Could my blade be twisting my boot?

[tstop4me]

I know what you mean, but these are Edea boots and the plugs would be so close to where the new holes would need to be, so they were worried that the plugs wouldn't hold and I'd end up with a large hole in the sole of the boot. If they were Jackson then they'd have done the plugs without any worry, but not with Edea.

OK. I have no first-hand experience plugging Edea. But I would recommend that you get confirmation, because it just doesn't sound right to me. You'll need to check with other techs [or with the US distributor (see below), although you're in Canada], since the tech you talked to won't do it, regardless of whether it can be done. Here's why. If you simply want to seal an old hole against water penetration, you don't need a permanent plug. Commonly for this purpose, techs will simply use a hammer to pound in a plug; alternatively, they will seal the hole with a filler, such as silicone compound.

The reason for a permanent plug is to allow you to re-drill and insert a screw in or near the plug (even if you are not changing the location of a hole, you may need to permanently plug it and re-drill if the hole is stripped or otherwise damaged). For a permanent plug, the plug is affixed with a suitable adhesive, such as epoxy. Properly done, the plug and the adhesive bond are as strong as, or stronger than, the native sole material.

Now, Edea sells specific carbon filler plugs: https://edeaskates.com/en/ice/accessories/tech/carbon-filler/. The instructions on the Edea website are a bit bizarre:

"The bar is specifically designed for Edea boots with a diameter of 2.5mm and 12mm in length. Simply tap the bar into the hole using a hammer. Once in place you can even drill close to the bar."

No mention of adhesive. If you were to follow these instructions, the plug would indeed not be a permanent plug. I don't know whether these instructions were intentional, or sloppy writing by a marketing guy instead of an engineer.

But here is a photo of the instructions on the Edea plugs themselves: https://skatesus.com/product/carbon-filler-plugs/. This is from the website of the US Edea distributor. If you zoom in on the photo, you will be able to read the installation instructions: they say to first apply adhesive. Here are additional instructions from the US distributor:

"The EDEA CARBON FILLER PLUGS are used to fill unused holes when mounting a new blade or repositioning an existing blade.

How to use the Carbon Filler Plugs
Apply adhesive (usually Marine Epoxy) to the Carbon Filler Plugs, then utilizing needle nose pliers to hold the Carbon Filler Plug, use a small hammer to tap them into the unused holes. The Carbon Filler Plugs are exactly the correct length for the EDEA Footbed After allowing the adhesive to harden, the new holes can be drilled with a 2.0mm (5/64ths”) drill bit. (If there is no hole interference for new hole locations, it is not necessary to fill the unused holes)."

Besides selling the plugs, the US distributor will also perform plug installation (https://skatesus.com/product/plug-old-mounting-holes-in-skating-boots/):

"SkatesUS.com will plug the necessary holes with EDEA Carbon Filler Plugs. SkatesUS.com will epoxy in the Carbon Filler Plugs and then sand the surfaces, both inside and outside, to provide a good mounting surface. This process usually requires at LEAST several days, due to the drying time of the epoxy glues and fillers. SkatesUS.com reserves the right to recommend that this process not be attempted if the Skating Boot soles are like swiss cheese or the Skating Boots are beyond their normal life of usefulness."

As I mentioned before, doing it right is a time-consuming process. At least from this description, it appears that this company has the right process in place (I don't know anyone who has used them; so this is not an endorsement of how good a job they actually do. But the process they describe is correct.)

So, after wading through all the above material, this is my critical question: Why go through all this if you cannot drill in or near the permanent plug in an Edea boot? And note again the comment above from the US distributor: (If there is no hole interference for new hole locations, it is not necessary to fill the unused holes)." Which I interpret to mean: You go through all this when your new hole is in or near your old hole. As Mr. Spock would say: "That's logical."

But if it turns out that the tech you spoke to is correct, that would be a good reason to avoid Edea boots.

 

[christy]

OK. I have no first-hand experience plugging Edea. But I would recommend that you get confirmation, because it just doesn't sound right to me. You'll need to check with other techs [or with the US distributor (see below), although you're in Canada], since the tech you talked to won't do it, regardless of whether it can be done. Here's why. If you simply want to seal an old hole against water penetration, you don't need a permanent plug. Commonly for this purpose, techs will simply use a hammer to pound in a plug; alternatively, they will seal the hole with a filler, such as silicone compound.

The reason for a permanent plug is to allow you to re-drill and insert a screw in or near the plug (even if you are not changing the location of a hole, you may need to permanently plug it and re-drill if the hole is stripped or otherwise damaged). For a permanent plug, the plug is affixed with a suitable adhesive, such as epoxy. Properly done, the plug and the adhesive bond are as strong as, or stronger than, the native sole material.

Now, Edea sells specific carbon filler plugs: https://edeaskates.com/en/ice/accessories/tech/carbon-filler/. The instructions on the Edea website are a bit bizarre:

"The bar is specifically designed for Edea boots with a diameter of 2.5mm and 12mm in length. Simply tap the bar into the hole using a hammer. Once in place you can even drill close to the bar."

No mention of adhesive. If you were to follow these instructions, the plug would indeed not be a permanent plug. I don't know whether these instructions were intentional, or sloppy writing by a marketing guy instead of an engineer.

But here is a photo of the instructions on the Edea plugs themselves: https://skatesus.com/product/carbon-filler-plugs/. This is from the website of the US Edea distributor. If you zoom in on the photo, you will be able to read the installation instructions: they say to first apply adhesive. Here are additional instructions from the US distributor:

"The EDEA CARBON FILLER PLUGS are used to fill unused holes when mounting a new blade or repositioning an existing blade.

How to use the Carbon Filler Plugs
Apply adhesive (usually Marine Epoxy) to the Carbon Filler Plugs, then utilizing needle nose pliers to hold the Carbon Filler Plug, use a small hammer to tap them into the unused holes. The Carbon Filler Plugs are exactly the correct length for the EDEA Footbed After allowing the adhesive to harden, the new holes can be drilled with a 2.0mm (5/64ths”) drill bit. (If there is no hole interference for new hole locations, it is not necessary to fill the unused holes)."

Besides selling the plugs, the US distributor will also perform plug installation (https://skatesus.com/product/plug-old-mounting-holes-in-skating-boots/):

"SkatesUS.com will plug the necessary holes with EDEA Carbon Filler Plugs. SkatesUS.com will epoxy in the Carbon Filler Plugs and then sand the surfaces, both inside and outside, to provide a good mounting surface. This process usually requires at LEAST several days, due to the drying time of the epoxy glues and fillers. SkatesUS.com reserves the right to recommend that this process not be attempted if the Skating Boot soles are like swiss cheese or the Skating Boots are beyond their normal life of usefulness."

As I mentioned before, doing it right is a time-consuming process. At least from this description, it appears that this company has the right process in place (I don't know anyone who has used them; so this is not an endorsement of how good a job they actually do. But the process they describe is correct.)

So, after wading through all the above material, this is my critical question: Why go through all this if you cannot drill in or near the permanent plug in an Edea boot? And note again the comment above from the US distributor: (If there is no hole interference for new hole locations, it is not necessary to fill the unused holes)." Which I interpret to mean: You go through all this when your new hole is in or near your old hole. As Mr. Spock would say: "That's logical."

But if it turns out that the tech you spoke to is correct, that would be a good reason to avoid Edea boots.

My understanding is that the US distributor covers Canada too, however the cost of mailing the boots to them would be very expensive, and really not worth doing.
I think the other thing to consider is that the boot IS twisted, and no matter how well the blade is now placed there is no guarantee that putting it into the correct position would / could untwist the boot so the process could cost a lot of money and may not fix the twisted boot prolbem, therefore tt's better to invest that money into replacing the boot.

 

[Trensharo]

Make sure your blade isn't mounted crooked [for you], as well. That can make things feel twisted.

 

[christy]

I spoke to a couple of skate techs about plugging the holes in Edea soles and remounting blades, as I was interested to get more opinions. They said they didn't plug holes, just re-used current or drilled new. I asked why not plug the holes and one said it's not necessary because they're covered by the sole plate of the blade, and the other said similar and added that it was a long process for no benefit.
I'd love to know if anyone has had Edea soles plugged?

Make sure your blade isn't mounted crooked [for you], as well. That can make things feel twisted.

They're mounted in a very odd position, sort of offset to the inside. According to the skate tech who mounted them it was to compensate for pronation, but I've always been fairly sure I don't pronate and I confirmed that with my ski tech a few weeks ago.

 

[MCsAngel2]

I think plugging Edea holes is particularly problematic, in that the heel is honeycombed and not solid, and the soles are thinner than the average.

I just can't believe the tech that mounted the new different blades in the previous holes. That's a massive error for something so basic. That person should be fired, because that boot is ruined now.

 

[christy]

I think plugging Edea holes is particularly problematic, in that the heel is honeycombed and not solid, and the soles are thinner than the average.

I just can't believe the tech that mounted the new different blades in the previous holes. That's a massive error for something so basic. That person should be fired, because that boot is ruined now.

I don't see an issue if it's an identical blade, with the same sole plate pattern, but this was a different blade with a different pattern where the screws were forced into the original holes.

 

[MCsAngel2]

I don't see an issue if it's an identical blade, with the same sole plate pattern, but this was a different blade with a different pattern where the screws were forced into the original holes.

Yes, I was essentially agreeing with you. It's just that it's kind of an issue with Edea regardless...because you can't just screw in the plates just anywhere, it has to be in a spot in the heel that has room for the screw. The tech clearly wasn't paying attention and didn't see the pattern was different, and just wanted to use the holes he knew worked. But then he somehow did the other one correctly? Again, major, major screw up and the shop should be notified.

 

[christy]

Yes, I was essentially agreeing with you. It's just that it's kind of an issue with Edea regardless...because you can't just screw in the plates just anywhere, it has to be in a spot in the heel that has room for the screw. The tech clearly wasn't paying attention and didn't see the pattern was different, and just wanted to use the holes he knew worked. But then he somehow did the other one correctly? Again, major, major screw up and the shop should be notified.

That's what is so strange. The other boot had new holes made for the new blade, so one boot was done correctly and the other wasn't.