Plushenko threatened with legal action

[Mathman]

I guess so. But I still remember how the ISU jumped through hoops, in violation of its own rules, in Salt Lake City in order to pacify the IOC and its financial supporters.

To me, the bottom line is, why would the ISU or anyone else want to throw an Olympic party and not invite the top skaters? Who could possibly benefit from that?

ITA that all of the skaters involved (not 100% sure about Arakawa) have done everything they possible could to pacify the ISU on this issue. Plushenko withdrew from his scheduled event in Prague even though he might get sued for doing so. So I don't see that the ISU has any beef.

JMO.

Mathman

 

[RIskatingfan]

To me, the bottom line is, why would the ISU or anyone else want to throw an Olympic party and not invite the top skaters? Who could possibly benefit from that?

One thing I'm sure of, Plushenko and Kwan want to be there. And the ISU knows that and the skaters know that the ISU knows it LOL They're not going to ban anyone and the reason is that nobody will go against them because a few more $$$ at shows. Look at how Plushenko didn't dare to skate in the show.

The Olympics don't need the major stars either. The Olympics create the stars. The Olympics don't care about Plushenko or Kwan, only those who are there and win the medals count. The casual fan only watches skating every 4 years, they don't care if there was a skater who was not allowed to do a show in Prague once in the past. But the skaters do care about the Olympics and will not let a show in Prague stop them for participating.

 

[Mathman]

RISkatingFan, all that is obvious. So why has the ISU got its knickers in a twist? The skaters are all co-operating, being nice, doing everything the ISU wants -- what is Speedy so apoplectic about?

MM

 

[soogar]

Well in terms of the top skaters, I remember when Brian Boitano was pressing the ISU to compete in the 1992 Olympics and they turned him down even though his popularity was at its zenith and he was regarded by the US as the best skater. Even after granting the pros provisional status the ISU gave them the opportunity to get with their program to compete in ISU events or to go back to being professionals.


The ISU didn't start the GP series to have "professional" athletes compete in their series. The ISU changed the rules so athletes could have longer careers. Obviously Plush and MK benefitted tremendously from these rules. Under the old regime, a new star popped up every four years (and it's still this way despite MK hanging around for all these years). I don't see how the ISU would be so hurt from MK's and Plush's retirements.

Mathman: I think the ISU is getting into a twist b/c the USFS is trying to usurp its power.

 

[RIskatingfan]

RISkatingFan, all that is obvious. So why has the ISU got its knickers in a twist? The skaters are all co-operating, being nice, doing everything the ISU wants -- what is Speedy so apoplectic about?

MM

I'm not sure I understand you. You have top skaters giving excuses not to participate in ISU events to go skate somewhere else, clearly showing lack of interest in the sport, and you think the governing body wouldn't have reasons to be worried about the status of the sport?

The Olympics are a whole different story and that's not really the problem. The problem is what happens in between those 4 years. Or one day you're going to end up like gymnastics whose World championships structures change every year (one year you have only all-around finals, the next year you have individual finals, then the next year there are only all-around events again...). I don't want figure skating to be considered a "joke" sport where athletes only need to compete twice a year. That's not a sport, that's one or two extra events for skaters who spend their season doing shows. If you want to do shows, go pro.

 

[Mathman]

Soogar, you're looking at it upside down. What would the ISU lose by allowing Plushenko to skate in Prague if he wants to? It's a win-win situation. Some skating fans in the Czeck Republic get to see their fave do an exhibition. This will not cause Cinquanta's empire to come crashing down.

If Plushenko and Kwan retire, OK. If they don't, OK.

To me, the performers are more important to a sport than is the administrative apparatus. Others disagree, I guess.

Mathman

PS. OK, I'm signing off now. The NHK coverage is about to start. I can't wait to see the ISU officials out there doing their thing!!!

 

[soogar]

It's not a win-win situation if Plush skates in an exhibition that does not give funding to the ISU rather than his assigned GP event. I love Plush but what he did was just not right.

 

[RIskatingfan]

It's not a question of thinking the administrative apparatus is more important than the skaters or the performances. I'm here because I like to watch those skaters and performances not because I want to study organizations. (I can read about UN, OTAN, EU, etc everyday and I already had plenty of classes about them ) But when we have in the mix countless national federations, countless athletes from different countries, organization of events, marketing and publicity, TV contracts, fans all over the world who want to watch skating, money needed to everything and everyone... if you don't have a strong administrative apparatus it will all implode. For starts, this message board would probably not exist and you wouldn't even be signing off to go watch NHK because there would be no NHK on TV

I think it's very nice and pretty and beautiful to say that skaters and performances are the most important and officials are just annoying corrupt people who don't do anything right. But the truth is that when we deal with sports and international competitions (or even national...) we need "administrative apparatus" and it's a very important part of the sport. That's the reality of the thing.

 

[Mathman]

Soogar, I guess I just can't see that there is anything so terrible about the idea of Plushenko doing something that "does not give funding to the ISU." There are lots of things that don't give funding to the ISU. These things are not necessarily evil.

But oh, well. Plushy says he's sorry and he won't do it any more, LOL.

RISkatingFan, OK, I am taking a quick break now that the ladies competition is over, LOL. I think I didn't quite understand your position before. Now I think that what we disagree on is this. I do not believe that the Grand Prix is the only possible way for the sport of figure skating to grow and prosper. I do like pretty phrases, LOL -- "Let a thousand flowers bloom." I think the way to advance the sport is to have lots of different things going on -- even an exhibition in Prague.

Yes, I am enjoying the NHK show (pairs are on now). But I enjoyed the Campbell's competition, too. I just don't fully buy into the idea that what's best for figure skating and what's best for the ISU are necessarily one and the same thing. Must be the anarchist in me.

BTW, and a little bit OT, Terry Gannon just said on TV that Shizuka's blade broke five days before the NHK and that she was struggling to skate on an old boot from last season. So this made me think that her reason for passing up the Eric Lompard event because of breaking in new boots is probably legitimate.

Anyway, you can't make me mad tonight, LOL. Too much pretty skating going on.

MM

 

[Mathman]

PS. There are two threads going on right now about things that Michelle and Sasha are doing to promote figure skating and raise its profile. These activities may not put any money into the bank account of the ISU directly, but a rising tide floats all boats. :yes:

MM

 

[Vash01]

It's not a win-win situation if Plush skates in an exhibition that does not give funding to the ISU rather than his assigned GP event. I love Plush but what he did was just not right.

The ISU gets its funding from the TV contracts, whether or not Plushenko is in it. The attendance at GP series has never been great, compared to worlds or Olympics. Just because skaters are INVITED to a certain event does not mean they must accept the invitation. Is there an ISU ruling that says a skater must accept an invitation unless he/she is in a hospital bed (rhetorically speaking)?
I believe skaters should have a choice- to skate in ISU events (GP) or other events. It is like any job offer.

I do believe this GP format is taking its toll on the skaters. The constant preparation for eligible competitions, starting in Oct. through the worlds in March makes it a very long season. We are starting to see what happens if a skater does not pace himself/herself. A GPF championship is not worth anything when you compare it with a world championship or the ultimate prize - the OGM. Yet a lot of energy has to be put into it. To some skaters the benefit is not worth the cost. The younger/new skaters benefit from being in the GP series. For those with some mileage it could be the opposite. Skating in shows and cheesefest, however, keeps them tuned without the enormous pressure of eligible competitions. If that formula works for a certain skater, so be it. IMO Cinquanta is taking the absence of top skaters a bit personally. All he needs to do it manage the competitions with whoever shows up. There is no need for any threats. It only creates bitterness.

Vash

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I do believe this GP format is taking its toll on the skaters. The constant preparation for eligible competitions, starting in Oct. through the worlds in March makes it a very long season. We are starting to see what happens if a skater does not pace himself/herself. A GPF championship is not worth anything when you compare it with a world championship or the ultimate prize - the OGM. Yet a lot of energy has to be put into it. To some skaters the benefit is not worth the cost. The younger/new skaters benefit from being in the GP series. For those with some mileage it could be the opposite. Skating in shows and cheesefest, however, keeps them tuned without the enormous pressure of eligible competitions. If that formula works for a certain skater, so be it. IMO Cinquanta is taking the absence of top skaters a bit personally. All he needs to do it manage the competitions with whoever shows up. There is no need for any threats. It only creates bitternessVash

Well said Vash. I would just like to reiterate my suggestion that the whole scope of the Grand Prix should be reviewed with the purpose of making it feasible for skaters, profitable for the host country and the ISU, and publicized heavily to bring in more fans. Tennis was not a must watch sport back in the 60s and 70s, Tennis had its die hard fans back then but not much more. They picked up casual fans in the 70s with better marketing.

Joe

 

[euterpe]

I think one of the big problems for the skaters is the long distance travel. It's a long haul from NA to Asia, and from Asia to NA, and that goes for skaters from both continents. NA to Europe, Europe to NA and Europe to Asia and vice-versa is also no picnic.

This season, having both NHK and CoC in mid-schedule was actually an improvement, since non-Asian skaters doing both were spared horrendous jet lag. As I understand it, next season the schedule goes back to the way it was before, with CoC mid-schedule and NHK at the end of the series, with LeBomp and CoR in between.

The big problem with the current GP setup is that the skaters have absolutely no say as to which events they are scheduled for. Canadian or US skaters told their events are CoC and LeBomp face losing weeks of training time due to travel and resultant jet lag. If the ISU enforces its threats, skaters will have to do the events, no matter how stressful, or be declared ineligible.

If the eligibility ban is in effect, host federations could collude and manipulate the invitations/schedules to ensure certain top skaters get the worst possible combination of events while their own skaters get plum assignments.

 

[Vash01]

I think the top 5 skaters get to choose which GP events they want to skate in, but I am not sure. I see that some skaters are 'invited' while others are not, which means their feds have to assign the GP's to them. It is inconceivable to me that skaters would have no say at all in what competitions they would be in, but may be in Speedy's regime such slavery is possible.

Vash

 

[Arsenette]

Um, athletes DON'T have the RIGHT to compete in Worlds and the Olympics. Eligibility for these events are determined by the SPORT'S governing body. This is according the Olympic committee rules.

Actually you are partially wrong. The skaters that are determined by the NATIONAL Federations in compliance with ISU rules but the ISU does NOT determine the skaters for each of those events. Translation if the Skater A managed to meet NGB rules and place in whatever events they had to, meet age requirements and didn't break any NGB rules they have the RIGHT to compete in Worlds and Olympics. Perfect example was Tonya Harding. The ONLY rule that would have prevented her from going was a bylaw in both USFSA and USOC where she would "tarnish the image" of the said organizations and since she was not found guilty at the time of the Olympics NO ONE could keep her out. She won Nationals meeting USA standards (both USFSA and USOC) and they HAD to let her go to Lillehammer. ISU had nothing to do who was sent there since the ISU does NOT interfere with NGB selection. It's part of the charter all countries voted for eons ago and still uphold today.

Someone mentioned in either this thread or another that the ISU's beef is with the NGB specifically the host countries of the GP (USA, Canada, China, Japan, Russia and France). The ISU's contention is that the Host countries (specifically NGB's hosting event and ultimately the ones that INVITE the skaters) are doing nothing to "force" the skaters to comply with the "seeded" status. There is NOTHING in the rules that force "seeded" skaters to enter the GP. The only rule that exists is the one that if you qualify for GPF you MUST enter event or be faced with a fine. That's it.. no "no worlds for you" or "no olympics for you". The ISU and the IOC do NOT chose the athletes for these events.. the NGB's do.