- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
Your comments.
Ladies LP from TV
- Thread starter Joesitz (RIP)
- Start date
Arakawa: Even though she ended up third overall, this is the first time since Worlds '04 that I saw sparks and more than just sparks of Champion Shizza. Great to see! Hope her previous performances were due to seemingly unending travel and jet lag.
Asada: Having been given a last moment repreve from the firing squad for not liking Mao Asada after her short (Mean Ol' Rgirl shot the interviewer for taking her cigarette), Rgirl finds Asada much more likable, in fact likable indeed, after her "Nutcracker" LP, in terms of not only her skating, but also the program and Asada's countenance on the ice. A tiny "Carmen" swinging her pony tail while skating coyly past the judges was too "Lolita" for my taste, plus I think "Carmen" made Mao seem out of her depth, while "Nutcracker" showed she belongs right where she is--with the big girls! And while Lolita is just about my favorite novel, even I wouldn't choreograph it for a competitive figure skater. OTOH, having Asada skate right before Shizza showed more of her technical and presentational weaknesses, not that there are many. If she stays healthy and doesn't grow out of order, watch out!
Irina: Not as squeaky clean as her SP, but I like the choreography for this LP better than last year's. She was awfully tired at the end, but man, could you see the smog build up in the arena? I grew up in Phoenix and I thought that was bad, especially during temperature inversions. Bejieng sure has a tall order to clean up it's air quality by 2008 for the Olympics.
Questions: Peter Carruthers, while explaining the NJS, said there is "a technical panel and a program components panel." Later on, Susie Wynne referred to "the technical panel." I know separating the tech and PC judges into two panels was discussed last year, but has it been implemented?
Am also glad they used the email from the person asking about whether the judges would start taking off points for flutzes. I think they should have done so from the beginning and my guess is they will start next year. I know more than a few ladies who will be shaking in their boots if they do. Maybe they'll get lucky and shake to an outside edge just before their Lutzes.
Rgirl
Asada: Having been given a last moment repreve from the firing squad for not liking Mao Asada after her short (Mean Ol' Rgirl shot the interviewer for taking her cigarette), Rgirl finds Asada much more likable, in fact likable indeed, after her "Nutcracker" LP, in terms of not only her skating, but also the program and Asada's countenance on the ice. A tiny "Carmen" swinging her pony tail while skating coyly past the judges was too "Lolita" for my taste, plus I think "Carmen" made Mao seem out of her depth, while "Nutcracker" showed she belongs right where she is--with the big girls! And while Lolita is just about my favorite novel, even I wouldn't choreograph it for a competitive figure skater. OTOH, having Asada skate right before Shizza showed more of her technical and presentational weaknesses, not that there are many. If she stays healthy and doesn't grow out of order, watch out!
Irina: Not as squeaky clean as her SP, but I like the choreography for this LP better than last year's. She was awfully tired at the end, but man, could you see the smog build up in the arena? I grew up in Phoenix and I thought that was bad, especially during temperature inversions. Bejieng sure has a tall order to clean up it's air quality by 2008 for the Olympics.
Questions: Peter Carruthers, while explaining the NJS, said there is "a technical panel and a program components panel." Later on, Susie Wynne referred to "the technical panel." I know separating the tech and PC judges into two panels was discussed last year, but has it been implemented?
Am also glad they used the email from the person asking about whether the judges would start taking off points for flutzes. I think they should have done so from the beginning and my guess is they will start next year. I know more than a few ladies who will be shaking in their boots if they do. Maybe they'll get lucky and shake to an outside edge just before their Lutzes.
Rgirl
Last edited:
Rgirl said:
Watching Shizuka, my thought was Shiz for gold in Turino. Loved the program, loved the costume, and thought Shizuka did an amazing job ... with a few things to clean up. My new favorite move ever is the move she did where she turned her face to the shy and leaned back ... can't provide more detail ... noticed it while she did it, then was even more impressed when they slow-moed it. Looked so hard, but she was so calm.
I live in LA (for the time being) which has the distinction of winning the most recent (2004?) smog award, but it was nothing compared to Beijing. I was there in the summer of 2004 and have never been in such disgusting pollution. Kind of funny that the city looked clean, they even had people to sweep up puddles after the rain, but the air quality was terrible. I'd come in at the end of the day and feel like I had a layer of grime all over me. It wasn't even particularly hot while I was there. Yeach.
Mao was cute (like her better than Kimmie), but the contrast between her and Arakawa was striking.
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
If they do that, they'll need to deduct for the lips as well, and make the lippers learn to take off on the inside edge. During the slo mo of Sokolova in SA, she was practically bending over her outside ankle in her 3F take-off. Not that she's the only lipper, but the one that was vivid after I watched four Tivo-ed programs yesterday.Rgirl said:
Excellent point as usual, Hockeyfan. While the Russians seem to have superb Lutzes, they tend to lip. Americans, as per leftover Cold War politics, seem to do the opposite.hockeyfan228 said:
HF, do you know anything about the remark Carruthers made about their being two separate judging panels, one for technical and one for component elements?
Rgirl
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2003
Rgirl said:
Rgirl, I'm 99% sure Peter was refering to the technical panel, which includes the technical caller (identifies the element and level) v. the judges which do both the GOE on all elements and the PCS. No change from previous years that I know of. I still think it would be a good idea!!
DG
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
I haven't watched my tapes yet, but I like the above two points. I would love to see a Technical Panel and a PCS Panel. there should be two different judgeship tests for these. It could also do away with that questionable Caller thing.Rgirl said:
(I've never been a fan of Paul Wylie but his eyes catch a lot of the technical moves in programs. He'd make a good technical judge.)
Yes, yes, Rgirl. The almighty flutz should be done away with. It is not a lutz and never will be. It should be considered a flip and watch out for the zayak rule. In spite of the ladies shaking, it will force them to learn to execute a real lutz. They are capable of that.
Joe
- Joined
- Oct 27, 2004
Irina is prime and ready to go. That's all I have to say
You go girl!!!!!!!!
I also love her smile
You go girl!!!!!!!!
I also love her smile
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2003
Irina is great, but I liked last year's program better.
I was impressed with Shizuka far more than with Asada. Arakawa's skating has maturity and presentation. I only wish she held that Ina Bauer longer - she entered the beautiful position, and next second it seemed she was back up.
Also liked Liashenko's skate a lot. I think the program is very well suited to her.
I was impressed with Shizuka far more than with Asada. Arakawa's skating has maturity and presentation. I only wish she held that Ina Bauer longer - she entered the beautiful position, and next second it seemed she was back up.
Also liked Liashenko's skate a lot. I think the program is very well suited to her.
I thought Shizuka was great... perhaps she skates better when her hair is tied up in a bun, ala Dortmund 2004? Loose hair = loose skating I actually think that her body line appears much better when her hair (as beautiful as it is) isn't flying all over the place.
On another note, just saw Yan Liu's LP from CCTV. Wow, seven triples and what beautiful, uncomplicated skating! Too bad CoP doesn't seem to be doing her any favors...
I actually think that her body line appears much better when her hair (as beautiful as it is) isn't flying all over the place.On another note, just saw Yan Liu's LP from CCTV. Wow, seven triples and what beautiful, uncomplicated skating! Too bad CoP doesn't seem to be doing her any favors...
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
Dam my VCR bummed out after the commericals folloiwng Mao.
Well, Mao was like a kitten and very playful and with all that high calibre tech I can only reiterate my arguable early prediction of her 2010 Oly Gold. But there is also the 2006 Worlds and with that Korean girl and Alissa, it should be a memorable time for figure skating.
Don't go away if Slutskaya, Cohen and Kwan disappear after Torino.
Joe
Well, Mao was like a kitten and very playful and with all that high calibre tech I can only reiterate my arguable early prediction of her 2010 Oly Gold. But there is also the 2006 Worlds and with that Korean girl and Alissa, it should be a memorable time for figure skating.
Don't go away if Slutskaya, Cohen and Kwan disappear after Torino.
Joe
My Opinion
For my money, Shizuka was first rate and skated a beautiful program. Irina had a slight edge technically, but only because of her spins, presentation wise, she was no match for Shizuka. Under the old 6.0 I think Shizuka would have won the LP. Mao was great but lacked command of the ice, which Shizuka had all over her. Her age and lack of experience shows. She is also tiny. Let's see how she does after she grows a little. Irina's LP was not as good as her SP, and I hated her SP music, which according to Paul Wylie, Michelle is also skating to. Hopefully, different cuts.
For my money, Shizuka was first rate and skated a beautiful program. Irina had a slight edge technically, but only because of her spins, presentation wise, she was no match for Shizuka. Under the old 6.0 I think Shizuka would have won the LP. Mao was great but lacked command of the ice, which Shizuka had all over her. Her age and lack of experience shows. She is also tiny. Let's see how she does after she grows a little. Irina's LP was not as good as her SP, and I hated her SP music, which according to Paul Wylie, Michelle is also skating to. Hopefully, different cuts.
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2003
kyla2 said:
I love Shiz, but she did not skate "up" to the tecnical content that her program should have had, and was probably planned. Irina's technical content bested Shiz by approx. 6 points just in base value. Shiz needs to work on fully rotating her jumps, and including the max number of jump combos or sequences before she can contend with Irina. But I hope she does, because I love her style. But style alone (absent equivalent content) isn't going to cut it, I don't think.
DG
Thanks, Doggygirl! Another shining moment of factual clarity from Peter the Dink.Doggygirl said:
Joe--ITA with you re taking points off for flutzes as well as lips, which I think either Gkelly or Hockeyfan reminded me of--taking off for lips, too, that is. And that Paul Wylie catches a lot of great technical intricacies, plus I like his passionate involvement while still managing to stay objective--or at least seem as objective as possible. Love how he analyzes why a jump went wrong.:agree:
Also agree that a technical judging panel and a component judging panel would be a big improvement both for accuracy of judging and (I hope!) less possibility of successful cheating. I know this is the wrong thread, but so much rides on the tech caller! That one person can lose or gain a skater a lot of points depending on whether they ratify jumps as triples or quads, or downgrade them. Thanks for the feedback.
Rgirl
I loved Shizuka's program and it was so nice to see her "in the moment"...I love her style and presentation. ITA that she should hold her exquisite Ina Bauer position longer, it's simply stunning!
Mao, wow! She will be something! Well, she already is something, but add in maturity and command over the ice and she will be a knock out!
I know Irina's program is full of tech. difficulty, it just did nothing for me. She never seems to be one with the music...she will be very difficult to beat this year.
eliza88
PS. I agree Joe, skating without Michelle, Sasha, and Irina will still be very exciting (Mao, Alissa, Kimmie...always something to look forward too!)
Mao, wow! She will be something! Well, she already is something, but add in maturity and command over the ice and she will be a knock out!
I know Irina's program is full of tech. difficulty, it just did nothing for me. She never seems to be one with the music...she will be very difficult to beat this year.
eliza88
PS. I agree Joe, skating without Michelle, Sasha, and Irina will still be very exciting (Mao, Alissa, Kimmie...always something to look forward too!)
Doggygirl
I still think Shizuka had the better program overall and under 6.0 I think she would have won the LP. NOTE to everyone, I did not say the gold, just the LP. Irina's jumps had poor run out and some were wonky. That counted under 6.0. It should count now, but I see no evidence of that.
I still think Shizuka had the better program overall and under 6.0 I think she would have won the LP. NOTE to everyone, I did not say the gold, just the LP. Irina's jumps had poor run out and some were wonky. That counted under 6.0. It should count now, but I see no evidence of that.
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2003
Both Irina and Shizuka had negative GoE on 2 jumps. Irina had -1.0 on the triple loop and -0.7 on the double axel (both of which got extra credit for being in the second half of the program. Shizuka had -0.6 on triple salchow/ double toe combo, and -0.3 on the double loop.
Thanks for posting those GOE numbers, Pitchka. Of course opinions are great, but it's also nice, IMO, that someone examines the Detailed Results, which make my lazy butt go cross-eyed. Whether we agree with the judges or not, I like having the point of reference.Ptichka said:
Rgirl
Just saw the competition on CBC (Canadian) and wanted to add my comments.
I finally got the opportunity to see Yan Liu - I loved her. Beautiful skater. For me it was the best performance of the night. She has such musicality, beautiful flow, solid elements and wonderful presence. One of my new favorites.
Onto the competition for the medals.... Finally got a look at Slutskaya and she is skating better than I've ever seen her. I don't, however, get the judges' enormous preference for her. I find she still has the same artistic issues she's had for years, which is one reason I've never been a huge fan even though I can appreciate her technical proficiency (her jumps were gorgeous). Add to that the fact that her program is a long Beilmann Fest and I admit I'm hoping someone can beat her at the Olympics. I don't have a problem with the Beilmann per se, I just find that it is being egregiously overused to gain marks, and not just by Slutskaya, though looking at her program is a case in point. Beilmann spins, Beilman spirals, random Bielmann holds.... And the fact that several of the Beilmann positions Slutskaya hits are awkward and ugly and I find myself wishing they'd tone back on the Beilmann. That said, I think her music choice this year suits her better than almost any other program I've seen her do, though she still lacks the ability to really relate to it.
Arakawa - I thought she looked pretty good. Some good material and her maturity really shines.
Asada - A great up and comer, but as others have said, her skating does still have a juniorish quality. Her cutesy little girl program doesn't really help to add to a mature look. It looked to me like she seriously pre-roted several of her jumps, but the judges don't appear to have noticed. Loved her one-handed Beilmann - a beautiful position. Needs to learn how to connect to her music, but a very graceful skater with tons of potential.
I finally got the opportunity to see Yan Liu - I loved her. Beautiful skater. For me it was the best performance of the night. She has such musicality, beautiful flow, solid elements and wonderful presence. One of my new favorites.
Onto the competition for the medals.... Finally got a look at Slutskaya and she is skating better than I've ever seen her. I don't, however, get the judges' enormous preference for her. I find she still has the same artistic issues she's had for years, which is one reason I've never been a huge fan even though I can appreciate her technical proficiency (her jumps were gorgeous). Add to that the fact that her program is a long Beilmann Fest and I admit I'm hoping someone can beat her at the Olympics. I don't have a problem with the Beilmann per se, I just find that it is being egregiously overused to gain marks, and not just by Slutskaya, though looking at her program is a case in point. Beilmann spins, Beilman spirals, random Bielmann holds.... And the fact that several of the Beilmann positions Slutskaya hits are awkward and ugly and I find myself wishing they'd tone back on the Beilmann. That said, I think her music choice this year suits her better than almost any other program I've seen her do, though she still lacks the ability to really relate to it.
Arakawa - I thought she looked pretty good. Some good material and her maturity really shines.
Asada - A great up and comer, but as others have said, her skating does still have a juniorish quality. Her cutesy little girl program doesn't really help to add to a mature look. It looked to me like she seriously pre-roted several of her jumps, but the judges don't appear to have noticed. Loved her one-handed Beilmann - a beautiful position. Needs to learn how to connect to her music, but a very graceful skater with tons of potential.
