- Joined
- Dec 18, 2003
Opening myself up to eggs, tomatoes, and who knows what else...
Like many of you, on the sidelines of Figure Skating Fandom, I find our pre and post election political debates frustrating on many levels. As a person who is "self declared" liberal leaning on several fronts, and conservative leaning on other fronts, I would like to take what I believe is a risk around here asking some pointed questions.
Taxation is an issue where I definitely am conservative leaning. Piel, I hope you will understand up front that I am quoting your post not as an individual thing, but as a topic that I feel is representative of much that has been said here.
PIEL QUOTE FROM KERRY / BUSH THREAD:
KERRY-EDWARDS!!!
We have got to get health care available to EVERYONE in this country. About a month ago a man in our community was denied continuation of his chemotherapy. Medicaid quit paying because his medical bills had decreased making him inelligible. When he could not come up with the $200.00 owed to the doctor they refused to treat him. Last week he died. Meanwhile Sadaam got hernia surgery and treatment for a prostate infection.
It drives me nuts that people would rather make sure that folks can continue to own guns and gays can be kept from "marrying" than take a chance on Kerry who is the candidate most likely to straighten out the health care mess. It also drives me nuts that those in the top 20% income bracket would rather see the poor go without health care than face a tax increase. Whatever happened to "From everyone to whom much has been given, much will be required... Luke 12:48."?
END QUOTE
Here are some of my questions:
Who do you consider "wealthy?" (what income level?)
What increased tax rate do you think is appropriate for whoever you consider wealthy? (what tax rate are these people in today, and what tax rate do you think they should pay?)
What facts do you present to suggest that people in the upper 20% of income "would rather see the poor go without health care than pay more taxes?"
What Federal Income Tax rate are YOU paying, and how much more are YOU willing to pay to support the gov programs you believe in? I don't think it's fair for people to talk about how much more "someone else" should be paying unless you are willing to personally commit something yourself.
QUOTE:
Whatever happened to "From everyone to whom much has been given, much will be required... Luke 12:48."?
END QUOTE
Do you believe you have been "given much?" If so, I'm interested in what you believe is required of you. If you do not believe you have been given much, why not? I know for sure you have internet access and time to be a fan of a sport. I doubt the truly disadvantaged in the world could say the same. What are you personally doing about this?
Here's what I'm doing about it. I am working toward a 10% tithe to a local church. I'm not there yet, but I'm in the range of 7% working upwards. The local church supports people in situations like you describe re health care, and I'm watchful about how my donations are spent through this church. Additionally, my husband donates time in his business to charities (8 hours per month, split 4 hours each between 2 charities) to provide technical support at no charge (they all use computers). What are YOU doing to donate your time and/or money in your own community to support the needy?
I am currently paying very close to 50% of my income in taxes between Federal, State, Local, Payroll, etc. That doesn't count any self-directed charitable giving. So exactly how much more do you think any person should be expected to pay?????? And by the way, if you think this indicates that I'm "wealthy" I do not consider myself to be so. Blessed, yes. But I still clip coupons, buy used cars, and work a job I don't like much to keep the ends meeting. And my husband and I worry constantly about having enough savings for retirement. It's tough to save moeny for retirement when about 1/2 of it gets taken off the top for the government.
I'm just tired of hearing about how "the wealthy" should carry the burden to support the poor, the needy, the health insurance, etc. I will have a lot more respect for liberals in favor of higher taxes when I hear more about what tax increases those individuals are signing up for at all levels rather than verbally placing the burden on someone else.
DG
Like many of you, on the sidelines of Figure Skating Fandom, I find our pre and post election political debates frustrating on many levels. As a person who is "self declared" liberal leaning on several fronts, and conservative leaning on other fronts, I would like to take what I believe is a risk around here asking some pointed questions.
Taxation is an issue where I definitely am conservative leaning. Piel, I hope you will understand up front that I am quoting your post not as an individual thing, but as a topic that I feel is representative of much that has been said here.
PIEL QUOTE FROM KERRY / BUSH THREAD:
KERRY-EDWARDS!!!
We have got to get health care available to EVERYONE in this country. About a month ago a man in our community was denied continuation of his chemotherapy. Medicaid quit paying because his medical bills had decreased making him inelligible. When he could not come up with the $200.00 owed to the doctor they refused to treat him. Last week he died. Meanwhile Sadaam got hernia surgery and treatment for a prostate infection.
It drives me nuts that people would rather make sure that folks can continue to own guns and gays can be kept from "marrying" than take a chance on Kerry who is the candidate most likely to straighten out the health care mess. It also drives me nuts that those in the top 20% income bracket would rather see the poor go without health care than face a tax increase. Whatever happened to "From everyone to whom much has been given, much will be required... Luke 12:48."?
END QUOTE
Here are some of my questions:
Who do you consider "wealthy?" (what income level?)
What increased tax rate do you think is appropriate for whoever you consider wealthy? (what tax rate are these people in today, and what tax rate do you think they should pay?)
What facts do you present to suggest that people in the upper 20% of income "would rather see the poor go without health care than pay more taxes?"
What Federal Income Tax rate are YOU paying, and how much more are YOU willing to pay to support the gov programs you believe in? I don't think it's fair for people to talk about how much more "someone else" should be paying unless you are willing to personally commit something yourself.
QUOTE:
Whatever happened to "From everyone to whom much has been given, much will be required... Luke 12:48."?
END QUOTE
Do you believe you have been "given much?" If so, I'm interested in what you believe is required of you. If you do not believe you have been given much, why not? I know for sure you have internet access and time to be a fan of a sport. I doubt the truly disadvantaged in the world could say the same. What are you personally doing about this?
Here's what I'm doing about it. I am working toward a 10% tithe to a local church. I'm not there yet, but I'm in the range of 7% working upwards. The local church supports people in situations like you describe re health care, and I'm watchful about how my donations are spent through this church. Additionally, my husband donates time in his business to charities (8 hours per month, split 4 hours each between 2 charities) to provide technical support at no charge (they all use computers). What are YOU doing to donate your time and/or money in your own community to support the needy?
I am currently paying very close to 50% of my income in taxes between Federal, State, Local, Payroll, etc. That doesn't count any self-directed charitable giving. So exactly how much more do you think any person should be expected to pay?????? And by the way, if you think this indicates that I'm "wealthy" I do not consider myself to be so. Blessed, yes. But I still clip coupons, buy used cars, and work a job I don't like much to keep the ends meeting. And my husband and I worry constantly about having enough savings for retirement. It's tough to save moeny for retirement when about 1/2 of it gets taken off the top for the government.
I'm just tired of hearing about how "the wealthy" should carry the burden to support the poor, the needy, the health insurance, etc. I will have a lot more respect for liberals in favor of higher taxes when I hear more about what tax increases those individuals are signing up for at all levels rather than verbally placing the burden on someone else.
DG