The Judging Controversy Thread

[Ophelia]

There is nothing in ISU regulations, that all skaters via their respective skating federations agreed to, that requires judges to take into consideration historical records in their scoring. They judge a specific performance on the day they were assigned to judge. That's all.

Oh really? If judges are just objectively scoring each event individually, then why was there such outcry about the judges holding back points on Dennis Ten in Worlds 2013 due to his more "junior" status? Why do people also say that skaters need to attend more Grand Prix events to build up their credibility and standing with the judges?

 

[whatif]

Oh really...If judges are just objectively scoring each event individually, then why was there such outcry about the judges holding back points on Dennis Ten in Worlds 2013 due to his more "junior" status? Why do posters also say that skaters need to attend more Grand Prix events to build up their credibility and standing with the judges?

I can not comment on Dennis Ten. I am not familiar with the situation. As for the needs to compete more during the season. It has nothing to do with standing or credibility. I am not sure about others but my understanding is that it is for the benefit for the athlete to compete at the international stage to get some feedback on their programmes to fix any problems before the bigger competition.

 

[hurrah]

I can not comment on Dennis Ten. I am not familiar with the situation. As for the needs to compete more during the season. It has nothing to do with standing or credibility. I am not sure about others but my understanding is that it is for the benefit for the athlete to compete at the international stage to get some feedback on their programmes to fix any problems before the bigger competition.

Hey, in another thread, you just wrote that Mao lost her long because she lost the short. According to the logic you employ here then, how could Mao's short affect her long, since they are two separate performances?

 

[Ophelia]

I can not comment on Dennis Ten. I am not familiar with the situation. As for the needs to compete more during the season. It has nothing to do with standing or credibility. I am not sure about others but my understanding is that it is for the benefit for the athlete to compete at the international stage to get some feedback on their programmes to fix any problems before the bigger competition.

Do you follow figure-skating closely? Competing on the international stage has ALOT to do with establishing yourself with the judges. I'll let other posters chime in here bc I have to step out quickly.

 

[vegarin]

That is subjective opinion, not factual evidence. Anybody can cherry pick a few subjective opinions. But, the fact remains that there is no hard evidence of corruption

I'm not sure what constitutes hard evidence, but substituted judges being the wife of the Russian Federation Skating and someone who's been known to be involved in score-fixing at least needs to be addressed. It won't change anything that has to do with the outcome of this Olympics, but it would do much for figure skating if there's more clarify about judges and judging system that are currently shrouded in mysteries and raising a lot of eyebrows.

 

[whatif]

Hey, in another thread, you just wrote that Mao lost her long because she lost the short. According to the logic you employ here then, how could Mao's short affect her long, since they are two separate performances?

She buried herself too deep. And as I posted before it worked for her and against her. In fact, the panel went generous and did not make some harsh calls she should have gotten for URs in her FS, had she been a stronger medal contender that night. But she also benefitted as she skated well overall without being under pressure. Personally I would not give her 1st place in FS.

 

[whatif]

I'm not sure what constitutes hard evidence, but substituted judges being the wife of the Russian Federation Skating and someone who's been known to be involved in score-fixing at least needs to be addressed. It won't change anything that has to do with the outcome of this Olympics, but it would do much for figure skating if there's more clarify about judges and judging system that are currently shrouded in mysteries and raising a lot of eyebrows.

Why is that? She was Pisseev's wife for decades now and judged 100s of international competitions, including the Olympics and Worlds. So where were you until now?

 

[hurrah]

She buried herself too deep. And as I posted before it worked for her and against her. In fact, the panel went generous and did not make some harsh calls she should have gotten for URs in her FS, had she been a stronger medal contender that night. But she also benefitted as she skated well overall without being under pressure. Personally I would not give her 1st place in FS.

Okay, so whatever argument you were trying to lay here contradicts what you are saying about Mao's scores. You're really inconsistent.

 

[whatif]

Okay, so whatever argument you were trying to lay here contradicts what you are saying about Mao's scores. You're really inconsistent.

I am not making any argument. I am stating that she did not deserve the first or even second place for that skate. What she got is more than what she deserved. I am happy for her for bouncing back.

 

[vegarin]

Hey, in another thread, you just wrote that Mao lost her long because she lost the short. According to the logic you employ here then, how could Mao's short affect her long, since they are two separate performances?

Because logic be damned, apparently, as long as anything helps to portray what happened to the scores in this Olympics as perfectly acceptable somehow.

 

[vegarin]

Why is that? She was Pisseev's wife for decades now and judged 100s of international competitions, including the Olympics and Worlds. So where were you until now?

Oh, I have been here longer than you have in this forum. In fact, thanks for joining us just in time in Feb 2014 so you can explain in every way why the judging here is acceptable. And I suppose you have never heard of something called conflict of interest. And you conveniently left out the Ukrainian judge being able to even be a judge.

 

[whatif]

Oh, I have been here longer than you have in this forum. In fact, thanks for joining us just in time in Feb 2014 so you can explain in every way why the judging here is acceptable. And I suppose you have never heard of something called conflict of interest. And you conveniently left out the Ukrainian judge being able to even be a judge.

Thank you your welcome. Can you show me your past posts about conflict of interest by the said judge?

 

[vegarin]

Philip Hersh's article:

Figure skating official: 'I'm not hiding anything'

The presence of two people on the judging panel, which grades the execution of the elements and components, understandably has fueled criticism.

One judge, Alla Shekhovtseva, is married to Valentin Piseev, former president of the Russian Figure Skating Federation and its current general director. Another, Yuri Balkov of Ukraine, was suspended for one year for being part of a result-fixing affair in 1998.

One is a clear conflict of interest. The other is akin to having a bank rehire an employee caught for embezzling.

Apparently resulting fixing by a judge is only a minor violation to Cinquanta. That's enough said.

 

[Ophelia]

Thank you your welcome. Can you show me your past posts about conflict of interest by the said judge?

"Conflict of Interest" does not refer to an act. It refers to "a set of circumstances that creates a risk that professional judgement or actions regarding a primary interest will be unduly influenced by a secondary interest."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conflict_of_interest
http://biztaxlaw.about.com/od/glossaryc/g/conflictinteres.htm

 

[whatif]

"Conflict of Interest" does not refer to an act. It refers to "a set of circumstances that creates a risk that professional judgement or actions regarding a primary interest will be unduly influenced by a secondary interest."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conflict_of_interest

Don't teach me English please. Just answer simple question.

 

[Ophelia]

I just answered your question, whilst correcting your misconception of what the definition of "conflict of interest" was in the first place.

 

[leafygreens]

Why is that? She was Pisseev's wife for decades now and judged 100s of international competitions, including the Olympics and Worlds. So where were you until now?

This is the first time it has been brought to anyone's attention. Just because it hasn't been brought up before, doesn't mean it should be allowed to continue.

 

[Ophelia]

^Context also matters, since this is the first Winter Olympics held in Russia. It's the situational context that matters in this case, since in previous cases the conflict of interest may not have existed.

 

[vegarin]

This is the first time it has been brought to anyone's attention. Just because it hasn't been brought up before, doesn't mean it should be allowed to continue.

I love your "location". I almost want to do the exact same thing.

 

[kamppi]

Two out of three in the technical panel were Russians! Lakernik (TC) and Baranova (ATS)? Outragous. That's two to one. Did Gusmeroli have any chance?