I think that time has passed for him.

If the judges do reward Li, I will be very surprised because this season has been going against him so far. Also, I am not ruling out surprises. In fact I'm hoping that someone new will emerge leading into the Olympics that will break everyone out of the one-quad-and-mediocre-artistry mindset that is keeping the field stagnant right now.

I may change my position if anything monumental happens at 4CC, which seems unlikely - Weir said early on that he wanted to win 4CC this year as part of his plan for moving up at worlds, but now he is not scheduled to compete. For now I see the Europeans as having an advantage based on their performances at last year's worlds and this year's Europeans.
 
Hi Brad...

Here is a quote from an article including an interview with Johnny right after his win at US Nats. I think he is clearing indicating that he knows he needs a quad.

Still, to challenge for a medal at the World Championships, Weir will need to attempt a quadruple jump that he has yet to try. "The quad is a very big part of men's skating today," said Weir. "And I do realize that I need one. I'll put one in when I am ready." Weir readily admits that he will need a quad to beat current World Champ Evgeny Plushenko. Though Weir was awaiting confirmation of being named to the Four Continent's Cup Team, he admits that he would like to try the quad at the event in Korea. "I think that it would be a good idea to go so that I can try the quad," Weir stated. "So I have it for the first time under my belt before the World Championships."

I don't get the impression that Johnny is heading to World's (and probably not 4CC at all from more recent info) with the idea he can stand on top of the podium quadless. And if he's smart, he's not even thinking about the top of the podium at World's right now. (at least I don't think that would be very smart if he were to put that sort of pressure on himself - think Sasha.)

DG
 
ITA Doggy girl - I don't think Johnny is under any illusion he can get gold or even on the podium without a quad. I'm glad to read that he is going to try one at 4CC. I was surprised he accepted to go to there. I will be watching and somewhat hoping he lands one. I've seen it in practice.

But Stephane, has a quad combo and if he lands it and stays on his skates throughout the routine, I think he will be silver; gold if Plushy misses his.

At this point I think Tim has more audience appeal than Brian who will not crack that stone face and rigid body. Tim has loosened up.

I hope Butle also goes to 4CC. I need to have another look against Johnny.

Joe
 
Joesitz said:
I hope Butle also goes to 4CC. I need to have another look against Johnny.

Alas, neither Buttle nor Weir will go to 4C's. Sawyer, Ferreira, and Andreev are going to 4C's. (Along with Hawker and Boissonneault, Putnam/Wirtz and Bergeron/Davison, and Senft/Gislafson, Patinaude/Denis, and Girard/Yaeger.)

http://www.skatecanada.ca/en/athletes/national_teams/international_assignments/
(Scroll to ISU Championships)

US entries are:

Lysacek, Savoie, Delmore
Kirk, Liang, Corwin
Orscher/Lucash, Inoue/Baldwin, Evora/Ladwig (Hinzmann/Parchem declined, as Hinzmann had surgery immediately after US Nats)
Belbin/Agosto, Gregory/Petukhov (hopefully she's recovered from the concussion she had right before US Nats), and Manon/O'Meara.
 
Joesitz said:
At this point I think Tim has more audience appeal than Brian who will not crack that stone face and rigid body. Tim has loosened up.

Joe

Brian was actually a lot more free with his expression at Euros than I have seen him in the past. And an interview he gave confirmed that it is only recently, since his coaching change, that he has felt like he was enjoying his skating and it wasn't feeling like hard work and I think that showed in his performances.

He still has a long way to go, but I'd settle for the Brian that won the bronze medal in euros a couple of years ago who always seemed to have a smile on his face as a start ;)
 
diver chick said:
He still has a long way to go, but I'd settle for the Brian that won the bronze medal in euros a couple of years ago who always seemed to have a smile on his face as a start ;)
I remember that competition. For some reason they showed more skating on TV then usual, and it was my first glimpse of Stephane. While I had no complaint about Brian (he was definitely a better skater then), I was hoping for Stephane.

Brian should have buidling up on that performance but he got into toerake footwork which is a crowd pleaser but not difficult and his presentation went downhill. Glad to hear it is picking up again. Hope I get to see it on TV.

Joe
 
Doggygirl said:
Here is a quote from an article including an interview with Johnny right after his win at US Nats. I think he is clearing indicating that he knows he needs a quad.

Still, to challenge for a medal at the World Championships, Weir will need to attempt a quadruple jump that he has yet to try. "The quad is a very big part of men's skating today," said Weir. "And I do realize that I need one. I'll put one in when I am ready." Weir readily admits that he will need a quad to beat current World Champ Evgeny Plushenko. Though Weir was awaiting confirmation of being named to the Four Continent's Cup Team, he admits that he would like to try the quad at the event in Korea. "I think that it would be a good idea to go so that I can try the quad," Weir stated. "So I have it for the first time under my belt before the World Championships."

I don't get the impression that Johnny is heading to World's (and probably not 4CC at all from more recent info) with the idea he can stand on top of the podium quadless. And if he's smart, he's not even thinking about the top of the podium at World's right now. (at least I don't think that would be very smart if he were to put that sort of pressure on himself - think Sasha.)

DG



johnny knows he needs a consistent quad combo and alot of help from plushy to beat him. I don't think he will land one at worlds but is a good idea to try one at 4cc. he can medal with a clean skate :biggrin:
 
curious said:
johnny knows he needs a consistent quad combo and alot of help from plushy to beat him. I don't think he will land one at worlds but is a good idea to try one at 4cc. he can medal with a clean skate :biggrin:
I would prefer both Plushy and Johnny skate their best (with quads) and check out the details of the scoring. That would be more interesting and more helpful for Johnny if he intends to win the Olys.

Joe
 
I think the quad could play a big role this time at Worlds for those who can land it and do not bomb the rest of the program. For instance, let's imagine that in the QR, the quad guys meaning Plush, Joubert, Li, Lindemman, Lambiel, Dambier, Goebel land at least 1, that would be a 2.25 points (I'm already multiplying by .25), although for GOebel and Dambier that they do 4S would be 2.375. Then this same people do 1 in the SP and two in the FS, if they don't bomb the rest of their program, just for the quad is 29.37 for the quad sal skaters, and 29.25 for the quad toe skaters.

And eventhough this plays a lot with that "what if" situation but it's not something impossible to think, last worlds, the top four guys each landed two quads and three of those four landed it in the SP (don't remember QR)

It's almost a 30 point lead (for 4quads: 1QR, 1SP, 2FS) over all the guys that don't have a quad and that's a lot.

I know quad are not everything which is why I only listed those who also are getting decent very PCS.
 
Ximena said:
I think the quad could play a big role this time at Worlds for those who can land it and do not bomb the rest of the program.
Of course it will, the CoP is not being done fairly and anyway the judges can not possibly grade all those elements in such a limited time.

The judging at Worlds and the Olys will be done with the concepts of the 6.0 system. The quad is the king in the 6.0 system. If one is landed then all other GoEs go up.

Joe
 
Joesitz said:
I would prefer both Plushy and Johnny skate their best (with quads) and check out the details of the scoring. That would be more interesting and more helpful for Johnny if he intends to win the Olys.

Joe


it will be more interesting but johny wants to win a medal so I doubt we'll se a quad from him in moscow.
 
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