My Take on SA
- Thread starter MasterF
- Start date
- Joined
- Aug 4, 2003
Thanks! And any extra details on Belbin/Agosto would be greatly appreciated.
The Report is IN!
LADIES SHORT ( Men's will follow after I take a break)
First let me say that the this town is very difficult to get to. It's about a 45 minute drive from the nearest highway ( not Fun).
Here they are in order of appearance:
Yukari - skated to a nice soft piano piece with a white/blue dress. she landed 3axel-2toe(slight jerk), turn 3flip into 2flip, okay 2axel. Missed an opportunity to make a case for herself. I don't think she will ever be a top contender.
Currie - hand down on 3 flip, fall 3lutz, hand down on 2 axel, music was to Ravel's bolero had on a red ress. she looked very out of focus and weak
Costner - the italian hopeful was wearing a sort of gree/blue sress, skating to secret garden, had good speed, fell on the lutz, landed a good 3 loop and 2 axel. spins were okay.
Lautowa - this girls has seen better days, her prime was around 96, 97. she splatted on the Lutz, 2 flip, good 2 axel, had good footwork and skated to fever in a black dress
Bellemare - this girl could actually be a top contender if she can get a handle on the nerves. she landed a gorgeous 3 luts combo, touched down on the 3 flip and had a good 2 aexl. skated to some very boring mid-east music that at one point sounded like elvator music. She has power but lack the excitement she is capable of. wored a black dress with a pink skirt.
Vicotira - looked regal in a gold sequenced dress. she landed a wopping combo 3 lutx 2 toe, fell on the flip and had a wobble out of the 2 axel. skated to romeo and juliet "a time for us"
Arakawa - one of my favorite, she just seems to float on the ice. had great speed, skated to the Umbrellas of something, landed a good combo, step out the flip, she just doesn't reach back far enough to do it right, anyway she landed a nice 2axel had a much improve layback,if you could recall how bad it was last year. the program was skated beautiful with morozov moves in it.
Poykio - the girl with the corn rolls, had good power her body is a little stocky, landed the combo but ran into the wall, 2 flip and a good 2 axel. skated to henry 8th by saint saent, wore a red and pink dress
Maniachenko - landed a solid combo, 2 flip and okay 2 axel. skated to elton john's funeral with a hideous white wedding dress, she too will never be a top contender due to nerves.
Kirk - okay! are you ready for something awesome? she landed everything with much improve speed and power. she skated to chicago and tore the house down. her footwork was cute and clever in a serpentine pattern a departure from all the straight line footwork these days. she wore a silver style dress a la vegas style showgirl. however keep in mind she is not the favorite to win even if she skates clean ( which she needs to if she ever wants to make the world team)
Corwin - wore a black dress that looks like the one Hepburn wore for the Tiffany movie. she skated to moon river, the program was constructed well. she landed the 3-3toe combo but fell on the cheated Lutz, 2 axel was a little shaky.
Cohen - same program as last year, but footwork was change, still looks good. combo was very weak, flip was solid, 2 axel was good spins were awesome. She won!
The one thing I did not understand was the scoring. If all the girls were doing the same elements (minus a few) why were they given a different base value? Sasha had a higher starting value than all the other girls who were trying the exact same elements.
l
LADIES SHORT ( Men's will follow after I take a break)
First let me say that the this town is very difficult to get to. It's about a 45 minute drive from the nearest highway ( not Fun).
Here they are in order of appearance:
Yukari - skated to a nice soft piano piece with a white/blue dress. she landed 3axel-2toe(slight jerk), turn 3flip into 2flip, okay 2axel. Missed an opportunity to make a case for herself. I don't think she will ever be a top contender.
Currie - hand down on 3 flip, fall 3lutz, hand down on 2 axel, music was to Ravel's bolero had on a red ress. she looked very out of focus and weak
Costner - the italian hopeful was wearing a sort of gree/blue sress, skating to secret garden, had good speed, fell on the lutz, landed a good 3 loop and 2 axel. spins were okay.
Lautowa - this girls has seen better days, her prime was around 96, 97. she splatted on the Lutz, 2 flip, good 2 axel, had good footwork and skated to fever in a black dress
Bellemare - this girl could actually be a top contender if she can get a handle on the nerves. she landed a gorgeous 3 luts combo, touched down on the 3 flip and had a good 2 aexl. skated to some very boring mid-east music that at one point sounded like elvator music. She has power but lack the excitement she is capable of. wored a black dress with a pink skirt.
Vicotira - looked regal in a gold sequenced dress. she landed a wopping combo 3 lutx 2 toe, fell on the flip and had a wobble out of the 2 axel. skated to romeo and juliet "a time for us"
Arakawa - one of my favorite, she just seems to float on the ice. had great speed, skated to the Umbrellas of something, landed a good combo, step out the flip, she just doesn't reach back far enough to do it right, anyway she landed a nice 2axel had a much improve layback,if you could recall how bad it was last year. the program was skated beautiful with morozov moves in it.
Poykio - the girl with the corn rolls, had good power her body is a little stocky, landed the combo but ran into the wall, 2 flip and a good 2 axel. skated to henry 8th by saint saent, wore a red and pink dress
Maniachenko - landed a solid combo, 2 flip and okay 2 axel. skated to elton john's funeral with a hideous white wedding dress, she too will never be a top contender due to nerves.
Kirk - okay! are you ready for something awesome? she landed everything with much improve speed and power. she skated to chicago and tore the house down. her footwork was cute and clever in a serpentine pattern a departure from all the straight line footwork these days. she wore a silver style dress a la vegas style showgirl. however keep in mind she is not the favorite to win even if she skates clean ( which she needs to if she ever wants to make the world team)
Corwin - wore a black dress that looks like the one Hepburn wore for the Tiffany movie. she skated to moon river, the program was constructed well. she landed the 3-3toe combo but fell on the cheated Lutz, 2 axel was a little shaky.
Cohen - same program as last year, but footwork was change, still looks good. combo was very weak, flip was solid, 2 axel was good spins were awesome. She won!
The one thing I did not understand was the scoring. If all the girls were doing the same elements (minus a few) why were they given a different base value? Sasha had a higher starting value than all the other girls who were trying the exact same elements.
l
The Report is In!
I am in a rush so please excuse my spelling erros.
MEN
SCOTT - looked a lot better than Campbell's, landed the following clean 3A-2t, 3t-3t, 4s s.o(stepped out), 3ltz, 3lp, 3A s.o, 2fp, 3s. He can become a top U.S. man but he does not project a lot of power. He needs to work on his hands they are a little to soft for me.
RYAN - Nightmare city, poor guy fell on every single jump.
STANISLAV - boring program to "NIght of Bold Mount." landed the 3A-3T, 3T, 3A-fall, 3Ltz, 3f, 3lp s.o, 3s. a rather very skinny guy.
DAVYDOV - very good presentation and power, skated to Yanni. landed 3a-3t s.o., 3ltz-2t s.o., 2f, 3s, 3t, 3lp s.o, 2a
IVAN - one of my favorite skated a strong program to music by BOND "Kismet". landed only 4 clean triples. He use to have lots of potential but the last few years he has fallen off the map.
STEFAN - a very strong little guy, landed 5 triples
MING - this guy flies and has spring in his needs. landed the first clean 4 of the night. tried a second but was unable to completed you will see him on tv.
Honda and Weiss will also be shown on tv so I won't comment on them. They did however skate better that Campbell's
TRIFUN - can anyone remember him from a few years back. He skated okay not as out of shape as i thought he would be in. skated to the Matrx. If they don't show him on abc i will give a full detail of his program later.
I am in a rush so please excuse my spelling erros.
MEN
SCOTT - looked a lot better than Campbell's, landed the following clean 3A-2t, 3t-3t, 4s s.o(stepped out), 3ltz, 3lp, 3A s.o, 2fp, 3s. He can become a top U.S. man but he does not project a lot of power. He needs to work on his hands they are a little to soft for me.
RYAN - Nightmare city, poor guy fell on every single jump.
STANISLAV - boring program to "NIght of Bold Mount." landed the 3A-3T, 3T, 3A-fall, 3Ltz, 3f, 3lp s.o, 3s. a rather very skinny guy.
DAVYDOV - very good presentation and power, skated to Yanni. landed 3a-3t s.o., 3ltz-2t s.o., 2f, 3s, 3t, 3lp s.o, 2a
IVAN - one of my favorite skated a strong program to music by BOND "Kismet". landed only 4 clean triples. He use to have lots of potential but the last few years he has fallen off the map.
STEFAN - a very strong little guy, landed 5 triples
MING - this guy flies and has spring in his needs. landed the first clean 4 of the night. tried a second but was unable to completed you will see him on tv.
Honda and Weiss will also be shown on tv so I won't comment on them. They did however skate better that Campbell's
TRIFUN - can anyone remember him from a few years back. He skated okay not as out of shape as i thought he would be in. skated to the Matrx. If they don't show him on abc i will give a full detail of his program later.
Re: The Report is IN!
The base scores for some of the elements are the same (like the jumps), but the difference probably came with the "level" assigned ot the spins/footwork/spirals. E.g. a skater doing a layback at level 3 will have a higher base value than a skater doing a layback at level 1. Although I don't know if they decide the levels before the competition or during the performance.
MasterF said:
The base scores for some of the elements are the same (like the jumps), but the difference probably came with the "level" assigned ot the spins/footwork/spirals. E.g. a skater doing a layback at level 3 will have a higher base value than a skater doing a layback at level 1. Although I don't know if they decide the levels before the competition or during the performance.
Ladies Free
BOTTOM SIX
Yukari was the only lady to almost skate a clean program. She tried her triple axel again, but was a little short on rotation. She is the queen of rapping and the judges are killing her on the scores. Poykio skated the next best program but was placed ahead of Yukari. She almost crashed into the boards on her lutz combo. Costner the favorite of this group had a complete melt down the same as RYAN in the men. She only landed two double axels at the end of the program, and by then she looked a little lost. The other three ladies program were so bad that if they had competed at NOrth Atlantics( a U.S. regional competition) earlier in the week they would have lost.
TOP SIX
Both Victoria and Galina were competing for the worst program with Costner. You might see them on ABC, if you don't don't worry about it. Sasha came out next and tore the house down with her usual brilliance. She only two footed a triple flip that could barely be seen from where I was sitting. The audience gave her a standing ovation. I felt bad for Kirk who had to follow that program. She fell really bad during warm up and I thought she was going to bomb as well. However she too tore the house down with a whopping 7 triple jump program including a triple triple toe that was clean as a whistle. I said it first, she needed to skate perfect in order to get notice by those judges. AMber did a very nice job she only fell on her flip and cheated her lutz otherwise it was a clean program. Arakawa revived her old program from two years ago. She skated very strong and had two minor mistakes i think. She finished 3rd. You guys will see it on tv
ONe last note, KIRK needs to improve those spins they are even slower than Kwan's. But Kwan is the queen so she can do as she pleases.
ONe more note - the U.S. pair team skated really well, even if they were using last years program.
BOTTOM SIX
Yukari was the only lady to almost skate a clean program. She tried her triple axel again, but was a little short on rotation. She is the queen of rapping and the judges are killing her on the scores. Poykio skated the next best program but was placed ahead of Yukari. She almost crashed into the boards on her lutz combo. Costner the favorite of this group had a complete melt down the same as RYAN in the men. She only landed two double axels at the end of the program, and by then she looked a little lost. The other three ladies program were so bad that if they had competed at NOrth Atlantics( a U.S. regional competition) earlier in the week they would have lost.
TOP SIX
Both Victoria and Galina were competing for the worst program with Costner. You might see them on ABC, if you don't don't worry about it. Sasha came out next and tore the house down with her usual brilliance. She only two footed a triple flip that could barely be seen from where I was sitting. The audience gave her a standing ovation. I felt bad for Kirk who had to follow that program. She fell really bad during warm up and I thought she was going to bomb as well. However she too tore the house down with a whopping 7 triple jump program including a triple triple toe that was clean as a whistle. I said it first, she needed to skate perfect in order to get notice by those judges. AMber did a very nice job she only fell on her flip and cheated her lutz otherwise it was a clean program. Arakawa revived her old program from two years ago. She skated very strong and had two minor mistakes i think. She finished 3rd. You guys will see it on tv
ONe last note, KIRK needs to improve those spins they are even slower than Kwan's. But Kwan is the queen so she can do as she pleases.
ONe more note - the U.S. pair team skated really well, even if they were using last years program.
Thanks Master F for the live play by play. So glad to hear Jenny nailed all her jumps including that 3/3. When I saw her at Campbell's I was afraid she might never get her jumps consistent enough to where she'd be competitive and that she should change to pairs ASAP. But now... Well, I guess it must be because she's Mathman's favorite this year--aside from La Kwan
And a note to everyone re tomorrow's TV broadcast: DAYLIGHT SAVINGS TIME. Don't forget to account for the change
Rgirl
And a note to everyone re tomorrow's TV broadcast: DAYLIGHT SAVINGS TIME. Don't forget to account for the change
Rgirl
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
Pairs final
One COP-Pang and Tong won the SP and Petrova Tikhonov won the LP, but Pang/Tong won overall. And in this case, believe it or not, since I am not a fan, I would have given it to Petrova Tikhonov. They are skating to Circus Princess, and even though stone dead pan, she is quite believable as a circus performer with him being the apparatus. They got a partial standing O, and really in general a good response from the audience. for the LP, Petrova and Tikhonov were the ticket. The lifts great and there was an odd move where she grabs her ankles around his leg while he is doing an arabesque with the other leg. She had a problem with the 2nd throw jump; otherwise clean.
Tong fell on his 2A and also the 2T of their jump sequence that starts with 3T. Also there were problems with a death spiral Their SBS spins were pretty good for Chinese pair. They were very lovely and interact and emote beautifully to Variations on Paganini (September Morn again),
Zhang/Zhang have the hugest triple twist I have ever seen. Such height and a delay. Not much emotion or choreo though.
Wakamatsu/Fecteau Rach #2 didn't keep up the level of excitement they had in the short. They had problem with their 2nd jump sequence, splatted a throw, but they did that one hand rotating lift with her in a split and her head on her knee, and its still amazing and ended up with Mishketunok's spin (not surprising with that flexibility.
Scott and Dulebohn skated very well to Les Mis - had a 3T2t sbs combination, that I think is new, and I think there are some other changes to the choreo that made this program better. A little problem with the 3twist (thunk on his chest) and she fell on the 2A but much much better than last year. Different costumes-black this year. He has an odd vest/white shirt/black pants. She has a black dress with white piping on the neck and a red rag at the neck..
On the other pairs, Pla Bonheur skated to Tarzan, he is black, so it is an odd choice for them. She had a piece of inch thick fur on one breast and he had a similar square on one shoulder. She also had about 6 hanging green strings over leopard skin for a skirt. Weird costume award for the night. Putnam and Wirtz another variations/paganini but they looked very washed out.
Landed their SBS 3toes had a scary 3twist. They need to put more enthusiasm into this one. Orser and Lucash still need to work on lifts. He needs more arm strength or something. His elbow doesn't lock out the way it should and it looks like its going to collapse any time. He screwed up both 3T and 2A. They were trying to skate to Spartacus. Spielburg Joeright splatted a lot to Romeo and Juliet.
One COP-Pang and Tong won the SP and Petrova Tikhonov won the LP, but Pang/Tong won overall. And in this case, believe it or not, since I am not a fan, I would have given it to Petrova Tikhonov. They are skating to Circus Princess, and even though stone dead pan, she is quite believable as a circus performer with him being the apparatus. They got a partial standing O, and really in general a good response from the audience. for the LP, Petrova and Tikhonov were the ticket. The lifts great and there was an odd move where she grabs her ankles around his leg while he is doing an arabesque with the other leg. She had a problem with the 2nd throw jump; otherwise clean.
Tong fell on his 2A and also the 2T of their jump sequence that starts with 3T. Also there were problems with a death spiral Their SBS spins were pretty good for Chinese pair. They were very lovely and interact and emote beautifully to Variations on Paganini (September Morn again),
Zhang/Zhang have the hugest triple twist I have ever seen. Such height and a delay. Not much emotion or choreo though.
Wakamatsu/Fecteau Rach #2 didn't keep up the level of excitement they had in the short. They had problem with their 2nd jump sequence, splatted a throw, but they did that one hand rotating lift with her in a split and her head on her knee, and its still amazing and ended up with Mishketunok's spin (not surprising with that flexibility.
Scott and Dulebohn skated very well to Les Mis - had a 3T2t sbs combination, that I think is new, and I think there are some other changes to the choreo that made this program better. A little problem with the 3twist (thunk on his chest) and she fell on the 2A but much much better than last year. Different costumes-black this year. He has an odd vest/white shirt/black pants. She has a black dress with white piping on the neck and a red rag at the neck..
On the other pairs, Pla Bonheur skated to Tarzan, he is black, so it is an odd choice for them. She had a piece of inch thick fur on one breast and he had a similar square on one shoulder. She also had about 6 hanging green strings over leopard skin for a skirt. Weird costume award for the night. Putnam and Wirtz another variations/paganini but they looked very washed out.
Landed their SBS 3toes had a scary 3twist. They need to put more enthusiasm into this one. Orser and Lucash still need to work on lifts. He needs more arm strength or something. His elbow doesn't lock out the way it should and it looks like its going to collapse any time. He screwed up both 3T and 2A. They were trying to skate to Spartacus. Spielburg Joeright splatted a lot to Romeo and Juliet.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
Thanks for the reports, MasterP and Doris P. Especially the opinions on the skaters that we will not be able to see onTV.
Go Jenny! I really look forward to seeing this performance.
Thanks for the heads up on daylight savings time, Rgirl. For you baseball fans you can remember this because the daylight savings period coincides exactly with the baseball season if the World Series Goes seven games. (Unless there is a special single game "season opener" the day before the real season begins.)
I think I like that feature of the CoP that allows someone to win overall on the basis of accumulated points.
Mathman
PS. And except for one year, the last time the Marlins won the World Series, I believe, the game went into extra innings and didn't finish until after midnight, so it was the next day.
Uh, never mind.
Go Jenny! I really look forward to seeing this performance.
Thanks for the heads up on daylight savings time, Rgirl. For you baseball fans you can remember this because the daylight savings period coincides exactly with the baseball season if the World Series Goes seven games. (Unless there is a special single game "season opener" the day before the real season begins.)
I think I like that feature of the CoP that allows someone to win overall on the basis of accumulated points.
Mathman
PS. And except for one year, the last time the Marlins won the World Series, I believe, the game went into extra innings and didn't finish until after midnight, so it was the next day.
Uh, never mind.
Last edited:
Just checked the results at:
http://www.isufs.org/results/sa2003/index.htm
and considering both the SP and LP, Pg/Tg won over Pet/Tik by just 0.16 of a point. In the SP and LP, Pg/Tg received a TSS of 67.08 and 117.96, relatively speaking, for a total of 185.04. Pet/Tik received a TSS of 64.94 SP and 119.98 LP for a total of 184.92.
This result makes me like the COP because no one judge could have knowingly changed the outcome by adding or deducting points because no judge can know, as best we know
, whether his/her score is going to be one of the scores thrown out. I still don't like the anonymity of the judges, but seeing the results for each judge gives me confidence in the COP, at least more than I had in the 6.0 system.
I'll be interested to see what people like Doris and Master F think when they have a chance to look at the Detailed Results for the COP. It looks to me as if Pg/Tg basically won it in the SP, though this looks to be about as close to a tie as you can get.
Rgirl
http://www.isufs.org/results/sa2003/index.htm
and considering both the SP and LP, Pg/Tg won over Pet/Tik by just 0.16 of a point. In the SP and LP, Pg/Tg received a TSS of 67.08 and 117.96, relatively speaking, for a total of 185.04. Pet/Tik received a TSS of 64.94 SP and 119.98 LP for a total of 184.92.
This result makes me like the COP because no one judge could have knowingly changed the outcome by adding or deducting points because no judge can know, as best we know
, whether his/her score is going to be one of the scores thrown out. I still don't like the anonymity of the judges, but seeing the results for each judge gives me confidence in the COP, at least more than I had in the 6.0 system.I'll be interested to see what people like Doris and Master F think when they have a chance to look at the Detailed Results for the COP. It looks to me as if Pg/Tg basically won it in the SP, though this looks to be about as close to a tie as you can get.
Rgirl
Just thought I would say a few things. I had front row seats ... just about center ice ... and I can't tell you how much I enjoyed this competition. Partly because Michelle wasn't there and I could relax and really get to pay attention to the other skaters. But also because sitting so close, you have all this wonderful interaction with the skaters ... it was just so amazing.
Jenny Kirk to me was the top highlight. Sasha was wonderful and deserved the win, but Jenny just stole the hearts of everyone there. With every jump her smile got bigger, and by the end she was just flying. People were standing a good 30 seconds before she finished. It was such a remarkable moment ... she took the moment and seized it, as they say.
I was also very impressed with Shizuka and Suzanna P. Both ladies have a remarkable elegance on the ice ... not to mention gorgeous jumps! Shizuka had a fantastic practice Saturday morning ... too bad she had a few mistakes in her LP. I think both of these ladies will play a major part in future events.
On the other side, I was really sorry to see Carolina Kostner struggle so much. She had 2 hideous practices ... didn't land anything ... fell so many times that I was hurting just watching her. Her programs were just as bad. She just doesn't look like the same person I watched last season. Hope she can pull it together because she has a very endearing demeanor.
The men's event was just okay ... Takeshi struggled in the short. Michael deserved the win, but I can't say I was overly moved by his performance.
I agree with whoever said the Russians were actually very good. I like their LP and they skated very well. Pang and Tong were a bit off on their LP, but their short was magnificent.
The biggest thing for me is that for the first time ... I really, really enjoyed the ice dance. Sitting so close you get an amazing view of what they do ... and they play to the crowd more than the other disciplines. We were cheering so loud for the US team of Melissa and Dennis ... that when they finished their LP they skated over to us to thank us and gives us hugs and kisses. It was such a nice feeling to know that they appreciated our support.
I actually felt that way about all the skaters. They all seemed genuinely pleased for the cheers and applause.
All in all ... a wonderful 3 days. And ... I am starting to think that this COP might just work after all ... it certainly allows for skaters to falter a bit in the SP and still have a chance to win it. I guess only time will tell.
Jenny Kirk to me was the top highlight. Sasha was wonderful and deserved the win, but Jenny just stole the hearts of everyone there. With every jump her smile got bigger, and by the end she was just flying. People were standing a good 30 seconds before she finished. It was such a remarkable moment ... she took the moment and seized it, as they say.
I was also very impressed with Shizuka and Suzanna P. Both ladies have a remarkable elegance on the ice ... not to mention gorgeous jumps! Shizuka had a fantastic practice Saturday morning ... too bad she had a few mistakes in her LP. I think both of these ladies will play a major part in future events.
On the other side, I was really sorry to see Carolina Kostner struggle so much. She had 2 hideous practices ... didn't land anything ... fell so many times that I was hurting just watching her. Her programs were just as bad. She just doesn't look like the same person I watched last season. Hope she can pull it together because she has a very endearing demeanor.
The men's event was just okay ... Takeshi struggled in the short. Michael deserved the win, but I can't say I was overly moved by his performance.
I agree with whoever said the Russians were actually very good. I like their LP and they skated very well. Pang and Tong were a bit off on their LP, but their short was magnificent.
The biggest thing for me is that for the first time ... I really, really enjoyed the ice dance. Sitting so close you get an amazing view of what they do ... and they play to the crowd more than the other disciplines. We were cheering so loud for the US team of Melissa and Dennis ... that when they finished their LP they skated over to us to thank us and gives us hugs and kisses. It was such a nice feeling to know that they appreciated our support.
I actually felt that way about all the skaters. They all seemed genuinely pleased for the cheers and applause.
All in all ... a wonderful 3 days. And ... I am starting to think that this COP might just work after all ... it certainly allows for skaters to falter a bit in the SP and still have a chance to win it. I guess only time will tell.
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