Need experienced perspectives on skate suggestions...

[emeraldumbra]

Hi there all! I'm an adult skater (36 yo) living in the Pacific Northwest. I grew up watching figure skating with my mom, but it never dawned on me to try it myself until about six months ago, and I fell in love immediately. I'm 5'2" and about 160 lbs. I have narrow to medium width feet with tapered toes, medium to high arches. I also have weak ankles; I broke both of them as a child, and I've repeatedly twisted and sprained them from then on into my adulthood. They roll easily. I know this is going to be a challenge; given my age and this particular issue, I'm more interested in ice dance and synchro and don't plan to learn jumps above perhaps a few singles for fun. I'm starting Adult 5 - backwards edges, crossovers, three-turns (which I've started working on a bit), swing rolls, two-foot spin. I'm planning to also take an open Learn to Synchro class offered in my area and starting private lessons sometime between now and the end of the of the year.

I started taking LTS lessons at my local ice rink; for my first pair of skates I purchased a pair of Jackson Artistes from Amazon (I know, I know). I bought my street size, a size 7.5 C. (At the time, I mistakenly thought C was the regular/medium width designation.) Those were great for the first couple months. They didn't take me that long to break in and I originally felt quite supported in them. In the last few weeks I've noticed that the Artistes have become less supportive in my ankles; I feel trepidation when leaning into my edges. Furthermore, I started feeling pain and pressure on the inside of my feet near arches - most prominently on my right foot, which is my stronger side. Given that I'd decided this was for me and I wanted to continue, I decided to head to my local pro shop to get fitted properly and get some more supportive skates. I told them all the stuff I told y'all here.

They put me into an 8 C, which I think will probably too wide (they didn't measure the circumference of my foot, just went off my current boot size, and they didn't have any boots in my size in the store for me to try on). They initially recommended the Jackson Freestyle, which I guessed they might. But I guess Jackson was out of stock, so they suggested either the Elle or the Flex. I was kind of surprised given my weight and age - especially because I specifically wanted ankle support and those were both less supportive than the Freestyle - but I chose the Flex Fusion, after which she recommended the Matrix Legacy blade (excited, because I got to order it in lilac!)

Given that I'm not really planning on doing a ton of jumping - and any jumping is a ways off for me anyway - the suggestion makes sense, but wanted to get the takes here. I know often this forum recommends adults getting stiffer boots because of size and weight. The Flex is rated for the level I'm about to go into, but I'm nervous it won't be stiff enough to give me the ankle support I want/need.

 

[WednesdayMarch]

Hi there all! I'm an adult skater (36 yo) living in the Pacific Northwest. I grew up watching figure skating with my mom, but it never dawned on me to try it myself until about six months ago, and I fell in love immediately. I'm 5'2" and about 160 lbs. I have narrow to medium width feet with tapered toes, medium to high arches. I also have weak ankles; I broke both of them as a child, and I've repeatedly twisted and sprained them from then on into my adulthood. They roll easily. I know this is going to be a challenge; given my age and this particular issue, I'm more interested in ice dance and synchro and don't plan to learn jumps above perhaps a few singles for fun. I'm starting Adult 5 - backwards edges, crossovers, three-turns (which I've started working on a bit), swing rolls, two-foot spin. I'm planning to also take an open Learn to Synchro class offered in my area and starting private lessons sometime between now and the end of the of the year.

I started taking LTS lessons at my local ice rink; for my first pair of skates I purchased a pair of Jackson Artistes from Amazon (I know, I know). I bought my street size, a size 7.5 C. (At the time, I mistakenly thought C was the regular/medium width designation.) Those were great for the first couple months. They didn't take me that long to break in and I originally felt quite supported in them. In the last few weeks I've noticed that the Artistes have become less supportive in my ankles; I feel trepidation when leaning into my edges. Furthermore, I started feeling pain and pressure on the inside of my feet near arches - most prominently on my right foot, which is my stronger side. Given that I'd decided this was for me and I wanted to continue, I decided to head to my local pro shop to get fitted properly and get some more supportive skates. I told them all the stuff I told y'all here.

They put me into an 8 C, which I think will probably too wide (they didn't measure the circumference of my foot, just went off my current boot size, and they didn't have any boots in my size in the store for me to try on). They initially recommended the Jackson Freestyle, which I guessed they might. But I guess Jackson was out of stock, so they suggested either the Elle or the Flex. I was kind of surprised given my weight and age - especially because I specifically wanted ankle support and those were both less supportive than the Freestyle - but I chose the Flex Fusion, after which she recommended the Matrix Legacy blade (excited, because I got to order it in lilac!)

Given that I'm not really planning on doing a ton of jumping - and any jumping is a ways off for me anyway - the suggestion makes sense, but wanted to get the takes here. I know often this forum recommends adults getting stiffer boots because of size and weight. The Flex is rated for the level I'm about to go into, but I'm nervous it won't be stiff enough to give me the ankle support I want/need.

They put you in a boot that is bigger than your street size?! I would be cancelling any orders and running - not walking - to a different fitter! For a start, I don't think I'd be putting you in anything under a Freestyle (which is massively popular with adults at my rink and seems to be doing the job) or maybe even a Debut.

Blade-wise, Coronation Ace or MK Professional are way more suitable for you than Matrix Legacy. You've been way oversold in that department!

 

[Query]

To expand upon what WednesdayMarch said, most skaters end up with skate sizes that are smaller than normal shoe sizes. I think proper fit is even more important than stiffness.

If you can, you might benefit from going to the best pro shop that you can get to (it isn't uncommon for skaters to drive a few hours or more each way, or in a few cases, fly to another country) for the best possible fitting, and order skates from them, and also have them make the final adjustments. Some people even travel to the factory store, or use the traveling fitters some boot makers hire to go around to competitions for fittings. And some people do much better in full custom boots, fit by the best possible fitter.

You should ask around the best skaters and coaches at the rink who they went to. Based on what you say, I bet it wasn't the local rink shop.

I used to have very bad ankles. I would re-injure them almost every weekend on hiking trips. What I needed most was to give them a rest, and wear snug ankle-supportive shoes. I also had to learn to wrap my ankles to protect them BEFORE the injury, not after. Eventually, they got better, and I don't have the problem anymore. Though I still choose high top sneakers, even though they cost more. And I have to visit many stores to find ones that are snug on me.

If you already bought the oversized new skates, and the store won't take them back, you can make them fit somewhat better by adding (or replacing) the insoles, and adding tape underneath (cloth athletic tape is durable and is skin safe; also add moleskin to the sides) until you have a snug fit all over. If you spend enough time at it (and maybe stretch the tightest spots) you can get a nearly perfect fit, though the result is heavier than a boot that fits you in the first place. I hope they at least heat molded them.

BTW, skates break down fast if they don't fit right, or you don't tie tight enough. It's not at all uncommon to see rental boots break down in an hour or less. Your skates are above that level, so it might take a few days or even weeks, but it is still a major potential issue.

But if the store takes the new ones back, to a limited extent, you can temporally do the same thing to your old skates, tie them very tightly, and maybe wrap them with a few layers of duct tape after you tie them. (Wrap the first layer of tape sticky side out, so you can strip or cut them off after you skate.) The tape won't stiffen them for long - maybe just a few days if they are too far gone. and you need to strip and maybe cut the tape off every time you skate. You can also try wearing thicker socks, though that can lead to slippage, especially if you don't tie tight enough.

Also - you could try to do the same things with all your other shoes (and chose high top shoes, that cover the ankle), so you don't injure yourself wearing them. Hopefully, that will give your ankles time to heal.

If you have good health insurance, you might see a good sports podiatrist, to see if there is an underlying medical condition that goes beyond supportive shoes and boots.

BTW, I'm not an expert, just someone who had problems in the past.

 

[emeraldumbra]

Thank you both for your replies! This was just yesterday, not even 24 hours yet, so I don't have the boots yet and could still cancel the order. Definitely no heat molding or anything done yet. I'd read that skate sizes usually came in smaller than street sizes, so I was really surprised by the recommendation, which is why I asked here. I was also expecting a recommendation of the Freestyle or the Debut + Coronation Ace based on what I've read. Glad I did some reading so I could feel like something was amiss!

I was afraid I might have to drive - the next best skate shops near me are both 3 hours away. Fortunately, though, they are both in nice vacation cities, so could definitely do a long weekend in one of them. I'll ask my coaches once our classes start again next week, or email the head of coaching at the rink.

 

[supersharp]

I agree with WednesdayMarch, run away! Anything lower than a Freestyle is going to break down too fast and be a waste of your money.

Some people have flexible feet that spread out when they have weight on them when being measured on a flat measuring board, so your feet may have looked like an 8 if you stood on a measuring board... but when your arches are supported inside the shoe or boot, your foot will be shorter and the measured size will be too long. That's why the fitter would then want to have you try on an actual boot. But if you are already wearing a Jackson 7.5 and it's too big, it makes zero sense to conclude that you need a bigger boot. Plus the street shoe size being a 7.5... this is clearly "a person that works at a shop" not an actual skate fitter.

If you don't already wear bunga pads, sometimes you can temporarily get a bit more support by adding an ankle sleeve. The sleeve doesn't add support, but it makes the ankle of the boot wrap to a slightly different position, so the boot is flexing in a newer, less broken-down place. That might buy you some time while you are running to safety.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

They put you in a boot that is bigger than your street size?! I would be cancelling any orders and running - not walking - to a different fitter! For a start, I don't think I'd be putting you in anything under a Freestyle (which is massively popular with adults at my rink and seems to be doing the job) or maybe even a Debut.

Blade-wise, Coronation Ace or MK Professional are way more suitable for you than Matrix Legacy. You've been way oversold in that department!

All of this and then some! OP, the boots they sold you and suggested are no way stiff enough for you. With your height/weight you will need nothing lower rated than the Premiere or the Synergy Elite. The rest aren't going to maintain stiffness to properly support you for even a decent amount of time.

Narrow to med width feet immediately say to me: Look into Riedell or Graf, even Risport. I can help with suggestions if you'd like and if you let us know just about where you are located, we could suggest good pro fitters in your area.

And I agree with WM that you do not need a blade higher than MK Pro or JW Coro Ace. If you are going into synchro or dance as your focus you're going to eventually want to get a dance blade, not now but down the road.

Good luck!

BTW: IF you need to tape your boots use clear packing tape. Also, look into elastic braces that slip over your ankles to wear in your boots to help your ankle issues. Btw: If you have properly supportive boots, you are doing your ankles a world of good. I've had multiple ankle issues in my career and my Ortho docs/Podiatrists told me the best thing I can do for my ankles is have my skate boots on.
A brace like this.

 

[WednesdayMarch]

Thank you both for your replies! This was just yesterday, not even 24 hours yet, so I don't have the boots yet and could still cancel the order. Definitely no heat molding or anything done yet. I'd read that skate sizes usually came in smaller than street sizes, so I was really surprised by the recommendation, which is why I asked here. I was also expecting a recommendation of the Freestyle or the Debut + Coronation Ace based on what I've read. Glad I did some reading so I could feel like something was amiss!

I was afraid I might have to drive - the next best skate shops near me are both 3 hours away. Fortunately, though, they are both in nice vacation cities, so could definitely do a long weekend in one of them. I'll ask my coaches once our classes start again next week, or email the head of coaching at the rink.

Cancel the order! CANCEL THE ORDER! PLEASE!

It's quite normal to have to travel for a good fitter. I'm in the UK but the nearest fitter is 5 hours away from my home in Cornwall. Luckily my family house is less than 12 miles from that fitter, so I don't have to spend money on accommodation, but the fuel bill is significant. It's still worth it. Every penny.

 

[emeraldumbra]

Thanks for your thoughts everybody! I was traveling for a little bit so didn't get back to respond to this thread.

I called the shop to cancel the order, and even though they told me we could adjust on the front end, now they're giving me a little bit of a hard time with canceling it. However, the person I talked to when I went to cancel was not the same person that I ordered from and she didn't even check the status of my order - she gave me the email of their more experienced fitter, Rick. He's the guy that they recommend to their more pro/competitive skaters; I just didn't think I needed to go to him because I was a beginner. So I emailed him explaining what I explained here and telling them I'm looking for a more supportive boot and asking to cancel the order or at least do an exchange.

Also, I only paid a deposit on the skates, not the full price. The deposit was $300, which is enough to almost cover the blades, so I guess worst case scenario I have a pair of really nice blades? I dunno. If they make me take the whole thing I can probably sell the Flex since they will be brand brand new. But I don't know why they wouldn't take it back, since they haven't even received the skates and nobody has even tried them on yet, let alone heat molded or anything else.

I put my boots on again today to pay more attention to the sizing and fit. When standing, my big toe brushes the tip of my boot if I move it up and down; when I do a knee bend, they obviously pull back a bit from the tip. My right foot is a bit bigger than my left - on the left, the big toe barely brushes the tip. I also measured my own foot; it's 9 5/8", which according to Jackson's size chart is a 7. I also measured the circumference of the ball of my foot and got 8 1/2", which would be a B width for the 7 and between an A and a B for 7.5 (Here: https://figureskatingstore.com/jackson-sizing-chart/). An 8, especially an 8 C, just feels like it'll be way too big. However - I'm not a professional!

I also talked to some skaters in my area for recommendations of a better place to go! I live in the Seattle, WA metro area, so if you all have recommendations I would love to hear them. Some folks said Highland Ice Arena (which is the place I went to but with the more experienced fitter, Rick) and some folks said go to Vancouver (Cyclone Taylor Figure Skating came up the most), which is about a 2.5-3 hour drive, so we may plan a weekend trip up there.

And lastly, I ordered the ankle support brace that Ic3Rabbit recommended and an arch support insole for my current boots to get a little more wear out of them. I have plenty of clear packing tape

I would love to hear other boot recommendations! Before all this I wanted to try on the Jackson Freestyle and/or Debut, the Risport RF3 Pro and/or Royal Pro, and the Riedell Motion 255.

thank you all again!

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Thanks for your thoughts everybody! I was traveling for a little bit so didn't get back to respond to this thread.

I called the shop to cancel the order, and even though they told me we could adjust on the front end, now they're giving me a little bit of a hard time with canceling it. However, the person I talked to when I went to cancel was not the same person that I ordered from and she didn't even check the status of my order - she gave me the email of their more experienced fitter, Rick. He's the guy that they recommend to their more pro/competitive skaters; I just didn't think I needed to go to him because I was a beginner. So I emailed him explaining what I explained here and telling them I'm looking for a more supportive boot and asking to cancel the order or at least do an exchange.

Also, I only paid a deposit on the skates, not the full price. The deposit was $300, which is enough to almost cover the blades, so I guess worst case scenario I have a pair of really nice blades? I dunno. If they make me take the whole thing I can probably sell the Flex since they will be brand brand new. But I don't know why they wouldn't take it back, since they haven't even received the skates and nobody has even tried them on yet, let alone heat molded or anything else.

I put my boots on again today to pay more attention to the sizing and fit. When standing, my big toe brushes the tip of my boot if I move it up and down; when I do a knee bend, they obviously pull back a bit from the tip. My right foot is a bit bigger than my left - on the left, the big toe barely brushes the tip. I also measured my own foot; it's 9 5/8", which according to Jackson's size chart is a 7. I also measured the circumference of the ball of my foot and got 8 1/2", which would be a B width for the 7 and between an A and a B for 7.5 (Here: https://figureskatingstore.com/jackson-sizing-chart/). An 8, especially an 8 C, just feels like it'll be way too big. However - I'm not a professional!

I also talked to some skaters in my area for recommendations of a better place to go! I live in the Seattle, WA metro area, so if you all have recommendations I would love to hear them. Some folks said Highland Ice Arena (which is the place I went to but with the more experienced fitter, Rick) and some folks said go to Vancouver (Cyclone Taylor Figure Skating came up the most), which is about a 2.5-3 hour drive, so we may plan a weekend trip up there.

And lastly, I ordered the ankle support brace that Ic3Rabbit recommended and an arch support insole for my current boots to get a little more wear out of them. I have plenty of clear packing tape

I would love to hear other boot recommendations! Before all this I wanted to try on the Jackson Freestyle and/or Debut, the Risport RF3 Pro and/or Royal Pro, and the Riedell Motion 255.

thank you all again!

Hello again!
With where you are located my first choice would be Cyclone Taylor shop in Vancouver and their pro there (Find out if Giovanni is still there b/c he was always the best).
Otherwise, the boot styles you listed seem all in the realm of what I would recommend for you. Good luck!

 

[2sk8]

I also talked to some skaters in my area for recommendations of a better place to go! I live in the Seattle, WA metro area, so if you all have recommendations I would love to hear them. Some folks said Highland Ice Arena (which is the place I went to but with the more experienced fitter, Rick) and some folks said go to Vancouver (Cyclone Taylor Figure Skating came up the most), which is about a 2.5-3 hour drive, so we may plan a weekend trip up there.

I have worked with a skating professional in the Seattle area (coaches at a Sno King rink) for a few years who fits skates and previously had a pro shop in California. If you want to be properly fitted closer to home, feel free to PM me and I can provide the contact information for him. He can also order the skates for you.

I have heard a number of stories like yours about poor fitting in shops in the Seattle area - just too foucsed on hockey and no real knowledge of figure skates.

 

[MCsAngel2]

If your street shoe size is 7.5, I would expect your correct Jackson size to be a 6.5, maybe even a 6 based on what you wrote (BTW it's extremely difficult to measure your own feet accurately due to the way your weight shifts when you bend over, you need someone else to do it for you.). So an 8 would be massively too big for you. Run away from any fitter who doesn't even measure your feet for length! They should be measuring for width as well - many adults have feet that have spread with age and require a wider width than regular. You will see many stories of adults getting boots that are too long in length because their feet weren't measured for width, and inexperienced fitters will just try larger and larger sizes in regular width until they find a fit.

 

[MCsAngel2]

Also, you need to be careful with the Matrix Legacy blades. They are two part blades (the actual blade part is set in the chassis, which is the lilac part), and not all skate sharpeners will have equipment that can hold blades like that. Aside from my other feelings on Ultima blades, at your level you would have been much better off with MK Professionals or Coronation Aces.