Mikhail Kolyada

[vorravorra]

I suspect with the step sequence there might have been a physical issue, especially considering that it's at the end of what is now a more packed program. He didn't botch it after a shocking mistake in the SP after all.

I am not saying it's an unfair score, I am saying there was no reason to expect him to make enough mistakes to get it.

 

[coldblueeyes]

What hurt him was the SP, though. It wouldn't surprise me to see him skating such FS, especially if he'd cleaned the SP, that was the hard blow for him.

 

[vorravorra]

Hi All! Such a disappointing weekend, can't shake a feeling of deep sadness and just could not make myself write before. Instead read everything here on the GS and on Russian forums. Won't repeat all the things but just a few thoughts:

1. Physically clearly something going on with Mika, he never was catching 'things' so easily and so often. It seems Valentina was sick and Mika might have caught the virus from her. His immune system seems to be weakened. Maybe due to all the pressure of the last season, maybe in part to dieting in order to lose weight (I hate when skaters do that!) he was able to jump 4T back in 2015/16 season and looked mush healthier then being about two of himself of now
2. Valentina seems to be unable to help him mentally before the competition anymore- I have a respect and admiration for her as a coach but I sense some disconnect from what little we can see from their interactions in the K&C. Could that other coach the man who listed as his second coach to travel with him instead?
3. There are cries for a coaching change on Russian forums, I normally against this as a remedy for all but something has to change. The trouble is there is no suitable alternative in Russia and the only one who comes to mind is Raf (and I think it could be very good as they clearly had a good rapport in the summer) but who is to pay for that? Unless the RUsFed is to send Mika sort of involuntarily and pay for it, I don't see it happening which is a pity though it might not work also.
4. IMHO the root of Mika's struggles is in his perfectionism, on the plus side it gives us, fans, the pleasure of watching these perfect jumps & spins and SS, but for Mika himself it is not a good thing. I suspect also that his coaching team actively encourages his perfectionism to grow out of all proportions without realising what psychological issues it brings with it. A perfectionist ideally should be surrounded by people who would do just the opposite - to discourage it and create a more laid-back atmosphere for a 'sufferer'
What happened in the SP I read as the first mistake on 4T was so unexpected & devastating to him (especially after his practices went so well) that he simply could not get over it fast enough to get 3lz-3T, a fair play to him that he recovered for the rest of the program. I don't want even to mention LP it was just heartbreaking to see him skate like that
5. I don't see it as the end of the world if he doesn't go to GPF - the medal there this season is a way more problematic, so going and staying out of the podium would be regarded as a step back by the Russian Fed & media anyway
6. CoR is going to be a real test of character for both Mika and us, fans, but I personally not going to give up on him no matter what. There have to be better times for Mika & us!

I am not sure his team necessarily encourages his perfectionism and they have been accused of creating an atmosphere that is too easygoing if anything. I think Valentina mentioned that Misha can expect too much too fast as a problem in an interview, not something to be encouraged. I would imagine a coach like Eteri and the atmosphere in that group would be more likely to feed into the insecurities of a perfectionist.

Misha had a stepout on at least one 4T in practices, why suddenly be devastated? Turn the page, go on, stuff happens. Easier said than done of course. Perfectionism+self-confidence issues is not a good mixture. And I am not sure Raf can fix this. Chen is not like that to begin with it seems. Maybe Raf can help, maybe not, could be worth trying I guess if it was possible.

 

[vorravorra]

Hi All! Such a disappointing weekend, can't shake a feeling of deep sadness and just could not make myself write before. Instead read everything here on the GS and on Russian forums. Won't repeat all the things but just a few thoughts:

1. Physically clearly something going on with Mika, he never was catching 'things' so easily and so often. It seems Valentina was sick and Mika might have caught the virus from her. His immune system seems to be weakened. Maybe due to all the pressure of the last season, maybe in part to dieting in order to lose weight (I hate when skaters do that!) he was able to jump 4T back in 2015/16 season and looked mush healthier then being about two of himself of now
2. Valentina seems to be unable to help him mentally before the competition anymore- I have a respect and admiration for her as a coach but I sense some disconnect from what little we can see from their interactions in the K&C. Could that other coach the man who listed as his second coach to travel with him instead?

Misha wasn't jumping the 4T consistently in 2015-2016, it was more like 50/50 by his own admission. Next season was better. When they started to put more quads into programs that's when weight became an issue. But Misha doesn't look emaciated, I am not sure there is reason to think he eats too little or too unhealthily to psychically weaken him. Overwork can of course weaken one's immunity just as easily.

Misha is 23 now and he has always had a lot of say in what happens with him in that group. If he'd wanted someone else to go with him to competitions, he would have got his wish. As for the off-ice coach, we know zero about him including if he has any interest in going with Misha to competitions. Misha at some point mentioned a good relationship with him, but asking someone who only knows about skating second-hand to be the main or even only person responsible for a skater at a figure skating competition may not be reasonable.

And I am not sure why people think getting a man will fix things. Misha is a man himself and he once described his own reaction when he had to take a skater out at Junior Nationals, and he reacted worse than before his own skates because he had the responsibility but no control over what happens after the skater is on the ice and that was terrifying. Maybe he will learn to handle this better after he has been a coach for a while but until that happens I don't think he should be made responsible for skaters at important competitions.

I don't envy Valentina's position, come to think about it. It's not like she hasn't tried to help Misha or forbidden him from getting outside help, she was instrumental in him getting outside help in fact. And even if she was prepared to tell him to go to another coach, she could hardly send him to a random someone and it is not in her power to transfer him to Raf. And they don't have the kind of relationship where she could just pull away emotionally and stop caring about what happens to Misha. But then I don't envy Misha's position either.

 

[vorravorra]

I have to say Misha doesn't look as doom and gloom as some of his fans feel and I doubt that is because he has suddenly decided to stop caring - I think he'd rather give up on skating altogether than on skating well. Maybe he knows something we don't. I honestly wish someone could sit him down and ask him what's what, with frank answers and not standard phrases, or therapy speak for that matter. It's all well and good to talk about turning a new leaf, leaving past mistakes behind, starting anew, one season at a time, but does he really feel like that deep down?

 

[rachno2]

I have to say Misha doesn't look as doom and gloom as some of his fans feel and I doubt that is because he has suddenly decided to stop caring - I think he'd rather give up on skating altogether than on skating well. Maybe he knows something we don't. I honestly wish someone could sit him down and ask him what's what, with frank answers and not standard phrases, or therapy speak for that matter. It's all well and good to talk about turning a new leaf, leaving past mistakes behind, starting anew, one season at a time, but does he really feel like that deep down?

It's like you said before, I think he's had to build up a poker face in order to weather all the criticism. The press is already digging their claws into him, mocking him for "losing to Zagitova" and repeating that tired "He isn't a fighter" phrase. I don't blame him for not telling us his true feelings.

He had an uncharacteristically bad performance, scored his lowest in two years, and he still almost made the podium. I know Boyang and Lazukin's poor skates factored into this, but I still find that pretty encouraging. I'm not going to get my hopes up, but it shouldn't be too hard to improve on this and manage a podium finish at Rostelecom. Obviously silver or gold would keep his GPF chances alive, but I'm not going to even entertain that possibility.

For now, a cleaner skate and a bronze medal is good enough for me. I missed seeing him and his smile in his usual spot on the podium.

 

[vorravorra]

It's like you said before, I think he's had to build up a poker face in order to weather all the criticism. The press is already digging their claws into him, mocking him for "losing to Zagitova" and repeating that tired "He isn't a fighter" phrase. I don't blame him for not telling us his true feelings.

He had an uncharacteristically bad performance, scored his lowest in two years, and he still almost made the podium. I know Boyang and Lazukin's poor skates factored into this, but I still find that pretty encouraging. I'm not going to get my hopes up, but it shouldn't be too hard to improve on this and manage a podium finish at Rostelecom. Obviously silver or gold would keep his GPF chances alive, but I'm not going to even entertain that possibility.

For now, a cleaner skate and a bronze medal is good enough for me. I missed seeing him and his smile in his usual spot on the podium.

I don't expect him to disclose his true feelings at the competition or to us, I just would like to have some idea of where he's at. Like "he is not in fact a nervous wreck" if he isn't. There has been too much guessing going on. Of course that likely won't happen.

 

[Heleng]

Agree with all you say but one I don't believe he needs more mileage on 4S in practice after all this is a jump he had even before 4T (reportedly) but more mileage in competition yes maybe he can even do some domestic events and some CS still left Tallinn Trophy & Golden Spin
To your last thought - unfortunately we've seen a many of brilliant talent to fade without ever realising their full potential... considering how cruel the Russian media led by TAT to him I am scared that he might simply decide to retire

I was going by a fairly recent interview when he said he was actively trying to "make friends" with the 4S, or something to that effect, so maybe it was never all that stable earlier? Also, in his latest interview after Helsinki GP he does refer to it as a "new" jump. But since he also says he needs to perform it more in "public" you might be right (I hope) that he just needs more competition mileage with the layout, and that the programs have been going well in practice. (BTW, Just curious, does anyone know whether Misha regularly does full run throughs in practice?)

Another TSL tidbit -- I don't remember their exact wording but their point was that at times Misha and Yuzuru were going head to head with jumps in practice (too bad those jumps didn't appear in competition ).

A random thought -- Nathan is being coached by Raf through Skype sessions, and judging from Skate America, it appears to be working so far. I wonder whether that's a possibility for Misha in order to continue to work on his jumps with Raf?

Regarding GPF, I'm sure he wanted to qualify, since it's a prestigious competition, but it could be a blessing in disguise if he didn't (especially if he's prone to getting sick this season). Vancouver would be quite a long trip for him, and he wouldn't have alot of time once he returned home to recover and prepare for Russian nationals (arguably an even more important competition). I remember an interview last season where he mentioned that the turnaround between GPF and nationals was somewhat challenging.

 

[coldblueeyes]

A random thought -- Nathan is being coached by Raf through Skype sessions, and judging from Skate America, it appears to be working so far. I wonder whether that's a possibility for Misha in order to continue to work on his jumps with Raf?

How much of his problems are strictly technical? Or something that Raf could help him with? I'm sure they worked on his quads in California, somewhat at least. And that translated to him adding the salchow. As I said before, I don't remember him landing this many quads in practice before, but that's not the point. I feel like Misha still needs to find someone that can help him with the psychological aspect of competing, or at least someone that could get different results out of him. Or he needs a competition to cleanse his soul, but that requires a lot of self-strenght, and who knows if he has it.

 

[Imov]

I hope he will be more relaxed on the next competition and hope for the best.

 

[rachno2]

(BTW, Just curious, does anyone know whether Misha regularly does full run throughs in practice?)

This is what I really want to know. We all saw what happened when he missed the opening combo in his SP: he panicked and was unable to regroup in time for a 3Lz-3T. I'm sure they train for these kinds of moments, but for some reason in the heat of competition he is unable to fall back on that training. Or maybe they don't do it enough.

Edit: I just remembered that he was able to recover from the fall on the 4T at Finlandia, so maybe it was just Grand Prix nerves

 

[rachno2]

https://www.sports.ru/figure-skating/1068480776.html

It looks like he plans on keeping the 4S for CoR after all

"In the short program the 3Lz-3T jumping pass didn't work out, in the free skate the 4S and 4T didn't work out. I fought for everything else. Naturally, I'm dissatisfied with such a performance, because I can do better.
How can I jump as well in the competitions as I can in practices? I need to simply skate more, to perform in front of the public again with the 4S, which is new for me, I have to keep jumping that as well.
There's more of a technical factor here, I need to pay more attention to the technical execution and to the whole skate. It is the same conclusion as always: work harder."

I don't expect Misha to talk about his mental health in the press, but I really hope he's doing other things than simply "working harder" between now and Rostelecom. This doesn't bode well for his physical health, either.

Remind me to never read the comments on these articles. It's good practice for my Russian, but the rage isn't worth it

This is the actual interview https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPv1tfqVRfU
Talk about a poker face

 

[Shedi0806]

I've already posted this in the men's thread but I just want to say that we ran into Kolyada and Bychenko on the corridor in Helsinki after the SP. Mikhail is sooo tiny in person but skates soooo big. Seeing him live makes such a difference! It's way he moves.....he radiates energy and power is coming from his exquisite upper body all the way through his fingertips. He skates with so much detail as he creates beautiful shapes on the ice.

 

[Tutto]

Misha wasn't jumping the 4T consistently in 2015-2016, it was more like 50/50 by his own admission. Next season was better. When they started to put more quads into programs that's when weight became an issue. But Misha doesn't look emaciated, I am not sure there is reason to think he eats too little or too unhealthily to psychically weaken him. Overwork can of course weaken one's immunity just as easily.

Misha is 23 now and he has always had a lot of say in what happens with him in that group. If he'd wanted someone else to go with him to competitions, he would have got his wish. As for the off-ice coach, we know zero about him including if he has any interest in going with Misha to competitions. Misha at some point mentioned a good relationship with him, but asking someone who only knows about skating second-hand to be the main or even only person responsible for a skater at a figure skating competition may not be reasonable.

And I am not sure why people think getting a man will fix things. Misha is a man himself and he once described his own reaction when he had to take a skater out at Junior Nationals, and he reacted worse than before his own skates because he had the responsibility but no control over what happens after the skater is on the ice and that was terrifying. Maybe he will learn to handle this better after he has been a coach for a while but until that happens I don't think he should be made responsible for skaters at important competitions.

I don't envy Valentina's position, come to think about it. It's not like she hasn't tried to help Misha or forbidden him from getting outside help, she was instrumental in him getting outside help in fact. And even if she was prepared to tell him to go to another coach, she could hardly send him to a random someone and it is not in her power to transfer him to Raf. And they don't have the kind of relationship where she could just pull away emotionally and stop caring about what happens to Misha. But then I don't envy Misha's position either.

Ok Mika hasn't got yet to the state of Natalia Zabiako who positively looks like she spent an entire off-season in the nazi concentration camp, but he is very thin.

The fact Mika was nervous in a new for him role of a coach doesn't mean that all male coaches are. I just think he has a way too many women around him and men tend to see a bigger picture and even just talking a man to man might be more productive. I don't believe he could lightly say to Valentina you know I don't want you with me at competitions anymore even if he knows his wish would be granted, wouldn't it a bit awkward?

It is a difficult position for both (they have been together for 18 (!) years) yet I think it is harder for Mika as Valentina supported him financially & otherwise and he feels obliged no doubt. Maybe Valentina already raised the subject of coaching change but he refused - we will never know.
She knows him best but somehow it does not help in preparing him for competitions. I wonder if her own lack of competitive experience plays a role or Mika lost a trust in her ability after the Oly or maybe even the very fact that they are so close means that even all the right things she says are not reaching him anymore?
Alas even Mika makes that tough decision to break off where would he go? On second thought Raf is not a good option - with Mika's enlarged sense of duty & obligation, the fact that RusFed would be paying for his stay there would only create more pressure for him to get good results.
I was thinking of Urmanov there was a rumour a good while ago that he was relocating to St Petersburg from Sochi? I liked the way he worked with Yulia.
In a perfect world devoid of the borders, money constraints & language barriers I would 'send' him to Shoma's coach - I just could see them having fits of laughter together in K&C no matter how disastrous the skate was!
Actually to think about it the whole thing is totally workable, Shoma can be sent to Valentina to work on his jumping technique thus cancelling the tuition fees for both!

 

[Tutto]

I am not sure his team necessarily encourages his perfectionism and they have been accused of creating an atmosphere that is too easygoing if anything. I think Valentina mentioned that Misha can expect too much too fast as a problem in an interview, not something to be encouraged. I would imagine a coach like Eteri and the atmosphere in that group would be more likely to feed into the insecurities of a perfectionist.

Misha had a stepout on at least one 4T in practices, why suddenly be devastated? Turn the page, go on, stuff happens. Easier said than done of course. Perfectionism+self-confidence issues is not a good mixture. And I am not sure Raf can fix this. Chen is not like that to begin with it seems. Maybe Raf can help, maybe not, could be worth trying I guess if it was possible.

In my assumption (and of course it is only that -assumption) i went by that little that we know:
his mother is strict by his own admission stricter than Valentina
Valentina has been very meticulous in teaching him a proper jumping technique
Olga, I think you mentioned it yourself a good while ago (sorry if I am mistaken) is very exact in her approach - top levels spins, steps are due to her coaching/supervision
That tutor of his at the Uni who preaches that a jump has to be landed 110 times out of 100 in practice before it will become consistent in competition - well I strongly disagree with that. No one has 100% success rate in practice but there comes the time when you just have to come out and jump it in competition and don't be afraid to make a mistake.
So my gut feeling is that Mika by nature somewhat of perfectionist to begin with is surrounded by people who only make it worse.
What happen this season I understand now was the worst idea of all (for a perfectionist) to downgrade the tech in order to skate clean. When clean didn't materialise Mika probably started to feel frustrated with himself - how come I skated that SP layout for three seasons now and I still can't get it right? - Panic! I'll sure skate it clean next time - Finlandia Trophy was worse than Nepela and thus frustration only grew and eventually grown out of all proportion so a small mistake on 4T at GP crushed him altogether.
What kills me most is not even that 'record' low score of 238 (!) (all the last season he was steady in 270-280 corridor save Finlandia Trophy - really this country IS NOT good for him!) but the fact that it was first time i remember him not redeeming himself in a LP after a bad SP. I was so sure and certain he would get angry with himself and make a comeback and the starting order was the best he could get under circumstances and others made mistakes - all was going his way - but he just looked totally beaten and even Carmen's music didn't help.
I will try to lower my expectations to zero for CoR otherwise I won't be able to watch it at all.

 

[Tutto]

I've already posted this in the men's thread but I just want to say that we ran into Kolyada and Bychenko on the corridor in Helsinki after the SP. Mikhail is sooo tiny in person but skates soooo big. Seeing him live makes such a difference! It's way he moves.....he radiates energy and power is coming from his exquisite upper body all the way through his fingertips. He skates with so much detail as he creates beautiful shapes on the ice.

Many thanks for your live report - we badly need some positive things here right now!

 

[rachno2]

What happen this season I understand now was the worst idea of all (for a perfectionist) to downgrade the tech in order to skate clean. When clean didn't materialise Mika probably started to feel frustrated with himself - how come I skated that SP layout for three seasons now and I still can't get it right? - Panic! I'll sure skate it clean next time - Finlandia Trophy was worse than Nepela and thus frustration only grew and eventually grown out of all proportion so a small mistake on 4T at GP crushed him altogether.
What kills me most is not even that 'record' low score of 238 (!) (all the last season he was steady in 270-280 corridor save Finlandia Trophy - really this country IS NOT good for him!) but the fact that it was first time i remember him not redeeming himself in a LP after a bad SP. I was so sure and certain he would get angry with himself and make a comeback and the starting order was the best he could get under circumstances and others made mistakes - all was going his way - but he just looked totally beaten and even Carmen's music didn't help.
I will try to lower my expectations to zero for CoR otherwise I won't be able to watch it at all.

I thought for sure he would bounce back in the free, too, but the ice was in poor condition, he was sick, and I’m sure that short program brought back some bad memories from Pyeongchang, so it's not like everything was going his way. Hopefully, as with last season, we see his worst skates in Finland!

I still think downgrading the tech to skate clean was and is the right decision, even if it results in these frustrating, demoralizing moments. It is absolutely necessary for the new system. Speaking of which, we need to keep in mind that the record low score he got here is due to the scoring changes: quads have a lower base value + more deductions on GOE if you fall on them + the mandatory PCS deduction for serious errors. Plus, he underrotated the 4S before he fell on it. So it’s normal that his scores would be much lower than last season.

 

[Tutto]

I thought for sure he would bounce back in the free, too, but the ice was in poor condition, he was sick, and I’m sure that short program brought back some bad memories from Pyeongchang, so not everything was going his way. Hopefully, as with last season, we see his worst skates in Finland!

I still think downgrading the tech to skate clean was and is the right decision, even if it results in these frustrating, demoralizing moments. It is absolutely necessary for the new system. Speaking of which, we need to keep in mind that the record low score he got here is due to the scoring changes: quads have a lower base value + more deductions on GOE if you fall on them + the mandatory PCS deduction for serious errors. Plus, he underrotated the 4S before he fell on it. So it’s normal that his scores would be much lower than last season.

Yes, not everything going his way - I shouldn't have said that I just meant it could have been worse, he could have been out of the final group. I too think a one quad SP is a right decision for now but his frustration over not clean skate is not, he shouldn't put such pressure on himself and expect to produce an error free skate every time.
I too wonder how many successful runthroughs he has per week, and I really feel that for a nervous skater it is best to stick to one layout and rely on muscle memory, also making sure that every possible error scenario is covered for.

 

[vorravorra]

PCS deduction is not an explanation because Misha never got PCS over 90 with serious errors last season either, and the new rules also do not require the total score to be under 90, just some components; they certainly do not mandate PCS of 84.

As for the FS, a fall on the 4S was highly likely to begin with and isn't by itself a proof of anything. And I can believe Misha that it affected the next jump after it for physical reasons as well as mental. He should really take out the 4S for now or put it second or something. The jumps after that were not that bad, no pops on the dreaded 3As and 3Lo. By the step sequence he once again looked like he had no energy left to execute it, if it had been purely nerves it would have been the step sequence in the SP that suffered. And whatever it was he referred to as his condition not allowing him to do everything, I don't see him suddenly starting to invent physical reasons to justify bad skates with no record of doing it, and one would provide a longer sob story in such a case anyway. So something was going on with him. As for every eventuality being covered, in this case I didn't see a problem, if he jumped doubles in combos it wasn't due to not practicing a variant with triples.

Misha didn't use to be a nervous skater, never like Stasya who tends to get positively paralysed with fear and it's due to the type of nervous system she has, but she does not obsess over those problems outside the rink, she bounces right back. Misha's nerves are not that bad. I think his problems are deeper, they come from his mind. Someone has suggested that Misha does not need to hear the right words before competitions; with the therapy he's had he probably knows what those words are and can say them to himself, except it's not that simple. What he needs is someone to distract him with talk about everything under the sun that is not competition-related, and not leave him alone with his thoughts because his mind can breed monsters. He has admitted himself that he does better when he thinks less.

 

[Tutto]

PCS deduction is not an explanation because Misha never got PCS over 90 with serious errors last season either, and the new rules also do not require the total score to be under 90, just some components; they certainly do not mandate PCS of 84.

As for the FS, a fall on the 4S was highly likely to begin with and isn't by itself a proof of anything. And I can believe Misha that it affected the next jump after it for physical reasons as well as mental. He should really take out the 4S for now or put it second or something. The jumps after that were not that bad, no pops on the dreaded 3As and 3Lo. By the step sequence he once again looked like he had no energy left to execute it, if it had been purely nerves it would have been the step sequence in the SP that suffered. And whatever it was he referred to as his condition not allowing him to do everything, I don't see him suddenly starting to invent physical reasons to justify bad skates with no record of doing it, and one would provide a longer sob story in such a case anyway. So something was going on with him. As for every eventuality being covered, in this case I didn't see a problem, if he jumped doubles in combos it wasn't due to not practicing a variant with triples.

Misha didn't use to be a nervous skater, never like Stasya who tends to get positively paralysed with fear and it's due to the type of nervous system she has, but she does not obsess over those problems outside the rink, she bounces right back. Misha's nerves are not that bad. I think his problems are deeper, they come from his mind. Someone has suggested that Misha does not need to hear the right words before competitions; with the therapy he's had he probably knows what those words are and can say them to himself, except it's not that simple. What he needs is someone to distract him with talk about everything under the sun that is not competition-related, and not leave him alone with his thoughts because his mind can breed monsters. He has admitted himself that he does better when he thinks less.

I hope in this case that there is no injury they'd decided to conceal for some reasons.
4S they should have taken out of LP after the morning practice where he had difficulties with it -and that I really do not understand why they didn't