2020-21 U.S. Pairs Figure Skating

[labgoat]

I agree with you that I want to see U.S. teams going further. That's why the missed opportunity at Worlds to have better placements and to bring home a third spot, kinda stings. And now with Canada's recent new pairing of two veterans who are bound to shake things up at the top, the missed opportunity at Worlds for K/F to resoundingly establish themselves hurts a bit more. I see that Brandon liked Meagan Duhamel's post stating how she feels blindsided by the new partnership of James/Radford. Personally, I like the palpable excitement of this new pairing.

BTW, there's a whole lot that goes into improving an entire pairs discipline. The individual athletes mostly have to work on managing their own careers. It's up to the U.S. federation to think about improving the discipline as a whole, and that just hasn't been U.S. fed's focus for far too long. In general, I think U.S. fed has tended to think that careers for athletes work themselves out automatically. At least, that's the way it seems they think.

Regarding your comments on the history I cited, here's more:

Please note that 6th to 8th has not been U.S. pairs history on the world stage since forever. LOL! As I pointed out, there has been a dearth of podium placements at Worlds and Olympics for U.S. pairs teams for about 18 going on 19 years (not counting last year of course). Being in the midst of that dearth, I'm sure makes it seem like it will go on forever. It certainly is part of the reason why fans tend to look down on the U.S. pairs discipline. But that disdain is unfair IMO. The U.S. pairs discipline's 19-year mark will match the record of same set by Canadian pairs during the 1960s and 1970s, when U.S. pairs teams were making the podiums at Worlds and Olympic, on occasion, generally in the silver and bronze categories. Meanwhile, the Russians were building their dominance in the 60s, 70s, and 80s, which of course never waned, even though it did fluctuate a bit at the top with the rise of Chinese pairs skating, and with the vibrant competitiveness of certain German and Canadian teams.

I find the entire history of pairs skating fascinating and neverendingly entertaining and enlightening. I wish Fours competitions would come back into vogue. Fours was particularly popular in Canada. U.S. and Canadian pairs skating parallels quite a bit. It was a U.S. team that broke through first on the Worlds stage post WWII. The devastation of Europe and the resultant immigration of a number of skating athletes led to opportunities for North American teams to break through, which they did in fine fashion, never looking back. Most North American teams (including singles skaters as well) were at first known for their athleticism/ athletic influence on the sport. A young brother/sister team from the U.S., Peter and Karol Kennedy, were the first North American pairs team to win Worlds, in 1950. Of course, the only other U.S. team to win Worlds is Tai Babilonia/Randy Gardner, in 1979. Babilonia/Gardner flourished in the 1970s. They were known for their athleticism and for their gorgeous unison and line.

In the early years post WWII, both the U.S. and Canada began flourishing in pairs skater internationally. But it was a Canadian team who broke through to win the Olympics for the first time for a North American team, Barbara Wagner/Robert Paul:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cyFFTXF8kg (prior to this 1960 Olympics win, they'd won Worlds for three years, and a 4th time in 1960).

It was surely the advent of Wagner/Paul as World and Olympic champions which helped give Canada some of the strength of its pairs legacy. However, the U.S. has a strong pairs legacy as well, albeit without any U.S. team having won the Olympics. Canada has two winning Olympic teams in Wagner/Paul and Sale/Pelletier (albeit the latter was at first silver, then gold post scandal). It is quite interesting that both Canada and U.S. have both spent nearly identical years off Worlds and Olympic podiums in different eras, and yet both countries still have made important contributions to pairs, with Canada having the edge in prestigious accomplishments, particularly in recent history.

It pays to note though that before and after the breakthrough by the Kennedys in 1950, U.S. teams had a presence on the Worlds podium off-and-on. Karol & Peter Kennedy won an Olympic silver medal in 1952. The Kennedys also won four silver medals at Worlds in the late 1940s and early 1950s, in addition to their 1950 World gold medal. Prior to WWII, the U.S. had a decorated pairs team in Beatrix Loughran/ Sherwin Badger, who won silver at the 1932 Olympics, in addition to two bronze medals at Worlds (1930, 1932). Canada had a post-WWII winning pair team in the late 1940s in Suzanne Morrow/ Wallace Diestelmeyer who won Olympic bronze and World bronze in 1948. Ann Davies/Carlton Hoffner won World bronze in 1949, joining teammates, Karol & Peter Kennedy on the podium. A Hungarian team, Andrea Kekesy/ Ede Kiraly won gold that same year, in Paris. And so on. The stats are readily researchable.

Pairs skating in the early years pre- and post-WWI was dominated by German, Austrian, British, Hungarian and some Swedish and Finnish teams, and one fabulous French team, the Brunets! In addition, a U.S., a Norwegian and a Czech team reached the World podium during that period. Fascinatingly, during the first ever World championships in 1908, a Russian pairs team won the bronze medal! But it wasn't until 1962 when Ludmila Belousova/ Oleg Protopopov broke through at Worlds to win silver that another Russian team took the Worlds podium. Of course, Belousova/Protopopov (later The Protopopovs) were a revolutionary team who continued winning silver and then gold, later a bronze in the following years, and famously Olympic gold in 1964 and 1968. I would guess that the harsh effects of the Russian Revolution and later the World Wars is what interrupted Russia's ability to make headway in pairs skating, until the Protopopovs came along and changed pairs skating forever.

All of this history is readily available for anyone who is interested to research and to marvel at. I find it fun and instructive to look back.

May I also add John & Jennifer Nicks of Great Britain to your impressive group.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

May I also add John & Jennifer Nicks of Great Britain to your impressive group.

I was mainly discussing North American teams and a general history of countries that dominated in pairs. The Nicks siblings from Great Britain, of course were definitely stellar in their day, and they played an important part in the history of pairs skating. Moreover, Mr. Nicks has a rich, substantial legacy as a singles and pairs coach in the United States. He, along with other international coaches, including Carlo Fassi, generously offered their services to U.S. figure skating post the 1961 Sabena air crash which killed the entire U.S. figure skating team that year, along with coaches, and some family members of the athletes.

 

[skylark]

But then we get to the point I mentioned above, is it just a mental hurdle they need to overcome? Because it would be worse to have an easier problem and still not skate it clean. But when you go and take a look at the stats on these teams, go to skatingscores and do this favor to yourself, you’ll see how disheartening as a fan it is to know that half the time they’re not landing their stuff. And it’s proven mathematically.

It's disheartening, yes, and for me, it's also a matter of preferring to really enjoy competitive skating. I much prefer to watch the pairs (and all skaters) who I can have a feeling of confidence in. Then I'm not holding my breath or dreading the next element. And in my mind, I go back to Dick Button's comment on G&G in 1988. He said that what they do (elements and skating-wise) wasn't anything unusual or that other pairs didn't do. The difference was that they did everything so well. Quality.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

From Todd & Jenni, a nice pic of Mr. Nicks and crew celebrating his 92nd birthday! (I can make out Mr. Nicks, Tai, Randy, Sasha, Todd, Jenni, Debbie, and some other familiar faces...)

https://www.instagram.com/p/CN_3ETXL0G5/

Plus, John Kerr is choreographing a program for the new partnership of Cate Fleming & Chase Finster. I think John K enjoys working with young developing skaters:

https://www.instagram.com/p/COBw0kvLVA6/

Also, Benoit Richaud is working again with Calalang/Johnson. He created their Game of Thrones 'Light of the Seven' sp that they used for two seasons:

https://www.instagram.com/p/COQziceLbpY/

Ashley & Timothy are working again with Pasquale Camerlengo

https://www.instagram.com/p/COBc8rXjchC/

Nice shots:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CODq5gyjqaF/

https://www.instagram.com/p/COHCtWOjCjn/

https://www.instagram.com/p/CON7aYuj4m0/

This time of year is always bittersweet, waiting for news of music and programs anxiously, while looking back and looking forward. This year with a bit of trepidation and resignation regarding not really knowing how everything will pan out for events in the summer and fall. I hope things go more smoothly for the athletes this off-season, so they can get in all the training they need.

 

[skylark]

Also, Benoit Richaud is working again with Calalang/Johnson. He created their Game of Thrones 'Light of the Seven' sp that they used for two seasons:

https://www.instagram.com/p/COQziceLbpY/

That's great! There's something about that program that discovers hidden things in Jessica & Brian. I love it.

Ashley & Timothy are working again with Pasquale Camerlengo

https://www.instagram.com/p/COBc8rXjchC/

Nice shots:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CODq5gyjqaF/

https://www.instagram.com/p/COHCtWOjCjn/

https://www.instagram.com/p/CON7aYuj4m0/

Gorgeous!

 

[moonvine]

From Todd & Jenni, a nice pic of Mr. Nicks and crew celebrating his 92nd birthday! (I can make out Mr. Nicks, Tai, Randy, Sasha, Todd, Jenni, Debbie, and some other familiar faces...)

https://www.instagram.com/p/CN_3ETXL0G5/

Plus, John Kerr is choreographing a program for the new partnership of Cate Fleming & Chase Finster. I think John K enjoys working with young developing skaters:

https://www.instagram.com/p/COBw0kvLVA6/

Also, Benoit Richaud is working again with Calalang/Johnson. He created their Game of Thrones 'Light of the Seven' sp that they used for two seasons:

https://www.instagram.com/p/COQziceLbpY/

Ashley & Timothy are working again with Pasquale Camerlengo

https://www.instagram.com/p/COBc8rXjchC/

Nice shots:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CODq5gyjqaF/

https://www.instagram.com/p/COHCtWOjCjn/

https://www.instagram.com/p/CON7aYuj4m0/

This time of year is always bittersweet, waiting for news of music and programs anxiously, while looking back and looking forward. This year with a bit of trepidation and resignation regarding not really knowing how everything will pan out for events in the summer and fall. I hope things go more smoothly for the athletes this off-season, so they can get in all the training they need.

Mr Nicks looks amazing!

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

^^ Yes he does! And what a tremendous legacy Mr. Nicks has. Plus it's cool seeing all the family of athletes and other colleagues in the skating community who are like family coming out to celebrate with him.

We need to honor and listen to the elders of the sport while they are still here. There was a video made at the Skating Club of Boston recently about the club's history and the important legacy through the years, especially the poignant and still reverberating loss of all those from that club and other clubs around the U.S. who lost their lives in the 1961 Sabena air crash. Frank Carroll and others who are old-timers, former skaters and coaches reminisced in the video, with a younger generation of skaters now training in Boston at the club's newly built rink.

 

[moonvine]

Regarding Danny O’Shea - I’ve seen several posts from people wanting to pair him up with various people and I started to wonder who in the US was available. So we have Kate Finister and..is that it? I was thinking Megan Wessenberg did not have a partner but her Wikipedia page says she is paired with Blake Eisenach, who has no Wikipedia page and I’ve never heard of.

 

[skylark]

Regarding Danny O’Shea - I’ve seen several posts from people wanting to pair him up with various people and I started to wonder who in the US was available. So we have Kate Finister and..is that it? I was thinking Megan Wessenberg did not have a partner but her Wikipedia page says she is paired with Blake Eisenach, who has no Wikipedia page and I’ve never heard of.

Thank you for this! Megan's partnership was mentioned in this thread a few pages back. @BlissfulSynergy may have written a few sentences about Blake, but I don't recall. I've been thinking about Danny too, especially as it's been said publicly, I guess, that he had a tryout with Vanessa.
Hang in there, Danny! You have so many people who would love to see your great pairs skating again.

I wonder if he's had a tryout with Kate Finster. It was mentioned before, and it's true there's a large age difference. But I was thinking about the Japanese pair Riku Miura/Ryiuchu Kihara, and how wonderful they were at Worlds, and they've still only been skating together a year and a half or so. What they've brought to the world of pairs skating is pretty awe-inspiring. And it was immediately apparent at NHK 2019 that they were both so much better than they'd been with previous partners. Ryiuchu is 28 and Riku is still only 18.

Pairing with Danny would raise Kate automatically, wouldn't it? Have either she or Balasz even been seeking a partner?

 

[TontoK]

^^ Yes he does! And what a tremendous legacy Mr. Nicks has. Plus it's cool seeing all the family of athletes and other colleagues in the skating community who are like family coming out to celebrate with him.

We need to honor and listen to the elders of the sport while they are still here. There was a video made at the Skating Club of Boston recently about the club's history and the important legacy through the years, especially the poignant and still reverberating loss of all those from that club and other clubs around the U.S. who lost their lives in the 1961 Sabena air crash. Frank Carroll and others who are old-timers, former skaters and coaches reminisced in the video, with a younger generation of skaters now training in Boston at the club's newly built rink.

Concerning Mr Nicks.

Two hours ago, TSL released an extensive interview with him. I know many people don't like TSL in general, but I find value in many of their interviews.

To each his/her own. Watch or don't watch... I will.

Interview with John Nicks

John Nicks is a legendary figure skating coach and former pair skater. With his sister, Jennifer Nicks, he is the 1953 World champion. As a coach, his skatin...

www.youtube.com

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

^^ Yes, thanks. I came here to post that interview myself, as I just noticed it on YouTube.

 

[moonvine]

Thank you for this! Megan's partnership was mentioned in this thread a few pages back. @BlissfulSynergy may have written a few sentences about Blake, but I don't recall. I've been thinking about Danny too, especially as it's been said publicly, I guess, that he had a tryout with Vanessa.
Hang in there, Danny! You have so many people who would love to see your great pairs skating again.

I wonder if he's had a tryout with Kate Finster. It was mentioned before, and it's true there's a large age difference. But I was thinking about the Japanese pair Riku Miura/Ryiuchu Kihara, and how wonderful they were at Worlds, and they've still only been skating together a year and a half or so. What they've brought to the world of pairs skating is pretty awe-inspiring. And it was immediately apparent at NHK 2019 that they were both so much better than they'd been with previous partners. Ryiuchu is 28 and Riku is still only 18.

Pairing with Danny would raise Kate automatically, wouldn't it? Have either she or Balasz even been seeking a partner?

I was kind of assuming Balasz would partner with Tarah.

 

[skylark]

I was kind of assuming Balasz would partner with Tarah.

So was I. There's a link to a recent interview with Tarah in post #504 of this thread. Sometime in March. She didn't mention Balasz at all and the interviewer, Masha, gave her plenty of opportunity to say who she plans to partner with, or if she had a tryout scheduled with anyone. Nothing. She did talk about her break-up with Danny.

 

[moonvine]

So was I. There's a link to a recent interview with Tarah in post #504 of this thread. Sometime in March. She didn't mention Balasz at all and the interviewer, Masha, gave her plenty of opportunity to say who she plans to partner with, or if she had a tryout scheduled with anyone. Nothing. She did talk about her break-up with Danny.

That is so weird. Do you suppose both Tarah and Danny will no longer skate? This would certainly be the time to seek a new partner.

 

[skylark]

That is so weird. Do you suppose both Tarah and Danny will no longer skate? This would certainly be the time to seek a new partner.

If I remember correctly, she didn't mention a tryout or an opportunity for one in the interview. I guess it's all up in the air right now.

 

[skylark]

Ashley Cain-Gribble and Timothy Leduc - SP- “The White Crow” https://www.instagram.com/p/COlTcvQD-aa/

Ugh. I am not happy. This feels like their choice of "Rach II," Chapter 2. With Rach, it felt like Camerlengo chose all the parts of the music that no one else wanted to use, and omitted the best, most dramatic parts, all the segments that Ashley and Tim would have done great justice to. And the music could have worked for them, worked with their talents of drama and beautiful expression.

"White Crow" feels to me like they, or Misha Ge, are trying to capitalize on Kolyada's phenomenal program -- but it feels like such a wrong-headed idea. It may seem instead like trying to skate in on his coattails. I just really don't understand this choice. I have to admit that the photos they're showing us look really cool. I'm shocking myself when I say keep the cool choreography, just change the music.

Please note -- I am not saying what Misha, Tim or Ashley are thinking or what motivates them. I'm saying what it feels, to me, what it's going to look like to others. Just a wrong-headed choice. Gah.

This is one of those times when I hope to be proven wrong.

 

[TontoK]

Ashley Cain-Gribble and Timothy Leduc - SP- “The White Crow” https://www.instagram.com/p/COlTcvQD-aa/

<snip>

This is one of those times when I hope to be proven wrong.

I hope we're both proven wrong. It doesn't seem that this choice is going to accentuate the things in their skating that set them apart.

We'll see how it goes, but I hope it doesn't resemble a knockoff of Kolyada's program.

Edit: But I admit the still photos of what I expect are their opening and closing poses look really cool.

Edit again: Rereading my post, and I haven't added anything at all to what you've written. Great minds think alike, I suppose.

 

[skylark]

It doesn't seem that this choice is going to accentuate the things in their skating that set them apart.

That's what kills me. They don't look or skate like anyone else. Why not highlight and pull out all the great characteristics that they have and emphasize their uniqueness? NOT copy the music choice of one of 2020-21's most memorable programs. Aaargh. I suppose I care too much.

Great minds think alike, I suppose.

 

[coldblueeyes]

Imagine they show up in a blue costume

 

[Skater Boy]

When you look at the American Pair situation you can see the similarities as to levels with the Canadians now that Canada appears to have two teams.