Coaches' proposals 4-9: Spins and steps

[gkelly]

How about, lower the total number of elements allowed and let each skater choose for themselves whether to take out a jump pass, a spin, or a step or spiral sequence?

 

[mskater93]

I know I'd remove a spin at that level rather than a jump or step/spiral sequence. It take a lot of energy to complete a spin, sometimes more than a jump.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Since the Free Skate no longer exists, a proposal for limiting the elements in the LP would solve this. My suggestion (not written in stone) would be to have Senior Skaters be allowed to use 5 spins and 5 jumps (not more than that). Choreographers could play with that.

Joe

 

[hockeyfan228]

So you up the value of the quad by more than 50%, reduce the number of spins, and remove levels from spins and footwork, and Buttle still wins the WC?

I think not.

I think Plushenko wins the WC next year by a larger margin than he won Torino. The coaches don't think much of the callers, because under this group of proposals, the judges have far more leeway in determining whether to give credit for spins, spirals, and footwork, and we're back where we started.

It's already been proven that under CoP, regardless of the rules tweaks, that choreographers can create programs that are every bit as good as the best under 6.0/OBO in the triples/quad era. If the coaches aren't producing the skaters who can do them justice, they should look in their own backyards.

 

[NatachaHatawa]

I think what coaches are trying to address are the spiral sequences that are no longer in line with the music, and I totally agree. I don't care how high Sasha can lift her leg--if it is in line with the music.

Exactly. Spirals and step sequences don't always fit in with the program.
But the thing is, I'd really like to see two sequences, but skaters can choose what to put in them: steps, spirals, eagles....

 

[NatachaHatawa]

I totaly agree with sequences having to fit with the music. Ever since the CoP has existed we've been seeing skaters graded on the pure technical difficulty of them even if they looked awful.

 

[NatachaHatawa]

I am for anything that makes each skaters spiral sequence look different then each other. Right now they are all cookie cutters of each other.

Agreed! Most step sequences these days are just edge changes with the skaters waving their arms in all directions.

 

[NatachaHatawa]

I think that skaters should be given a global grade for spins as opposed to one grade for each spin. Sometimes one feels as if there are too many spins, especially if they're bad, but would anyone really want to see Stephane Lambiel do less spins??????????????
This way skaters who do awful spins don't do too many so don't bore us but still get sanctiones and skaters who do good spins can do more. that's one thing I don't like about the CoP: it favours mlore quantity than quality.

 

[silver.blades]

If you're going to give an overall grade for spins then you have to give an overall for jumps to. Otherwise you stop encouraging skaters to improve their spins and you have fewer who can do a decent one. Spins are already under valued. They're not easy and for some skaters they are more difficult than jumps. An overall score for all spins in a program just devalues them more.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Mafke - The trouble with the PCS scores are that they are extremely subjective, and do not lend themselves to agreements by judges. Judges are human and have their own tastes and cultures to enter the picture.

However, the steps themselves could be judged for variety in basics.

Joe

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Does the Tech Panel call these variations out? and I presume the judges then look for finesse. Not easy, and subjective.

Joe

 

[vlaurend]

I know I'd remove a spin at that level rather than a jump or step/spiral sequence. It take a lot of energy to complete a spin, sometimes more than a jump.

That's already planned for 2009 as well. The ISU Agenda calls for reducing elements by one step/spiral sequence and 1 spin (3 spins instead of 4), to allow more time for interpretation, choreography and moves in the field.

 

[gocaroline]

:scratch:Somehow I always feel it's the step/spiral sequence, spin, and spiral give more for interpretation and choreography then jumps.