2016 Skate America Short Dance

[Sugarpova]

good thing I didnt watch practices

SS - great blending of the 2 songs & good precise skating. I do dislike Maia's outfit Imo skirt suits her much better.
Min/Gamelin - *** is that 'bycicle' lift
Kana/Chris - disappointed
Alisa/Alper - she looks so much like Rednikova. why Im only noticing it now tho.))) looked kinda slow She in particular
Lena/Ruslan - really energetic dance, Ruslan really progressed Lena is a diva. The only thing sad is that Vaits was right But I hope it will look lighter @ the next comp
G/F - 1 of the best SDs this year, Id put them 3rd here/ dance and execution
B/S - wow the best outfits & without that bug from Katya Id put them veeery close to Shibs. Most elegant of the comp
TT - Weekend:luv17: she makes him pale in comparison he needs to learn from Ruslan
H/D - so far biggest disappointmnt this year...........at least last year 1 of the progs was a masterpiece IZ & Italians I'd have above this one.lets hope throughout the year those teams would be above
P/B - the main character is Alex' costume. Kinda boring otherwise

Maxim was a good commentator, no nonsense one & he called IZ IK! all good!

 

[WeakAnkles]

Not a big enough change. He would rather they use fewer cuts. Well, it's up to them and their team. Gilles/Poirier proved last year you can get some bad marks, go back, and rework an SD to amazing levels.

Except if you actually look at the choreography, G/P didn't really make that many fundamental changes. What they did is recontextualize it, away from a more intellectual approach (parody of French court dance, particularly the minuet, military/marching moves) to a lighthearted romp to uptempo pop music (in this case, the poppier side of The Beatles--they didn't, for instance, rechoreograph or recontextualize it to "Tomorrow Never Knows" or "Revolution #9).

I actually rather like what The Shibs have done with their particular mashup. Because they carry it through the program, it is a far more integrated dance than H/D's. There isn't as clean a break between "this is the traditional blues section to please the fuddy duddy," and "this is hip hop section to show how cutting edge we are." And they are pretty much the only team who has managed to do this. Everyone else using hip hop has essentially welded it to their opening blues section. Or they really chickened out and went for a 50s sock hop.

 

[gravy]

Well they did change it already, taking out almost all of the "I like big butts" section, which was a good change. I think that last footwork sequence just isn't very good, particularly with the music, which brings the program down.

I agree. There's such a drastic rhythm change during that sequence and their skating speed remains static; it doesn't alternate at all to reflect the music change from slow to fast and it's so underwhelming especially when the climax of that terrible top 40 song is the bass drop and you expect them to be skating at 3000 MPH by the end of it.

I previously posted that this short dance is very entertaining (and it is), but honestly this will destroy all the incredible progress they made last year if they don't make drastic changes to the program.

 

[WeakAnkles]

I liked the Shibs and Bobrova/Soloviev. Both teams skated NOT so perfectly. I see slight improvement from the Shibs to 'widen' their amplitude and skate bigger, but it's not enough for me to fully enjoy their style of skating yet. I hope the mistakes will be resolved before the next event, because there were a lot of flat edges and little imperfections here and there.
Ekaterina and Dmitri had best skate of this SD presentation-wise, and absolutely worst technically! Even their first event in Samara at the beginning of September was better on that aspect. Katia looked very nervous, and two her double twizzles during their step sequences costed them 3 points of TES mark. I'm in horror how they got lower than 9 for SS, though! Like, in what reality? And overall I would say their PCS should be much closer to what the Shibs got. But they'll get theirs at Rostelecom Cup, so no worries here

Well like I said, everyone likes a little home cookin'' in their own home; they're not so happy to see it elsewhere.

Yes, I agree with you on two points. Ruslena's SD is neither a masterpiece or a disaster; it's a serviceable piece that meets the requirements but doesn't transcend them. They have a far more fundamental problem they have yet to address. It's what I call The Mickey Rooney Curse. Mickey Rooney was, when he was a juvenile, the number one film star in the world (yes, bigger at one point than Clark Gable). Then he grew up. Or rather he got older, but his look and his persona didn't. He was essentially simply an older version of a male juvenile lead. Ruslan is facing the same issue. Plus I see zero chemistry between them in most of their programs (Carmen is the exception). She remains one of the absolute best female ice dancers of the age (I'd be happy watching her skate to a recitation from a computer manual), but it is still an imbalanced partnership, in terms of range, skating ability, dance 'character' and the like. So a nice SD, but not much more you can say about it than that. YMMV of course.

And I do think the Shibs and B/S were in a whole 'nother class from the rest of the competitors. And both were a bit 'early days' in terms of performance, at least technically. It is a marvel though to see how both teams have improved over the last four years in terms of reaching out to the audience whilst maintaining a connection with each other.

 

[NoNameFace]

after watching top 4 the general thought of mine is that there's A LOT of work for all teams, even Shibutanis...

Maia and Alex - out of top 4 definitely the most polished and cohesive program. I actually dig that musical mash up very much - and moreover I feel like costuming, choreography and expression are complimentary to it which is very rare to accomplish. They look very stylish and sophisticated in a very nonchalant way - it felt natural how they look, how they move and present the program. Maia has definitely opened performance-wise and Alex is his usual charming himself. Also,from tech perspective I feel that they did the best blues pattern out of all duos - it was perfecly paced, not rushed, with relaxed upper body and with great punctuation of music (ofc twizzles are the best in business as usual). However said, both step sequences (partial and non-touchnig) require work, especially partial - for me it felt kind of flat and as a 'filler' whereas the rest of the SD was interesting. Non-touching step sequence has to 'gel' more between steps and hip-hop movement, right now it felt a bit too scratchy and not fluid. In general the SD is very promising, entertaining, definitely stands out from all these pretty the same blues/swing combos with overused music and most important - their personality really shines through it and they did not let the music and choreo overatken it. It's a really good balance to build on.

Bobrova and Soloviev - to be honest after watching test skates I am sad and disappointed by their choices his year, mostly by FD. They are such brilliant storytellers, expressive performers and came up with such bland, uninspired, sad programs?! This SD confirmed this feeling unfortunately - it was nice and correct, but nothing more, nothing which would stand out, surprise me or be innovative. Aside of general reception of the dance it was quite a messy one - especially from Ekaterina's part - lots of tweaks and wobbles in step sequences and between elements, generally it felt like she was not very sure or nervous while performing. That said,on a shallow part she looks smoking hot, in my opinion she has never looked better. At this point they really need to amp the volume of the dance, make it more interesting somehow ad ofc work on smoothness of transitions, sharpness of elements and overall expression/confidence while performing which were lacking yesterday.

Madison and Zach...out of top 4 this is the SD which I have the most issues with (possibly out of all SDs this season at least from the top teams, but let's wait until I saw everyone). This dance is way TOO BUSY both musically and choreographically and it makes hard to focus on the reception. I appreciate the concept - which was probably to show some kind of evolution from 'Feeling good' classic to modern hip-hop vibes - but the execution is not doing them any favors I feel. Maybe if they would feel the hip-hop groove better it would make up for busy music cuts, but in my opinion they're not feeling it well, at least to express it with confidence which would convince me that the program is good. Out of two of them, Madison is the weaker one - this whole 'tip-toeing' in the hip-hop part is really hilarious, not in a good way. I don't see sharpness, edge and flow in that dance - it looks like a random mix of songs was aired and they had to dance to it without much of preparation. They really have to re-think using so much of different music or find a way to link it more fluidly and most importantly - they have to find some cohesion between oh-so-busy music and coreography, now they are two different things and it makes it hard to appreciate, even if done correctly from technical perspective. That's the main problem with hip-hop as a 2nd rhythm chosen I feel - if the team is not feeling it or can't sell t properly, it would be bad no matter how clean and proper it will be done.

And Elena and Ruslan - first of all I have to say I missed them quite much and realized it just now, after seeing them performing. They did well I feel - their performance abilities are very good and they surely have goods to challenge the top, but what bugs me it's the program and choreography which screams OLD and GENERIC. From my perspective it is another blues/swing forgettable SD at the moment - they have to give it a massive 'oomph' somehow, considering music, choreo, transitions, storyline or something else. Being aware of some health/fitness problems and training situations they're into recently, they did pretty good from technical side and it's a good sign for the next outings. I am sure they will be motivated to keep on hard work and will improve, just wish the SD would feel more 'now' and modern. And for the last note - Elena is a queen of performance each and every time, regardless of music, style and rhythm, she can sell everything to any audience, no other female in ice dance can be a diva and still connects with everyone in such amazing way, her smile is infectious and her beauty only compliments how great and valuable ice dancer she is

So far my top 3 SD this season would be Tessa and Scott, Piper and Paul and probably Shibutanis, would love to add some great blues/swing dance tho...

 

[Mango]

Except if you actually look at the choreography, G/P didn't really make that many fundamental changes. What they did is recontextualize it, away from a more intellectual approach (parody of French court dance, particularly the minuet, military/marching moves) to a lighthearted romp to uptempo pop music (in this case, the poppier side of The Beatles--they didn't, for instance, rechoreograph or recontextualize it to "Tomorrow Never Knows" or "Revolution #9).

Yeah, the music change with G/P was the big thing. The same situation that Hubbell/Donohue are in. Patrice can take care of their levels and step sequences so choreo itself isn't the big issue. It's their music that they need to decide to change.

 

[Sugarpova]

#WadaFail :curse:

1 of many

Never understood H/D hype. I hope H/B can take over them this year.

the only dance I liked of theirs was Hallelujah Lets hope for H/B

 

[LadyB]

I like the Shibs a lot and wish them well this season, but I haven't been convinced yet. I'm not sure about the way the music was put together or Alex's costume. I know that at GP's the host nation's skaters are always given a slight advantage by the judges, but hey, come on, you don't have to do it so blatantly, guys!
I love B/S and hope they can pull it off tonight, they should have been a lot closer to the Shibs scorewise.

 

[MK's Winter]

And Elena and Ruslan - first of all I have to say I missed them quite much and realized it just now, after seeing them performing. They did well I feel - their performance abilities are very good and they surely have goods to challenge the top, but what bugs me it's the program and choreography which screams OLD and GENERIC. From my perspective it is another blues/swing forgettable SD at the moment - they have to give it a massive 'oomph' somehow, considering music, choreo, transitions, storyline or something else. Being aware of some health/fitness problems and training situations they're into recently, they did pretty good from technical side and it's a good sign for the next outings. I am sure they will be motivated to keep on hard work and will improve, just wish the SD would feel more 'now' and modern. And for the last note - Elena is a queen of performance each and every time, regardless of music, style and rhythm, she can sell everything to any audience, no other female in ice dance can be a diva and still connects with everyone in such amazing way, her smile is infectious and her beauty only compliments how great and valuable ice dancer she is So far my top 3 SD this season would be Tessa and Scott, Piper and Paul and probably Shibutanis, would love to add some great blues/swing dance tho...

I missed Elena and Ruslan as well. I enjoyed their performance and love the program. With that said I think they did stick to the formula due to the fact they tried something new last year and was hammered for it.

 

[Sugarpova]

the score for IZ tho
66.6

 

[Mattieu]

the score for IZ tho
66.6

Is that hysterical laughter or happy laughter?

 

[Sugarpova]

Is that hysterical laughter or happy laughter?

coincidential
Ofc I'd be happier if it was 77.7

btw anyone felt Lea's dress should be different
shorter & diff design

 

[all that]

he will love it.. no choice there it would look really badly if he critiqued it too harshly

I disagree. People who want to bring V/M down are looking for reasons to do so. If he can provide anything remotely legit, people will jump all over it. If I were USFSA, I'd want him to at least say stuff that suggests the Shibs are on the same level as them, if not slightly better in some aspects. I'd also want him to somehow suggest that there is a new era in ice dance and V/M are old news or can't keep up. He could easily do this in a diplomatic way, and let the media and fanboards do the rest of the work.

 

[4everchan]

I disagree. People who want to bring V/M down are looking for reasons to do so. If he can provide anything remotely legit, people will jump all over it. If I were USFSA, I'd want him to at least say stuff that suggests the Shibs are on the same level as them, if not slightly better in some aspects. I'd also want him to somehow suggest that there is a new era in ice dance and V/M are old news or can't keep up. He could easily do this in a diplomatic way, and let the media and fanboards do the rest of the work.

the fanboards are already trying to say that...

I don't think the USFSA do tell commentators what to say or not to say... if they did, Tara and Johnny's banter would be different for sure

 

[olayolay]

I really don't think Charlie White is as petty as some posters here are.

 

[labgoat]

I agree with most posters about H & D having too many music cuts. Part of me wants to see them segway from feel good to ice, ice baby and still have a cohesive theme with a clear change of tempo.

Was watching DWTS and Vanilla Ice really got the crowd going with his song. Moves were adapted for the ballroom. Perhaps team HD could find some ideas.

 

[Snow63]

coincidential
Ofc I'd be happier if it was 77.7

btw anyone felt Lea's dress should be different
shorter & diff design

Yes, but she seems to like long skirts lately for some reason...

 

[rosy14]

It is just reply for the ''manic'' comment. I know it is bad but....

I think Shibs are in trouble but skating in US hiding that. Small ice covarage, small extention on pattern dance, slow skating going to bother them. I have seen so many times big scores on Skate America, Canada, Cup of Russia. Undeserving scores always come back and bother you. Not in grand prix but big competitions. Look at hyping of Chock/Bates for last 3 year. Suddenly everything is not that good. I call this ''Belbin/Agosto moment''. Ohh big scores, everything going great, will get
big scores next competition and what?
OK we love skates without mistakes. I love clean work. Shibutanis problems are they are not skating like big couples. You can't correct that in season. I'm glad finally judges notice Chock/Bates. Next one is Shibs who skates like they are in 2011. There is reason why judges let them down. They are repeating same thing again.

Well, apparently judges appreciated them a lot last year ( forget the French, they are poised to win gold at Olympics. Wwe're talking here of normal people, not Olympico gods). And they appreciated them today. Not all judges were American, last year and today. As for Chock /Bates, they were well rewarded at Nebelhron Ttrophy in PCS, a bit less in TES. At Nepela they did some big mistakes, but it can happen. Let's see them next week in Canada. Ah, they are still World bronze medallists.

 

[gnom]

The Shib's program seems to get extremely divided reactions. I have to admit I'm in love with the short dance. Love the music edit, (especially) Maia's costume and the choreography. Think they skated already exceptionelly well given early season. HipHop moves are fast & sharp. Looking forward to seeing the program develop over time.

 

[all that]

the fanboards are already trying to say that...

I don't think the USFSA do tell commentators what to say or not to say... if they did, Tara and Johnny's banter would be different for sure

icenetwork, for which Charlie is commentating, is owned by USFSA. Tara and Johnny commentate for NBC, not icenetwork.