Skate Canada Preview

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Ant. I suppose it boils down to a question of money and not a question of sport.

The missing Pang and Tong was a big loss for SA. So who could they get?

Joe

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I think Johnny has a special mojo for anything he does. He beats to a different drum and I believe he will do his best at whatever he tries at the moment. Let's see how far he can go with a more bravura piece of music than his usual lyrical.

IMO, there are 3 kinds of skaters.

a) Those who excell at lyrical music, e.g. Afternoon of a Faun;
b) Those who excel at bravura music,e.g. Carmen; and
c) Like Kwan, are able to skate to both lyrical and bravura, e.g. East of Eden and Salome.

Joe

 

[antmanb]

Ant. I suppose it boils down to a question of money and not a question of sport.

How so?

Ant

 

[antmanb]

I think Johnny has a special mojo for anything he does. He beats to a different drum and I believe he will do his best at whatever he tries at the moment. Let's see how far he can go with a more bravura piece of music than his usual lyrical.

IMO, there are 3 kinds of skaters.

a) Those who excell at lyrical music, e.g. Afternoon of a Faun;
b) Those who excel at bravura music,e.g. Carmen; and
c) Like Kwan, are able to skate to both lyrical and bravura, e.g. East of Eden and Salome.

Joe

There is also unfortunately a fourth category:

d) Those who do not excel at either!!

I will politely refrain from putting any skaters names in that box but there are a few i can think of!

Ant

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I don't know about Johnny as Jesus either.
But his LP music is pretty great, I think. You can listen to it at
http://www.maximerodriguez.fr
by going to the "Accueil" page and clicking "Ecouter."

It's a TANGO!!!

It's difficult to think of Johnny as a Porteno being seedy and sexy but if he can pull it off, why not?

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

How so? Ant

The Sieudiks will bring in more money than a second rate team from another country. The competition had many second rate teams already. they needed a top Pairs to keep interest, not just for Hartford but for Skate America.

Joe

 

[hockeyfan228]

By the time Zagorska/Siudek were invited to Skate America, all of the pairs who qualfied under the ISU Grand Prix Replacement rules were skating in the event, withdrawn from the event, injured, broken up, or still skating in Juniors with no interest in skating in Seniors, too (another "pairs only" rule to try to guarantee close-to-full rosters). There is a three-skater/team limit for any country, including the host country, in any individual GP event except GPF.)

I doubt many last-minute tickets were sold in Hartford because the Siudeks were skating. The die-hard skating fans who know who they are already had their tickets and got a great bonus, and unless there was a Polish club that made a last-minute field trip, many last-minute tickets were purchased by people who were going anyway, but knew there would be good tickets released close to the event or regular folks, who like skating but wouldn't know who the Siudeks are.

 

[antmanb]

The Sieudiks will bring in more money than a second rate team from another country. The competition had many second rate teams already. they needed a top Pairs to keep interest, not just for Hartford but for Skate America.

Joe

Oh i see what you mean. But then still from a strictly sport perspective bringing a big draw skater (or pair in this case) can only be good for second rate teams epxerience competing against them?

Ant

 

[chuckm]

The ISU could rectify the situation by taking out the 3-event and GP/JGP rules for Pairs only, and having Pairs competitions at only 4 GP events, the way they did in the JGP. I don't think anyone really wants that.

If they made the selection rules for Pairs more open, then some events would have 3 or more bottom-of-the barrel teams. I don't think anyone really wants that either.

 

[seafoam]

I hope to be proved wrong in a couple of days!

To me, it seemed like his short program music (Chess) this year is of the same type that he attempted last year with his Maksim Mrvica selection. Kind of a techno-beat thing that, to me, didn't really go anywhere and did not allow Johnny to "be himself" on the ice. Last year he had to abandon that type of music and go back to Otonal. (His Swan was great, however).

I like the music, the speed and dymanic quality--but I kind of wish he had gone with the straight classical version, rather than the techno mix. But, it's not that big a deal to me. The mix is not *that* extreme.

Some people are praising him for trying to stretch and reach out of his comfort zone, but if the mock-macho SP that we saw at Campbell's is the result, I like the old Johnny better.

Am I the only one that didn't think his program was supposed to be particularly macho, mock or otherwise? Lol. If anything, it's sort of...perky. Which I think is a nice change after The Swan and Otonal, even though I loved those programs.

As for his LP music (Child of Nazareth), I hope for the best. But Johnny as Jesus -- I don't know -- as I say, I'll hope for the best this weekend.

Having heard the music, all I've got to say is that Johnny's really got to step up to the plate to match the intensity. I think he can do it. C'mon Diva Jesus!!

 

[sussweden]

Since beeing both Finnish and Swedish I just have to say, go Susanna (she won the free skate 2004 and was third over all, hope she can do this again) and to our Swedish couple who are doing their first year in seniors, Niklas and Angelika.

/Lena

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Am I the only one that didn't think his program was supposed to be particularly macho, mock or otherwise? Lol. If anything, it's sort of...perky. Which I think is a nice change after The Swan and Otonal, even though I loved those programs.

You are not the only one. His SP, although, it needs some tweeking, suits him just fine to change his style when he feels like it. Thaaaats, Johnnnnnny.

I'm a bit confused. The sound track I listened to on the other page of this thread was a Tango. Am I correct? I haven't seen him do an LP to a Tango. That is a big stretch. Worth waiting for.

Joe

 

[Mathman]

Am I the only one that didn't think his program was supposed to be particularly macho, mock or otherwise? Lol. If anything, it's sort of...perky.

You are right about that! I was overly influenced by Dick Button's commentary, when he kept going on about how Johnny must be trying to change his image because he is not wearing feathers this year.

 

[Mathman]

I'm a bit confused. The sound track I listened to on the other page of this thread was a Tango.

Joe, when you bring up the main page you get a tango, but that's not Johnny's music. To hear the music that Maxime Rodriguez composed for Johnny's LP, on the main page click on "Accueil" near the bottom, right.

Then look where it says "Saison 2006-2007 Johnny Weir" and click on "ecouter" at the end of the line.

I don't know quite how to characterize this original composition. It begins with some mournful wailing, then goes into a fast jig, then another slow part and a rousing finish. Has some chanting in it, too.

Actually, I like it. Is Johnny up to all that?

BTW, there is also a mention of the music that Rodriguez composed for Stephane Lambiel and for Delobel and Schoenfelder this year.

http://www.maximerodriguez.fr/index.html

 

[Mathman]

I don't know about Johnny as Jesus either.
But his LP music is pretty great, I think. You can listen to it at
http://www.maximerodriguez.fr
by going to the "Accueil" page and clicking "Ecouter."

Wow, thanks for the link Blackrose. The first time I listened to it I was like, What the...? But now I think it is spectaular. If Johnny can pull it off he's got my

 

[janka]

New Johnny lp music sounds interesting (except I didn't like the very very begining of it), only I would rather see the "old style" Johnny skate to it rather than the "new one". Somehow I can't imagine this piece being skated in so called "masculine" style. Well soon we'll see what he can deliver. At least that music seems more chalenging than the techno

 

[L82sk8]

Still, if they are going to change the rules just for pairs because they don't have enough competitors to field a full slate, I think it would have been better to relax the selection criteria than to give selected teams an extra event. Give more rising young teams a chance to get their feet wet.

Some of the teams make serious money at the events in prizes. For the Polish team that may help with expenses. How much money would a show tour in Poland make? Not much. Not that NN/L are wealthy. They have to earn their way to more international events by the rules.

 

[Mathman]

Welcome to the forum, L82sk8!

That's a good point about the money.

Siudek and Siudek pocketed $13,000 for their silver medal at Skate America.

Still, I wonder what the rules are about who gets the extra assignments. Petrova & Tikhonov, Savchenkoi & Szolnowy, and Obertas & Slavnov are all ranked ahead of Siudek & Siudek, Inoue & Baldwin and Marcoux and Buntin. Yet the last three teams get an extra event, but the first three don't.

Is there some sort of pecking order, or did some of the teams decline a thrid event?

 

[chuckm]

Welcome to the forum, L82sk8!
Still, I wonder what the rules are about who gets the extra assignments. Petrova & Tikhonov, Savchenkoi & Szolnowy, and Obertas & Slavnov are all ranked ahead of Siudek & Siudek, Inoue & Baldwin and Marcoux and Buntin. Yet the last three teams get an extra event, but the first three don't.

Is there some sort of pecking order, or did some of the teams decline a thrid event?

No, that order isn't right. The SEEDED skaters for the Grand Prix are, in this order:

1 PANG / TONG CHN
2 ZHANG / ZHANG CHN
3 PETROVA / TIKHONOV RUS
4 INOUE / BALDWIN USA
5 MARCOUX / BUNTIN CAN
6 SAVCHENKO / SZOLKOWY GER

PANG/TONG were offered the Skate Canada empty slot, but declined (then withdrew from Skate America due to her kidney infection) so they were not bypassed. ZHANG/ZHANG were already scheduled for Skate Canada and so could not have filled the SC vacancy. PETROVA/TIKHONOV may have been offered the spot and declined. Their first event was not until TEB, so they may not have been ready. INOUE/BALDWIN were next on the list, and accepted.

When PANG/TONG withdrew from Skate America, apparently the SIUDEKs were the only ones who wanted the spot. And from their SP performance, it was clear that they weren't really ready themselves (their first scheduled event was CoC).

MARCOUX/BUNTIN took the empty slot at CoC, and the ZHANGs, the TEB vacancy, so all the seeded teams who wanted an extra assignment, got one.

I can understand why the Pettikhs might not have wanted a 3rd assignment. Maria is nearly 29 and Alexei is 35. They had intended to retire, but were talked into staying on for this season.

As to Savchenko/Szolkowy, their status is in doubt because they are refusing to give up their coach Ingo Steuer. The German federation will not pay Steuer because he was an informer for the Stasi, and are refusing to allow him to coach any German team. Each time S/S want to compete, they have to go to court to get an injunction to allow Steuer to accompany them to an event. It would be next to impossible for them to take on an unscheduled assignment.

 

[antmanb]

You are right about that! I was overly influenced by Dick Button's commentary, when he kept going on about how Johnny must be trying to change his image because he is not wearing feathers this year.

I don't think it was just the lack of feathers though! He didn't use his arms or hands in the same expressive ways that he always had - he made fists and shook his arms (gak...come one we had years of Elvis doing this!) and his toe point and extenstion seemed, well, sloppy for him and pretty average male-ish if you ask me.

He seemed (or parhaps Marina seems) to have tried to make his moves more "masculine" and to me that destroys the strength johnny has over his competitors and leaves him in the "distinctly average" section of the Men's competition.

I'll wait to see how the programs develop - maybe he had an off night at Campbells and intend to straightn ehis back and posture and stretch and extend much more?

Ant