Suguri vs. Onda vs. Arakawa

[MaryMotorMouth]

Re: Japan skaters

"The irony of using the phrase "save face" to describe the actions of an American President when the original subject was Japanese skaters tickles my funny bone. Anyone up on their etymology?"

Linny

Um, no. I realize this thread may have gone in a unique direction, but I am learning quite a bit about something I was previously ignorant [ ashamed to admit] of. If this thread gets taken elsewhere, please let me know! I am fascinated by the knowledge offered here. Different perspectives, yes, but surely a good informational source. I save my conlusions for myself. Nonetheless, thanks!

 

[AY2006]

Re: Japan skaters

GBMalwayz,

My user name will look really silly if Alexei leaves the eligible ranks before 2006. I keep my fingers crossed. I left Japan in late '80s, and has made a few short visits ever since. I wasn't following skating in Japan very closely since Yuka turned pro in '94 until a few years ago.

I think Takeshi is a very talented skater. His inconsistency seems to come from mental weakness. I don't know what can be done... I like his skating, as well as Sandhu's and Klimkin's.

About the pairs and dance in Japan. First, there aren't many men who are willing to do this. There are fewer men than women to begin with, and most of them choose singles. (I think this is true in US as well... and probably in many other countries.) Second, there aren't coaches who can teach top level pairs or dance teams. This is a Catch-22. You don't have good pairs/dance skaters. -> You don't have good pairs/dance coaches. -> ... And third, pairs and dance take up so much more ice space than singles. Throw jumps, lifts, death spirals, etc. take up so much more space than two singles skaters practicing spins. And ice time is very precious in Japan.

So the only way to develop top pairs/dance teams is to send them overseas. Or actually, send a girl overseas, find her a partner to train under an American/Canadian/Russian coach, and convince them to represent Japan. This takes a lot of money, involves a serious issue with education (if the girl has not finished high school), and major adjustment in living environment. That's not for everyone.

I think there might be a few other problems. For pairs, the man has to be strong enough to lift his partner and throw her. Usually, Japanese men with that kind of strength do not choose figure skating. For dance, I think the shortage of people who engage in dance in general (i.e. on the floor) is a disadvantage. I have heard "Shall We Dance"? movie caused a ballroom dance boom in Japan. So maybe that will help ice dancing in Japan.

 

[Grgranny]

Re: Japan skaters

Even I, having lived through the war am learning a bunch here. Of course, when I went to school, it wasn't in the history books yet. I remember that people either loved or hated FDR with a passion. I don't hate but I sure didn't love him. I know it was such a scary time for a 12 year old. My uncle was in France, etc., and he absolutely would not talk about it. So instead he became an alcoholic. He eventually quit drinking but still would not talk about it. I am glad for all the posts here and welcome to this board, you new ones. I do hope we can keep this on a level of this is my opinion but will like yours too.

 

[AY2006]

Re: Japan skaters

Oh, I forgot to write about ballet lessons. Top skaters do take lessons, some of them take more than others. A popular joke is that Fumie goes to a ballet lesson as soon as she is off the ice, and Yoshie goes to a gym to lift weight. (But I don't think what the commentators said about Yoshie at NHK -- that Yamada tells her to come back to the rink to practice jumps instead of taking ballet lessons -- is true. ) I think one problem here is that they don't start it until they reach a high level in skating first. I think Fumie could have become a really beautiful dancer if she had started ballet lessons earlier.

 

[christinaskater]

Re: The inscrutable Orientals

Shizuka is the best among the three but she is close to fumie fumie is amazing, but Shizuka has the artistry, spins, 3-3 combinations superb footwork, good spirals great costume and has the overall package
Fumie is also amazing but she has been bothered by her ligaments she is so berautiful and really ethereal skater

Yukina ota is super amazing i saw her and she is up there with Michelle and Sasha she is the next it girl

Yoshie she has improved but not enough but she has the spark and momentum and great jums, i just dont like it when judges gves her high marks for technique and artistry her spiraLS, spins questionable and she even falls at the 3axel so why give her 5.8

 

[proudskatemom]

Re: Japan skaters

AY2006.... About Japan sending your female ice dancers overseas:

A friend of mine, who now coaches at a rink in Toronto, skated for Japan in '96 with Nakako Tsuzuki. He is Russian/Latvian. Not sure, but I think they trained in Lake Placid.
Here is a picture of them at Worlds in Edmonton

<a href="http://archive.sportserver.com/newsroom/ap/oth/1995/oth/mor/arts/031296/2709mor.html" target="top">archive.sportserver.com/newsroom/ap/oth/1995/oth/mor/arts/031296/2709mor.html</a>

I believe she is still Japan's National Dance champ with another Russian partner. Is that correct?

 

[AY2006]

Re: Japan skaters

Nakako Tsuzuki and Rinat Farkhoutdinov won the national title in 1999-2001. (Tsuzuki won the title with three different partners.) It looks like they haven't competed since 2001 Worlds. I don't know if Tsuzuki has quit competitive skating, or she is searching for a new partner.

 

[Callystarr]

Re: The inscrutable Orientals

Well I am going to try to be unbiased about each and everyone of these ladies.

*Fumie Suguri*
I have one thing to say in regards to Fumie Suguri's consistency that everyone is commenting on. Fumie has never been a really consistent jumper, As far back as I can remember she has never landed more than 5 triples in a LP, and she typically has always landed about 3-5 triples throughout her career. The only difference is that she has had a gradual but steady improvement on the presentation side. At the beginning of the season I was not impressed with her LP to "Swan Lake" but I think my most enjoyable performance of the year out of the LP's was her 4 triple effort @ NHK Trophy. Fumie has improved so much the last 3 years, and I still don't believe that she is getting the artistic marks that she deserves. I do believe that she does need to get a little more consistent in her jumps are she will remain in the 4, 5, 6, 7 placements in the world.

*Yoshi Onda*
I do believe that her jumping ability in the out of the top 10 women in the world is unrivaled. She was the most consistent jumper during the course of the season last year. I think that her LP is a step in the right direction, but it still is not close to the likes of Many of the Americans, Russians or even her Japanese competitors. I am still questioning how she has managed to get 5.7's and 5.8's for presentation in any competition this season, She is not horrid in the presentation mark, but those marks are way to generous for me. She has some very nice highlights..attempting to show some emotion in her LP, and it will be only a matter of time..but despite her wonderful performance @ NHK I don't think I would have even given her the win at that competition despite superb jumping.

*Shiziku Arakawa*
This young lady Has really shocked me the last two seasons. She is a good jumper, however, not consistent. Her LP's are probably the most consistent out of all the women, but she seems to have major problems in her SP's. If you just look @ the last two seasons, she has posted 6 or 7 triple performances in all of her LP's internationally except one (Four continents)....She does now have the overall package. A little more expression would be nice, but choregraphy and her jumping technique is one that some of our American Ladies may want to take a lesson from. I actually thought that she would have won nationals this season, but see was 7th after the short (disasterous SP...it seems, typical) and came back to finish 2nd in the LP, and 3rd overall...if she can get a clean SP @ Worlds, it almost seems as thought she will definately cause a bit of a stir in Washington this year.

 

[SteveKmetko374]

Re: Japan skaters

to AY2006, this is off topic, but during that competition in China (gymnastics) the Chinese booed all the girls except the Chinese girls and when any non-chinese girl fell they cheered. I remember the American girls talking about how it was an awful experience, so it was nothing personal against only the Japanese. When the American girls were on beam the chinese audience was chanting "Fall! Fall! Fall!" which I presume they did to everyone.

Fetal, I saw some show on CNN or BCC a few years back about Japanese life, they followed several regular working class people through daily life. The men, as you said, were expected to stay out late for business purposes (drinking with work colleagues) and they said they felt obligated to partake in this social activity and the women said they felt like if their children did not do well at school or in society in general the community would mark them as a bad mother, so the mothers in this TV special spent hours helping their children with homework and studying every single night. The children felt intense pressure to do well to get into university - its unlike here were the biggest dopes in the world seem to have college degrees, in Japan apparently you actually have to have some knowledge to get into a university.

ANYWAY,

Shizuka Arakawa - she is my favorite of the Japanese ladies this season. She is the type of skater who could make you cry.

Yoshi Onda - she's cute and pleasant to watch. I don't want her turned into a dying swan either but I want to see MAJOR improvement in her positions - spirals and layback spins et al are horrible and torturous for me to watch. But she's cute.

Fumie - I like her, she needs a bit more expression and consistency, her programs are well thought out, I think it is clear she is trying to become the "full package skater"