I'm trying to not be too excited, but this sounds like they are staying with Igor. Right?
Right. I'm not excited too yet (let's wait a little), but it looks like transfer to Igor will be confirmed.
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Elena Ilinykh & Ruslan Zhiganshin
- Thread starter OrdinaryDreamer
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Right. I'm not excited too yet (let's wait a little), but it looks like transfer to Igor will be confirmed.
Ok, took a break after Worlds. Loved Worlds, well, I was there and had a great time, regardless of which teams were there. Loved PC in person, surprisingly loved CL in person and really liked Shibs programs this year. But, I digress
I am back to ice skating and decided to check out what was happening now and I am happy to see IZ are doing well with Igor and if I may be so bold, looks like they are there to stay. Next season will be exciting as, dare I say it, VM will back!!!! just to throw another wrench in the works...
Hope Russian Ice dance and IZ do better next year and looking forward to seeing what Igor does with them.
Hmmmm.... will have to catch up on the YM drama on their page, I guess....
I enjoyed PC and CL too. It was great to see their perfomances. It was good Worlds for me with some positive and negative moments. At the same time Russian ID teams were not very successful. As a IZ's fan I was extremely disappointed with Ruslena's absence at Worlds. But i knew it's the best way for them: to work with Igor and his team and be far away from any media-noise.
I am sure they will stay with Igor, and I'm waiting a confirmation of this. I think it's absolutely best for them, and excited to see Igor's version of IZ next year. I'm also glad that Vaytsekhovskaya will take an Interview with them because her criticism about IZ in previous articles could affect their decision in the beginning of the year, IMHO.
Y/M... Sadly, we don't have this team. But I was not surprised.
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- May 4, 2015
She might not be comfortable training alongside Mozgov and Popova just yet, or maybe she thinks it's a good time to take some time off, because once she has a new partner they'll have a lot of work to do.I don't think Anna is still at MedvedkovoShe hasn't posted anything from the rink or tagged herself there for ages, at least the beginning of April when all this went down.
Yanovskaya merely said what Mozgov had told her, and although Popova didn't claim to quote him, I bet she got this info from him as well. I just think that if the split were AK's idea, they'd have Mozgov and Popova try out on their rink, so they could see for themselves how Betina and Sergei look together.
Well, what can they say? That Mozgov has lied?
I guess they want to show their new programs to AK and probably to some Fed experts as well. What wouldn't I have given to be a fly on that rink's wall...
She might not be comfortable training alongside Mozgov and Popova just yet, or maybe she thinks it's a good time to take some time off, because once she has a new partner they'll have a lot of work to do.
Yanovskaya merely said what Mozgov had told her, and although Popova didn't claim to quote him, I bet she got this info from him as well. I just think that if the split were AK's idea, they'd have Mozgov and Popova try out on their rink, so they could see for themselves how Betina and Sergei look together.
Well, what can they say? That Mozgov has lied?
I guess they want to show their new programs to AK and probably to some Fed experts as well. What wouldn't I have given to be a fly on that rink's wall...
IMHO, they'd want to keep FED officials abreast of their progress as they are the ones who'll have to officially sign off on the transfer to Igor. Showing AK the programs would only be a courtesy. As we saw last season its best that the guys train year round with the choreographers of their programs. Both Y/M and I/Z struggled with their choreography from outsiders. Y/M for the short dance and I/Z for everything. A/K just don't know how to show off their skaters to their best advantage competitively with the rest of the world. The reason why Carmen was such a hit was that Najarro had so much more time to give them in their first season together. Last season he was very busy with touring and he wasn't around to give the oversight needed. As Zhulin has hinted at before AK sometimes lack creative vision or a definitive style. If you're looking to be competitive on the world stage this cannot be. So for what reason would we as fans want them to stay with AK? They need to train with the best in one of the best schools if they hope to improve. In Novi they would get to train with Isabella and Ilia, Chock and Bates, Coomes and Buckland and Igor's promising juniors. Who would they have to spur them on in their previous rink? I hope things will turn out well for them.
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- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
Yeah, it`s time for IZ to move on. They will only spend one week in Moscow, so they will probably have their medical check up, which the other Russian skaters already had in April, maybe they will also meet with their sponsors and with the Fed. Hopefully, they will have time for holidays this year, it seems they didn`t have the opportunity yet for a break. I`m of course hoping for an interview, especially from Ruslan.
Quick correction- Najarro had a lot LESS time to oversee Carmen. He didn't even choreograph it so much as spend a day showing them authentic moves that their coaches put together into a program, and then flying out once more to make sure everything was okay.
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- Feb 17, 2010
TBH, I still believe that Frida wasn`t the problem. The SD wasn`t what the judges wanted. Frida was a complex program and it started to come together at COR. Unforunately, the Russian Fed already had decided to push other teams. If we look at the PCS IZ received at Nationals, it was obvious that the best they could have hoped for was a third place. The Russian Fed chose the safe programs of SK and SB and how we could see, it didn`t give them the result they wanted.
Carmen was choreographed by Najarro. He also came back to polish the program. AK had some input but that program is much less complex than Frida. IIRC Najarro could only come back once as well for Frida. They also had considerable issues with the SD as well. So I'm not saying the problem was with one thing or the other. It was with both. It was complicated. If Gilles and Poirier could have made their program work for the SD so could I/Z if given the chance and expertise, but there were too many factors working against them not to mention their own mistakes. When the fall happened at Nationals Kustarova wasn't even angry because they all knew ahead of time that they would not be chosen for the team barring a miracle. As for Y/M how could Vlasova create such an odd SD if she really had the time to spend with the guys? I had really hoped both teams would be given the opportunity to move on.
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I/Z come back to Moscow for a week to , first and foremost have the medical check up they need to pass before the national team is announced.
There are certain things skaters need to do, especially if it involves an official coaching change as well, but we dont' know this.
But show their programs to Kustarova and Alexeeva at this point?I don't know what good would come out of it, and why they should do this.
Soon, everything will be clear anyway.
The rankings are updated
http://www.isuresults.com/ws/ws/wsdance.htm
I/Z are 13th just below the Danish couple.
Down the rankings Popova/Vlasenko and Yanovskaya/Mozgov are still listed.
There are certain things skaters need to do, especially if it involves an official coaching change as well, but we dont' know this.
But show their programs to Kustarova and Alexeeva at this point?I don't know what good would come out of it, and why they should do this.
Soon, everything will be clear anyway.
The rankings are updated
http://www.isuresults.com/ws/ws/wsdance.htm
I/Z are 13th just below the Danish couple.
Down the rankings Popova/Vlasenko and Yanovskaya/Mozgov are still listed.
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- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
That`s a good ranking. If Euros were tomorrow, they would be in the penultimate warm up group. Now, let them do one or two Senior B competitions and before we know it they are going to be again the highest ranked Russian team
That`s a good ranking. If Euros were tomorrow, they would be in the penultimate warm up group. Now, let them do one or two Senior B competitions and before we know it they are going to be again the highest ranked Russian team
I like how you're thinking there
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- May 4, 2015
What do you mean by this? How does a coach show off his skaters to their best advantage?
I don't think IZ's mistakes in the past season are AK's fault. For one thing, IZ made as many mistakes last season as this season, because they ignored the fact that they were a new team and went for creative, innovative, technically difficult programs that were the top of what they were capable of. By this season they'd gained more experience, but their programs got even more complex, and again they didn't have enough experience as a team to pull them off consistently, especially in competition with the added nerves factor. However, despite having a similar consistency or lack thereof as last year, they received very different scores this year, because their faction had lost in the Rus Fed. This knowledge had to add to the strain, and, of course, they couldn't foresee this development ahead of time.
And I think the coup in the Fed happened between Moradovian Ornament and the start of GP. Actually even during the summer I read a woman who has some insider status at the Russian Fed (she'd been able to attend closed test skates and post about them, and refused to explain how she got invited there) post that Zueva "had been appointed the savior of the fatherland." But I think the KS faction's victory was fully solidified after Karponosov's visit to their camp. His interviews after the WC also seem to indicate that he was at the head of the KS camp in the Fed and was desperately trying to cover up his antinational politics. I'm sure it's a question of money, influence and intrigues, not programs, which were both great and would have been rewarded accordingly, in the Rus Fed hadn't changed their politics. Nor would KS had received such high scores at GP events and Nationals otherwise, their mistakes and shortcomings often ignored. Everything was decided by SA. IZ clearly knew this, which didn't help their confidence in competition, but even if they'd skated perfectly every time, it wouldn't have helped them this season. Hopefully, after the WC the KC faction has lost again, and we won't see such shameful scoring in the upcoming season. If anybody is wondering how a sports federation could work against their own best team, consider state legislatures whose members are mostly preoccupied with fighting the opposite party, even to the detriment of their country. Rus Fed officials are the same kind of politicians, just in the realm of figure skating. As far as I can tell Gorshkov is the only decent high official there, but obviously he can't do a lot alone. Actually I remember when he accepted this position many people on Russian forums were noneplussed, saying that it's obvious he'll be like the European royalty there - just serving as the Fed's face without any real power, which those who'd had it before weren't going to hand over. It's a very clique-y organisation, just like many parliaments.
So I do hope IZ will be mostly based in Novi, because it'll help their reputation with the judges and their status in the Rus Fed, but in other respects KA wouldn't have been any worse IMO, nor am I ready to judge them based on Mozgov's say so. So I hope IZ will keep their ties with AK and train with them periodically. Everybody's always been saying that they are very good technicians, and they'll certainly have more time for IZ than Shpilband can give them, try as he might, and I think they totally didn't deserve to lose IZ after everything they'd created with them. In a just world IZ would have been on the national team this year instead of KS, on the podium at Euros and in top five at Worlds. But since we live in the world in which "the race is not to the swift," they'll have to leave their coaches and train mostly with Shpilband in order to be judged fairly.
Thanks for giving us reason toThat`s a good ranking. If Euros were tomorrow, they would be in the penultimate warm up group. Now, let them do one or two Senior B competitions and before we know it they are going to be again the highest ranked Russian team
!
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- Feb 17, 2010
Well, it`s good that after all the massive politicking the Russian Fed did for S/K, they managed to reach the brilliance of a 9th place finish at Worlds. Why can`t they just let them all skate, instead loading their teams with all that pressure? And this mentality that there has to be a saviour of Russian Ice Dance doesn`t make it any better. It`s obvious that I/Z are aware of K/A`s shortcomings especially in the PR department. They chose in Shpilband someone, who is at least on par with Zueva on the politicking game, so let`s just hope they will make the switch permanent.
Spiral, everything you have said makes my point for me. What I'd say to AK is this, there's a reason why every senior team you've had with promise has left your camp. There's a reason why your own FED has very little confidence in you. There's a reason why with Zhulin, B/S were transformed into the team they are today. Do you recall how sloppy and accident prone they were especially with twizzles, not to mention Bobrova's posture issues? This is fact and not mere coincidence. I hope they can have a personal epiphany and solve their issues, but not at I/Z's expense.
IMHO, I/Z are the ones on a timeline to produce results. If you aspire to be one of the best you have to train with and be coached by the best. They will have neither if they remain with AK. And remember it's not only about AK alone but the level of technical expertise they will have convenient access to at Igor's camp, all season long. Which is better for the kids having a two month stint with a world class lift specialist or having access to the same for an entire season, like the best in the world do? I am very sure that they are grateful for the start at AK but all people must evolve. This is a fan thread for I/Z not AK so its only natural that we'll want what is best for the kids.
IMHO, I/Z are the ones on a timeline to produce results. If you aspire to be one of the best you have to train with and be coached by the best. They will have neither if they remain with AK. And remember it's not only about AK alone but the level of technical expertise they will have convenient access to at Igor's camp, all season long. Which is better for the kids having a two month stint with a world class lift specialist or having access to the same for an entire season, like the best in the world do? I am very sure that they are grateful for the start at AK but all people must evolve. This is a fan thread for I/Z not AK so its only natural that we'll want what is best for the kids.
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- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
Well, either way we will get soon our answers if they stay with Igor or not. Lol, I will be so disappointed if they go back to Kustarova, but in the end they have to decide what´s best for them. It`s true that Igor has a lot of teams, much more than K/A, but he also works with a big team of experts, who can work with them on every aspect of their skating. As I understood it the main difference between the NA and Russian system is that the NA coaches tend to have a very strict schedule, where every minute is planned, which includes working with specialists in ballet, ballroom dancing, hip hop, fitness, lifts etc. Feel free to correct me, if I`m wrong
Well, either way we will get soon our answers if they stay with Igor or not. Lol, I will be so disappointed if they go back to Kustarova, but in the end they have to decide what´s best for them. It`s true that Igor has a lot of teams, much more than K/A, but he also works with a big team of experts, who can work with them on every aspect of their skating. As I understood it the main difference between the NA and Russian system is that the NA coaches tend to have a very strict schedule, where every minute is planned, which includes working with specialists in ballet, ballroom dancing, hip hop, fitness, lifts etc. Feel free to correct me, if I`m wrong
You are right and it explains a large part of why I/K did so well in their Olympic year.
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- May 4, 2015
Sure. The reason is that coaches who have already achieved international success have more reputation and clout with both nationally and internationally. it's a very well-nkown fact how often skaters switch to famous coaches as soon as previous coaches have brought them on a level to be interesting to famous coaches.
Rus Fed, of course, also knows that have already achieved international success have more reputation and clout with international judges. But even more to the point, Rus Fed is a bordello, just like the US Congress (and many other legislative bodies). In both cases most members happily sell themselves to the highest bidder. it's not about confidence, it's about having more money and willing to spend them to buy officials.
The team whose last success at the world level was a bronze at the 2013 Worlds and not a single GPF medal. I doubt that's what they were hoping for when they switched to Zhulin. Also their soap operish style is so out of date, I don't think even they believe they would have stood a chance to win any medal in Boston, had they been able to compete there.
Sure. So do I. That's why I've said it repeatedly that I'm also hoping that IZ will be mostly based in Novi. Just not for the reasons most people here seem to believe. Or is it also natural to believe that if a skater's season proves less successful than the previous one it is necessarily the coaches' fault?
P.S. I apologize for some strong words in this post, regarding corrupt officials, but I see no reason to pretend to have any respect whatsoever for people who betray their sport or their country.
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- May 4, 2015
There apparently was a poll on the VK page dedicated to Russian figure skaters about the best free dance of the season, and as one could well predict, IZ won by a landslide:
Ilinykh/Zhiganshin - 57.1%
Bobrova/Soloviev - 17.1%
Sinitsina/Katsalapov - 15.8%
Stepanova/Bukin and Sosnitskaya/Golovishnikov - 3.2% each.
(620 people voted in this poll.)
One person noted in the comments that Tarasova called Frida a real masterpiece. Another wrote: "Yes, one can't deceive the people. Despite the fact the IZ didn't get to the main competitions, their short and free dance were acclaimed as the best of the season. We'll be waiting for new masterpieces and for good skates in the new season!"
I haven't found the poll for the SD or the other disciplines.
Link to source:
https://vk.com/public81968113?w=wall-81968113_12619
Ilinykh/Zhiganshin - 57.1%
Bobrova/Soloviev - 17.1%
Sinitsina/Katsalapov - 15.8%
Stepanova/Bukin and Sosnitskaya/Golovishnikov - 3.2% each.
(620 people voted in this poll.)
One person noted in the comments that Tarasova called Frida a real masterpiece. Another wrote: "Yes, one can't deceive the people. Despite the fact the IZ didn't get to the main competitions, their short and free dance were acclaimed as the best of the season. We'll be waiting for new masterpieces and for good skates in the new season!"
I haven't found the poll for the SD or the other disciplines.
Link to source:
https://vk.com/public81968113?w=wall-81968113_12619
