The Judging Controversy Thread

[whatif]

So according to this logic, she can continue judge international competitions with Russian skaters competing for medals BUT only if it's not Winter Olympics held in Russia?

 

[whatif]

Why two out of three in the technical panel were Russians? Lakernik (TC) and Baranova (ATS)? Outragous. That's two to one. Did Gusmeroli have any chance?

Now that's a better question.

 

[chuckm]

Mme Piseev was also on the Ladies judging panel for Europeans, where Lipnitskaia and Sotnikova finished 1-2; was the Ice Dance Technical Controller for 4CC; was on the GPF Ladies judging panel (with Yuri Balkov) where Lipnitskaia finished second; and was the Cup of Russia Ice Dance referee; that judging panel included judges from UZB, AZE, UKR and RUS and the results were some of the most controversial of the GP season.

It is a matter of concern that this politically-connected woman has had her finger in the pie of every major competition so far this season. I wouldn't be surprised if she will be presiding at both JW and Worlds in some capacity.

 

[whatif]

Mme Piseev was also on the Ladies judging panel for Europeans, where Lipnitskaia and Sotnikova finished 1-2; was the Ice Dance Technical Controller for 4CC; was on the GPF Ladies judging panel (with Yuri Balkov) where Lipnitskaia finished second; and was the Cup of Russia Ice Dance referee; that judging panel included judges from UZB, AZE, UKR and RUS and the results were some of the most controversial of the GP season.

It is a matter of concern that this politically-connected woman has had her finger in the pie of every major competition so far this season. I wouldn't be surprised if she will be presiding at both JW and Worlds in some capacity.

So out of all those competitions, the Cup of Russia is the only one you are questioning? What about GPF or 4CC?

 

[bekalc]

Mme Piseev was also on the Ladies judging panel for Europeans, where Lipnitskaia and Sotnikova finished 1-2; was the Ice Dance Technical Controller for 4CC; was on the GPF Ladies judging panel (with Yuri Balkov) where Lipnitskaia finished second; and was the Cup of Russia Ice Dance referee; that judging panel included judges from UZB, AZE, UKR and RUS and the results were some of the most controversial of the GP season.

It is a matter of concern that this politically-connected woman has had her finger in the pie of every major competition so far this season. I wouldn't be surprised if she will be presiding at both JW and Worlds in some capacity.

Do you really want to argue that Yulia didn't deserve second at the GPF. Where Asada one to with a messy messy skate based on PCS?

 

[Mathman]

This is the first time it has been brought to anyone's attention. Just because it hasn't been brought up before, doesn't mean it should be allowed to continue.

Actually, it has been brought up over and over for years now. It was certainly on the table for the discussion of the then-new "conflict of interest" rule. It's a question of "who'll bell the cat?"

 

[chuckm]

CoR was an event that began to raise worries about how fair the judging and tech panels were going to be at Sochi.

My point was that Alla Shekhovtseva was involved in every one of these competitions: Olympic Team Ladies judge, Olympic Ladies Singles judge, European Ladies judge, 4CC Ice Dance Technical Controller, GPF Ladies judge, Cup of Russia Ice Dance Referee

Considering that she is the wife of Valentin Piseev who has a high position in the Russian Figure Skating Federation, that would appear to be spreading political influence to a level that is highly questionable.

 

[Mao88]

.

 

[whatif]

CoR was an event that began to raise worries about how fair the judging and tech panels were going to be at Sochi.

My point was that Alla Shekhovtseva was involved in every one of these competitions: Olympic Team Ladies judge, Olympic Ladies Singles judge, European Ladies judge, 4CC Ice Dance Technical Controller, GPF Ladies judge, Cup of Russia Ice Dance Referee

Considering that she is the wife of Valentin Piseev who has a high position in the Russian Figure Skating Federation, that would appear to be spreading political influence to a level that is highly questionable.

I still do not see how being a wife of a skating official is worth than being a high ranking skating official for a competing country and still be an international judge? In that case, several judges' scores at this Olympics needs questioning including Sissy Krick, Jodi Abbot, Koh Sung-hee etc.

 

[verysmuchso]

I still do not see how being a wife of a skating official is worth than being a high ranking skating official for a competing country and still be an international judge? In that case, several judges' scores at this Olympics needs questioning including Sissy Krick, Jodi Abbot, Koh Sung-hee etc.

I don't know if you're just arguing here just argument's sake, but this definitely constitutes reasonable grounds for suspicion, especially when this lady judge in question, captured in photo hugging Sotnikova immediately after the event, teaming up with the infamous Yuri Balikov who was previously caught red-handed for score fixing and had been suspended. Plus they have the backup from an entirely Russian tech caller team. They have plenty of means to sway the outcome.

 

[whatif]

I don't know if you're just arguing here just argument's sake, but this definitely constitutes reasonable grounds for suspicion, especially when this lady judge in question, captured in photo hugging Sotnikova immediately after the event, teaming up with the infamous Yuri Balikov who was previously caught red-handed for score fixing and had been suspended. Plus they have the backup from an entirely Russian tech caller team. They have plenty of means to sway the outcome.

They all hug afterwards, lets strip off Yuzuru Hanyu a gold medal for the same offence?

 

[Mao88]

So according to this logic, she can continue judge international competitions with Russian skaters competing for medals BUT only if it's not Winter Olympics held in Russia?

Of course, there is no conflict of interest. Moreover, the real stupidity of trying to argue that Alla Shekhovtseva should not be officiating because she is the wife of the president of the Russian Figure skating Federation, is that why on earth then was Rhee Chihee, the Vice President of the The Korean Skating Union allowed to be a judge in the Short Program and Free Program of the Ladies Competition at the 2010 Olympics, when Kim was one of the favourites (Article, SP Judges - 2010 Olympics, LP Judges - 2010 Olympics)? If there was a conflict of interest in Alla Shekhovtseva being a judge, then by the same standards, there was a conflict with Rhee Chihee being a judge. You can't have it both ways, and to try is the height of hypocrisy

Of course, there was no conflict of interest in either case, and no evidence whatsoever of any wrongdoing.

The following is an interesting extract from this article:-

The selection of Rhee has been backed by world champion Kim Yu-na who captured the Trophee Bompard championship, Saturday, winning the free skate with a flawless performance to outrival Japanese skater Mao Asada.

The ISU has granted judging qualification to those from nations whose skaters claimed 24th and above in international events.

In the 2006 Torino Winter Olympics, Rhee wasn't able to serve as judge since no Korean qualified for the games.

In Vancouver, she will be among nine judges who score the performance of Kim ― the strongest candidate for the gold medal.

Rhee said judges' subjective views cannot be completely ruled out when scoring skaters, no matter how scientific the new scoring system in figure skating has become.

Rhee said Korea should produce skaters who can succeed Kim as soon as possible.

"I was able to become a judge this time thanks to Kim Yu-na. But I'm concerned that this might be the first and last chance to become a judge for the Winter Olympics," Rhee said. "We should produce a player who can succeed Kim at the earliest possible time."

The following will be noted from this extract:-

1. Kim fully endorsed Rhee's selection as a Judge for the 2010 Olympics. By the same token, therefore, Kim could have no objection to Alla Shekhovtseva officiating at the 2014 Olympics.

2. Rhee fully endorses her own appointment as a Judge at the 2010 Olympics despite her position as Vice President of The Korean Skating Union. By the same token, she can have no objection to Alla Shekhovtseva officiating at the 2014 Olympics.

3. Rhee states that "subjective views cannot be completely ruled out when scoring skaters, no matter how scientific the new scoring system in figure skating has become." That is, subjective views are a part of the sport that cannot be eradicated - and each Judge is entitled to their own subjective views, including her

this lady judge in question, captured in photo hugging Sotnikova immediately after the event

I have lost count of the number of judges who congratulate competitors after the event - it must run into the many thousands. That does not make them corrupt.

These arguments run to there logical conclusion - you would have to have Judges from countries from which none of the competitors are from. That would be logistically impossible.

 

[verysmuchso]

Mme Piseev was also on the Ladies judging panel for Europeans, where Lipnitskaia and Sotnikova finished 1-2; was the Ice Dance Technical Controller for 4CC; was on the GPF Ladies judging panel (with Yuri Balkov) where Lipnitskaia finished second; and was the Cup of Russia Ice Dance referee; that judging panel included judges from UZB, AZE, UKR and RUS and the results were some of the most controversial of the GP season.

It is a matter of concern that this politically-connected woman has had her finger in the pie of every major competition so far this season. I wouldn't be surprised if she will be presiding at both JW and Worlds in some capacity.

Talking about the fox guarding the hen house!
At this rate, they can influence the competitive outcome of an entire season.

 

[Ambivalent]

Of course, there is no conflict of interest. Moreover, the real stupidity of trying to argue that Alla Shekhovtseva should not be officiating because she is the wife of the president of the Russian Figure skating Federation, is that why on earth then was Rhee Chihee, the Vice President of the The Korean Skating Union allowed to be a judge in the Short Program and Free Program of the Ladies Competition at the 2010 Olympics, when Kim was one of the favourites (Article, SP Judges - 2010 Olympics, LP Judges - 2010 Olympics)? If there was a conflict of interest in Alla Shekhovtseva being a judge, then by the same standards, there was a conflict with Rhee Chihee being a judge. You can't have it both ways, and to try is the height of hypocrisy

Of course, there was no conflict of interest in either case, and no evidence whatsoever of any wrongdoing.

The following is an interesting extract from this article:-



The following will be noted from this extract:-

1. Kim fully endorsed Rhee's selection as a Judge for the 2010 Olympics. By the same token, therefore, Kim could have no objection to Alla Shekhovtseva officiating at the 2014 Olympics.

2. Rhee fully endorses her own appointment as a Judge at the 2010 Olympics despite her position as Vice President of The Korean Skating Union. By the same token, she can have no objection to Alla Shekhovtseva officiating at the 2014 Olympics.

3. Rhee states that "subjective views cannot be completely ruled out when scoring skaters, no matter how scientific the new scoring system in figure skating has become." That is, subjective views are a part of the sport that cannot be eradicated - and each Judge is entitled to their own subjective views, including her

Mao88 are you not at least outraged that Sotnikova outscored Mao in the free skate? Your hatred of Yuna is blinding you here a bit. All the veterans, especially Mao were underscored relative to Adelina.

 

[verysmuchso]

Of course, there is no conflict of interest. Moreover, the real stupidity of trying to argue that Alla Shekhovtseva should not be officiating because she is the wife of the president of the Russian Figure skating Federation, is that why on earth then was Rhee Chihee, the Vice President of the The Korean Skating Union allowed to be a judge in the Short Program and Free Program of the Ladies Competition at the 2010 Olympics, when Kim was one of the favourites (Article, SP Judges - 2010 Olympics, LP Judges - 2010 Olympics)? If there was a conflict of interest in Alla Shekhovtseva being a judge, then by the same standards, there was a conflict with Rhee Chihee being a judge. You can't have it both ways, and to try is the height of hypocrisy

Of course, there was no conflict of interest in either case, and no evidence whatsoever of any wrongdoing.

The following is an interesting extract from this article:-



The following will be noted from this extract:-

1. Kim fully endorsed Rhee's selection as a Judge for the 2010 Olympics. By the same token, therefore, Kim could have no objection to Alla Shekhovtseva officiating at the 2014 Olympics.

2. Rhee fully endorses her own appointment as a Judge at the 2010 Olympics despite her position as Vice President of The Korean Skating Union. By the same token, she can have no objection to Alla Shekhovtseva officiating at the 2014 Olympics.

3. Rhee states that "subjective views cannot be completely ruled out when scoring skaters, no matter how scientific the new scoring system in figure skating has become." That is, subjective views are a part of the sport that cannot be eradicated - and each Judge is entitled to their own subjective views, including her

Did that panel also include a judge who had the past record of having fixed scores in favor of a Korean skater and having been suspended for it? And several other judges that are ethically Korean or closed related to Korea?

 

[whatif]

Did that panel also include a judge who had the past record of having fixed scores in favor of a Korean skater and having been suspended for it? And several other judges that are ethically Korean or closed related to Korea?

Is it some kind of new breed? Could we have a recipe for all countries?

 

[verysmuchso]

Is it some kind of new breed? Could we have a recipe for all countries?

Sorry a typo 'ethnically'

 

[verysmuchso]

It takes two to tango for figure skating judging. You guys are aware that outlier scores are discarded, right? So a single judge from your country overmarking you cannot help you, as that score is likely to be thrown out. So you need a second judge who scores you favorably for it to work.

 

[usethis2]

Yes, we know judging is subjective. But the at a minimum the ISU shouldn't have installed a known crazy or a known criminal in such an important event.

Also I cannot stress enough about impropriety of tech panel's selection and their actions taken during the ladies SP and FS. Tech panel's decisions are easier to review. There are perplexing calls (step sequence) and perplexing un-calls (Russian skaters' edges).

 

[mirai4life]

I don't know if you're just arguing here just argument's sake, but this definitely constitutes reasonable grounds for suspicion, especially when this lady judge in question, captured in photo hugging Sotnikova immediately after the event, teaming up with the infamous Yuri Balikov who was previously caught red-handed for score fixing and had been suspended. Plus they have the backup from an entirely Russian tech caller team. They have plenty of means to sway the outcome.

It wasn't one female judge

There were two female judges who went to hug Adelina.

:disapp: