where were Lambiel, Buttle......
I can tell you where jeff Buttle was, winning the bronze medal at the 2006 Olympics.
I can tell you where jeff Buttle was, winning the bronze medal at the 2006 Olympics.
Plushenko will honour us with his presence in 2010!
- Thread starter skatingbc
- Start date
- Joined
- Jun 27, 2003
Originally Posted by Mathman
You're a hard man to please, Joe.
In the years 1998-2002 Yagudin won four world championships, three Europeans, three Grand Prix Finals and twelve individual Grand Prix events. His perfomance at the Olympics was outstanding, but he had many other outstnding performances during that span.
:Again, I think we need to evaluate Plushenko's entire body of work, not just make a judgment about one performance
I will have to agree with Mathman here, Joe. Yagudin had other exquisite wins in career beside the SLC 2002 Olympics.
For me, his "Lawrence of Arabia" program which won his second world title means even more, because it was following a fresh injury he was struggling with all week long.
Just watch this program, which gives me chills even now after 10 years and tell me if you can find any bobbles:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JreQby8Kbug
Joseph
You're a hard man to please, Joe.
In the years 1998-2002 Yagudin won four world championships, three Europeans, three Grand Prix Finals and twelve individual Grand Prix events. His perfomance at the Olympics was outstanding, but he had many other outstnding performances during that span.
:Again, I think we need to evaluate Plushenko's entire body of work, not just make a judgment about one performance
I will have to agree with Mathman here, Joe. Yagudin had other exquisite wins in career beside the SLC 2002 Olympics.
For me, his "Lawrence of Arabia" program which won his second world title means even more, because it was following a fresh injury he was struggling with all week long.
Just watch this program, which gives me chills even now after 10 years and tell me if you can find any bobbles:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JreQby8Kbug
Joseph
Aaaa Yagudin! I like him too 
I miss Yagudin/Plushenko era. It's too vivid in my memory... :yes:
I think that Yag in 2002 was happy guy. He was won, and he had a rival. Someone said after Turin, Plushenko was lucky because he has no rival. However it's a misunderstanding. "To take a journey without a compasse," it's too hard. I remember, after Yag's retire Plushy said like I feel like I'm in fog. Zero visibility, but continue walking alone.
Yag and Plushy, I think that they were not only rival but also kind of traveling companion. They had the same goal. Though they never became friends.
Now I just hope their success in each life
I miss Yagudin/Plushenko era. It's too vivid in my memory... :yes:
I think that Yag in 2002 was happy guy. He was won, and he had a rival. Someone said after Turin, Plushenko was lucky because he has no rival. However it's a misunderstanding. "To take a journey without a compasse," it's too hard. I remember, after Yag's retire Plushy said like I feel like I'm in fog. Zero visibility, but continue walking alone.
Yag and Plushy, I think that they were not only rival but also kind of traveling companion. They had the same goal. Though they never became friends.
Now I just hope their success in each life
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2004
I'm not sure it's fair to have Stojko in the group as their competitors because he was never the same after his groin injury in 1998 - he did manage to ull off two quds in his LP in SLC though which was a great achievement. Having sung Pluschenko's praises for jumps though, Stojko was a better jumper than both Yags and Plush. He may not have been quite as consistent as Plush but the quality of the jumps was much better - the softness of the landings (even on the quad), the running edge and knee bend. The second quad being in the second half of the program, often having a triple lutz and/or triple axel in teh second half of the program too.
Well Kulik left after 1998 Olyimpcs in Nagano so he shouldn't have really affected your enjoyment of Yagudin from 1998 worlds onwards!
Ant
I remember, after Yag's retire Plushy said like I feel like I'm in fog. Zero visibility, but continue walking alone.
Yag and Plushy, I think that they were not only rival but also kind of traveling companion. They had the same goal. Though they never became friends.
Now I just hope their success in each life
I remember how terribly upset I was in 2000-2001 every time I watched Yagudin standing on the podium below Plushenko. I felt sick from such injustice! And my friends laughing spoke to me:"What you need to understand is that Plushenko is only a kind of a flea that sits on a dog. And the dog needs this flea, because without it his neck would become numb." And, indeed, Yagudin aiways said about his laziness. Therefore, naturally, after Yag had retired Plushenko couldn`t help but feel the way he himself described. A dog can somehow do without a flea, but a flea without a dog... I suspect that a flea without a dog needs to go to search another dog!
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2008
If yagudin was not feeling threatened by Plush he wouldnt have left for Tarasova and wouldnt have changed to skater he became afterwards.They both were fighting eachother and each season trying more and more, and first years Plushenko was a youngster trying to catch up cause he came out to seniors two years after yagudin.
When he finally started to win, what was injustice?plushenko in 2000-2001 had a fabulous season, yag was not having a great season, thats all. And that was not the only season Plush won against him. In 2000 he was doing great everythign except his meltdown at worlds. It didnt matter for me who won what and how many times, the best of them two everytime won, thats a sport and it is healthy.
Yag has said that his bad 2001 season and the dominance of plush was what pushed him to work harder and win the Olympic Medal. And Plush after 2002 said " I now look back and there is none" as arrogant as it sounds it was sincere and true. He had not someone to challenge him to try something more. That was not his fault. Joubert considered his next rival, was trying better when Plushenko was in games, great example Worlds 2005.
I agree with kudryavka, they were athletes that had the same goal, speaking about a rival like a flea and dog is a but ridiculous, just my opinion. Every athlete wants to be challenged.
When he finally started to win, what was injustice?plushenko in 2000-2001 had a fabulous season, yag was not having a great season, thats all. And that was not the only season Plush won against him. In 2000 he was doing great everythign except his meltdown at worlds. It didnt matter for me who won what and how many times, the best of them two everytime won, thats a sport and it is healthy.
Yag has said that his bad 2001 season and the dominance of plush was what pushed him to work harder and win the Olympic Medal. And Plush after 2002 said " I now look back and there is none" as arrogant as it sounds it was sincere and true. He had not someone to challenge him to try something more. That was not his fault. Joubert considered his next rival, was trying better when Plushenko was in games, great example Worlds 2005.
I agree with kudryavka, they were athletes that had the same goal, speaking about a rival like a flea and dog is a but ridiculous, just my opinion. Every athlete wants to be challenged.
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I just want to say, i really
your patience to discuss so long and seriously with somebody who obviously has different opinion and attitude on internet, where the persuasion is impossible.
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
I will have to eat my words! I had forgotten that wonderful 'Lawrence' and why I did, I do not know. I think I was concentrating on that Euros win over Abt with which I did not agree, and then when he was being compared with newboy, Evgeni, which at the time, seemed like he was done.
A thousand pardons to all Yags' fans. His skating was, for me ,much better than Evgeni's.
- Joined
- Nov 23, 2008
You seem to contradict yourself. If you consider wonderful performance as an absolutely clean performance then you shouldn't like Lambiel at all! cos personally I can hardly remember at least two clean performance in a row from Stephane.
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
Fashionista Let's not belabor my likes and dislikes. It's me and I was wrong to say that Yags had only one good skate in his competitive career. His 'Lawrence' was superb. The phrase, 'I'll eat my words", is admittedly that I made an error in judgement. How many posters can admit that?
I remember how terribly upset I was in 2000-2001 every time I watched Yagudin standing on the podium below Plushenko. I felt sick from such injustice! And my friends laughing spoke to me:"What you need to understand is that Plushenko is only a kind of a flea that sits on a dog. And the dog needs this flea, because without it his neck would become numb." And, indeed, Yagudin aiways said about his laziness. Therefore, naturally, after Yag had retired Plushenko couldn`t help but feel the way he himself described. A dog can somehow do without a flea, but a flea without a dog... I suspect that a flea without a dog needs to go to search another dog!
Why do you hate Plushy?!! Are you Yagudin himself?! 
I can understand Yag's atittude for Plushy. Because he was a person concerned of the Y/P war. But you (Of course, me too) are just audience. The thing which we know are only the tip of the iceberg. We don't know what happened between them.
BTW, I can imagine why Yag hated against Plushy (and Mishin.) I guess that is not only for sports. Once, Yag have been saying that Mishin is like a father. However Mishin had not chosen him. This was a terrible shock for Yag, who don't have dad. It seems an one of the cause of their relationship.
I totally agree with you, in particular part of "injustice."
"flea and dog," it was so funny.... This metaphor which Yag chosen was too emotional!! I know that Yag intended to talk about "the story of dog," but it seems to me just silly "cat-fight."
:chorus:
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I can understand Yag's atittude for Plushy. Because he was a person concerned of the Y/P war. But you (Of course, me too) are just audience. The thing which we know are only the tip of the iceberg. We don't know what happened between them.
BTW, I can imagine why Yag hated against Plushy (and Mishin.) I guess that is not only for sports. Once, Yag have been saying that Mishin is like a father. However Mishin had not chosen him. This was a terrible shock for Yag, who don't have dad. It seems an one of the cause of their relationship.
Well, isn't Yagudin too clement and kindly to hate Plushy, so his fans do it for him
? Some people may believe they know the truth, by means of the newspaper or television or PM or anything they read or watch or listen.And every hero need a devil on his contrary, just as Harry Potter has Voldemort as enemy. The behaviour to present the love to one and detest to another whenever and wherever is understandable, especially when one of them has topic recently.
btw1, I feel Plushy's attitude to Yags very cute
. I hope they can keep the chill relationship instead of being friendsbtw2, about the metaphor, I'd like Yags to be dog and Plushy to be cat
:yes:
Their view of the world are very simple. "One day, a bad guy was killed by the hero. We're all happy. Because we know everything about the guy through rumors. According to them, the guy was such nasty!! It pissed me off, isn't it?!! The hero is absolutely right. - Happy ending." They know "everything" about their scapegoats through the other people's eye :disapp:
- Joined
- Nov 23, 2008
It's not about your post about Yagudin who turned out to be nothing because he had only two good performances per his career, it's more about your double standards policy (if you remember at least one perfect skates of Abt or Klimkin then let me know).
And BTW you must have missed the whole 1998-1999 and 2001-2002 seasons -AFAIR the majority of Yagudin's skates were perfect. Unlike all the others'.
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2008
because i had my doubts if i remembered right when i answered about plushy in 2000(nothing to do with rival with Yag), from wikipedia, plush was winning the first place from beginning of season 1999-2000 , whole season 2000-2001 and 2001-2002 until grand prix final, so it was not an excuse of injury of his rivals or luck, 16 out of 17 competitions he came first, with one interval of Worlds 2000 where he didnt lose only to yag but he popped the whole program big time, so he also lost to himself.
Out of subject, can anyone tell me when quad was introduced in sp?was ti 1998 or 99, i cant find that info.
Out of subject, can anyone tell me when quad was introduced in sp?was ti 1998 or 99, i cant find that info.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
But then again, you can't blame someone for liking one skater better than another, whether anyone skates perfect performances or not. Joe likes Abt and Klimkin. That's OK by me. Some of my personal favorites are Karam and O'keefe, Watanabe and Kido, and Vakhtang Murvanidze.
They are not as good as Navka and Kostomarov or Brian Joubert, but I still like them.
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
Ahhh, I see and understand. You have to realize I am a critic of performance tied in with technical prowess. Certain presentations appeal to me. You've probably never seen Klimkin's Swan Lake or Abt's Rach - Works of Art for me!
It's not just the medals that I admire. btw, do you like any skater who is not Russian?
