Post National Chat

[NanaPat]

It's good that they announced the Junior Worlds assignments together with the 4CC ones. Otherwise there would be grumbling about skaters who were passed over for 4CC but given Junior Worlds instead.

 

[Trillium]

Ted spoiled it... It will be in Laval next year

That is terrific news. I will definitely be there.

 

[Trillium]

Agree absolutely about walking or public transit to the venue. Last year, my daughter and I planned to go to Junior Worlds in Calgary, but quickly changed our plans in favor of 4CC when it was moved to Colorado Springs. It was partly based on the event, but more on the Calgary location being in the middle of nowhere, so we would have to rent a car or I would have to drive to Calgary.

We love events at Doug Mitchell in Vancouver because of the convenient location. We have also been to Skate Canada in Kelowna; no reasonable hotels near the rink, but I can easily drive there, and I did make one trip from the hotel to the rink via public transit.

I actually considered going to nationals this year by myself, but didn't because of the rink location.

Agree completely. I had planned to go to Junior Worlds last year but changed my mind when I looked at the logistics. This year, on a whim, I went to Nationals. Calgary in winter is not a good location if the arena is not downtown within walking distance of hotels and restaurants. I much prefer Thunderbird in Vancouver for accessibility.

 

[4everchan]

Agree completely. I had planned to go to Junior Worlds last year but changed my mind when I looked at the logistics. This year, on a whim, I went to Nationals. Calgary in winter is not a good location if the arena is not downtown within walking distance of hotels and restaurants. I much prefer Thunderbird in Vancouver for accessibility.

Laval is super easy... if you have not been, I was there in 2018 for SCI... steps away from the subway that goes to Montreal.... super easy.

 

[lariko]

Sad that Shiryaeva, Volkova and junior men winners didn't get anything, but Reuiter obviously deserved a place and BC needs a better team coming with them to support the athletes. They will all hopefully get spots in JGP next year and good luck to them!

 

[Sackie]

I have been watching skating for years (yes I am old) and I think over all this was one of the worse Nationals. Only Sr Dance showed some great highlights. In Pairs Kelly Ann and Lucas came through with their best skate ever, the others faltered. Men's was just terrible - our new CAN champ had a free skate score that some of the top women in the world are beating. And I know part of the low scores was due to the hard calls by the tec callers. (We won't see that happen at other Nationals - like next week.) Ladies went almost as expected but it really is not good when only 1 skater scores over 120 in the free skate. Really hope Maddie takes this result and let's it feed her desire to get back on top for Canada. Too bad there wasn't someone else to send to 4CC so she could take the time to rest and work on what ever went wrong so far this season.

 

[soccerjc77]

If national at 2025 is in Laval, I will go and I can't wait to see if Uliana is as good as on the screen for all thoses who say that her low PCS is justified. I need to see from my eyes to believe it, because I don't find her low PCS justified right now and think that she deserved 3rd place overall in this competition.

 

[4everchan]

Sad that Shiryaeva, Volkova and junior men winners didn't get anything, but Reuiter obviously deserved a place and BC needs a better team coming with them to support the athletes. They will all hopefully get spots in JGP next year and good luck to them!

They may get coupe du printemps. Skate Canada sometimes send those who didn't get something to that event in the spring.

 

[ladyjane]

I think they've sent skaters to the Challenge Cup in NL as well a few years ago. Also works as a last chance to get minimum TES for Worlds.

 

[lariko]

If national at 2025 is in Laval, I will go and I can't wait to see if Uliana is as good as on the screen for all thoses who say that her low PCS is justified. I need to see from my eyes to believe it, because I don't find her low PCS justified right now and think that she deserved 3rd place overall in this competition.

Mom and I saw her live. The arena reacted very positively to her skate (after everyone else falling and popping like it was an obligatory element, lol). The speed was low vs other girls in short, yes, but in the free she was fine. Her spins are fine as well. She has a focused expression on her face in the free (no wonder), but unlike other junior girls (including Lulu, minus Volkova) she doesn't zip from corner to corner, but tries to show choreo. Shi is obviously better with glide and knees, but just as obviously worse on jumps. Shiryaeva with bronze wouldn't have surprised anyone. She sure is not any slower than Levito.

The bottom line is they taught her how to jump in Russia, and taught her well, so it's up to the Canadians to teach her how to glide, particularly since they are so frightfully good at it. So...yeah. It's up to the BC school to support her more and package her better. Russians usually use speed, choreo and lightness across the ice as compensation for less soft knees than the Asian skaters, so I don't see why her coach can't work on the same thing, since knees is not something they can replace.

I am not surprised that they didn't put Shiryaeva in, since Reuiter is not exactly senior material yet and won gold, but Lulu over Shi is not a smart choice imo, since Shi has more to offer vs Japanese and Korean junior women. Plus, it's unfair toward the top junior men who skated better than the senior lot overall.

 

[rain]

I have been watching skating for years (yes I am old) and I think over all this was one of the worse Nationals. Only Sr Dance showed some great highlights. In Pairs Kelly Ann and Lucas came through with their best skate ever, the others faltered. Men's was just terrible - our new CAN champ had a free skate score that some of the top women in the world are beating. And I know part of the low scores was due to the hard calls by the tec callers. (We won't see that happen at other Nationals - like next week.) Ladies went almost as expected but it really is not good when only 1 skater scores over 120 in the free skate. Really hope Maddie takes this result and let's it feed her desire to get back on top for Canada. Too bad there wasn't someone else to send to 4CC so she could take the time to rest and work on what ever went wrong so far this season.

I think you've donned rose coloured glasses when looking at the misty memories of nationals past.

 

[lariko]

I think you've donned rose coloured glasses when looking at the misty memories of nationals past.

I think Canadian senior men must have been one of the worst showings in at least a decade. Or at least I hope so, and that they will significantly improve.

 

[4everchan]

The bottom line is they taught her how to jump in Russia, and taught her well, so it's up to the Canadians to teach her how to glide, particularly since they are so frightfully good at it. So...yeah. It's up to the BC school to support her more and package her better. Russians usually use speed, choreo and lightness across the ice as compensation for less soft knees than the Asian skaters, so I don't see why her coach can't work on the same thing, since knees is not something they can replace.

Won't happen with McLeod unfortunately. Most of her skaters have been slow from Leung to Bausback to Shirayeva and from Reynolds to Rakic... I agree that Uliana has good jumps though there are some flaws in there too like a slight change of edge between jumps of her combo (Valieva did that too) and sometimes, they look quite muscled up with the upper body.. But yeah, she lands them which is already better than many but I am worried about the rest. I doubt she is in the right school to develop what she needs to develop.

I am not surprised that they didn't put Shiryaeva in, since Reuiter is not exactly senior material yet and won gold, but Lulu over Shi is not a smart choice imo, since Shi has more to offer vs Japanese and Korean junior women. Plus, it's unfair toward the top junior men who skated better than the senior lot overall.

Shi doesn't have a triple lutz really which is the imposed solo jump in juniors... So in that sense... might as well go with Lulu. Shi won't be eligible for senior forever at this point... so she will have many opportunities in juniors to come.

 

[lariko]

there are some flaws in there too like a slight change of edge between jumps of her combo (Valieva did that too) and sometimes, they look quite muscled up with the upper body.. But yeah, she lands them which is already better than many

It's better than everyone. The technique is individual, so as long as the jump is landed and rotated, the jump is landed and rotated. I am sure Shiryaeva knows better than anyone else what she needs to develop and not to lose. The kid is from Moscow and moved a country. She has more life experience in the field than all of us combined.

If Shi doesn't have triple lutz, than giving her bronze over Shiryaeva with two 3Lz was bad juju

 

[4everchan]

It's better than everyone. The technique is individual, so as long as the jump is landed and rotated, the jump is landed and rotated. I am sure Shiryaeva knows better than anyone else what she needs to develop and not to lose. The kid is from Moscow and moved a country. She has more life experience in the field than all of us combined.

If Shi doesn't have triple lutz, than giving her bronze over Shiryaeva with two 3Lz was bad juju

Look at the protocols
Uliana had the highest TES. She also had the most difficult planned content. Though her planned content is the most ambitious, she didn't optimize her advantage because of 3 unclear edge calls and 1 q. Landed and rotated is one thing but there is a GOE bullet about clear take-off... I am particularly concerned about the 3 unclear edge calls. Usually, a skater will get it on either the lutz or the flip... if she got them on both jumps, it's not good news.

 

[4everchan]

I think you've donned rose coloured glasses when looking at the misty memories of nationals past.

It depends how far back we look really
Men were tragic this time around.
Women : though this wasn't great, it was better than the Jen Robinson era... when one could win with 3 triples in the LP. Now, getting out of challenge is almost not possible without an almost complete set of triples.
Pairs were good this time around but I recall, not so long ago having 3-4 seasoned teams (Bilodeau-Séguin, Duhamel-Radford, MTM 2.0, Lubov and Dylan)... so teams in 5th or 6th place were much stronger already than let's say MTV from this year.
Dance : this wasn't our best either though the performances were good... but just a few years ago, VM, Weapo and piper and paul... followed by a bunch of teams that would have been just as good as LaLe and F/A.

So I see @Sackie 's point too...

We have had worse but we have had MUCH better across all 4 disciplines

 

[RatedPG]

Will there be a thread for:

Pre-Novice Challenger
Novice Challenger / Nationals

Those are our next Domestic events?

 

[lariko]

Look at the protocols
Uliana had the highest TES. She also had the most difficult planned content. Though her planned content is the most ambitious, she didn't optimize her advantage because of 3 unclear edge calls and 1 q. Landed and rotated is one thing but there is a GOE bullet about clear take-off... I am particularly concerned about the 3 unclear edge calls. Usually, a skater will get it on either the lutz or the flip... if she got them on both jumps, it's not good news.

Yeah, she had three calls and a q, but zero falls and pops. And this was seniors. Senior medal was wasted on Shi who is neither age eligible for seniors, nor has 3Lz to do juniors this year, nor can stay on her feet. If she had lutz and could go to juniors, I would have understood the move better.

They are sending Ruiter who has all the charm, but no special skating skills nor jump content, and Lulu who has better skating skills but no charm nor jumping content. Why double down on the same when Japanese and Koreans will be basically the same as last year, and Ruiter is basically the same as last year? At least Shiryaeva would have brought something different to the table. Hopefully, they will do something about Lulu's programs at least. Like, add choreo or something and stop her from that left-right, right-left metronome movement she has.

As for Volkova, she needs one tiny adjustment. She needs to swap her last name to her mom's to improve her PCSc.

 

[4everchan]

Yeah, she had three calls and a q, but zero falls and pops. And this was seniors. Senior medal was wasted on Shi who is neither age eligible for seniors, nor has 3Lz to do juniors this year, nor can stay on her feet. If she had lutz and could go to juniors, I would have understood the move better.

They are sending Ruiter who has all the charm, but no special skating skills nor jump content, and Lulu who has better skating skills but no charm nor jumping content. Why double down on the same when Japanese and Koreans will be basically the same as last year, and Ruiter is basically the same as last year? At least Shiryaeva would have brought something different to the table. Hopefully, they will do something about Lulu's programs at least. Like, add choreo or something and stop her from that left-right, right-left metronome movement she has.

As for Volkova, she needs one tiny adjustment. She needs to swap her last name to her mom's to improve her PCSc.

I think it is fine that Hetty got a medal. I would have preferred Fee Ann but she popped ...

 

[lariko]

I think it is fine that Hetty got a medal. I would have preferred Fee Ann but she popped ...

Is that Landry? If so, I was surprise other two seniors got 4CC ahead of her. She seemed more of a prospect live, particularly vs JM. Anyway, I hope Shiryaeva puts in more training and shows strong JGP results last year. I assume they will send her there, lol. Unless Ruiter and Lulu really flush it in Taiwan.