Gabriella Papadakis & Guillaume Cizeron | Page 129 | Golden Skate

Gabriella Papadakis & Guillaume Cizeron

A deconstructed variation on Tango sounds interesting.......... Any clues as to what that might sound like........ Do you mean like sparse/iminalistic percussive backing track with a modern dance feel programme to go with hit?

Yes, It might be,:)
by deconstruction I meant also a sort of contemporary reflection on Tango as traditional form of dance surrounded by popular images and clichés. A few years ago I saw the spectacle choreographed by Sidi Larbi Cherkaoui "Milonga" - it was a combination of traditional tangos danced by professional tangeros from Argentina and contemporary dancers interpreting tango in modern way.
This is a glimpse of it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwYTctTOi20
Hope it's not too off-topic, only a preview of Tango fever.;)
 
Yes, It might be,:)
by deconstruction I meant also a sort of contemporary reflection on Tango as traditional form of dance surrounded by popular images and clichés. A few years ago I saw the spectacle choreographed by Sidi Larbi Cherkaoui "Milonga" - it was a combination of traditional tangos danced by professional tangeros from Argentina and contemporary dancers interpreting tango in modern way.
This is a glimpse of it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwYTctTOi20
Hope it's not too off-topic, only a preview of Tango fever.;)

It's late. I shall look at this tomorrow! But thank you very much. I know the choreographer because he provided the commentary at one point during a Kate Bush documentary. He also has previously worked with Woodkid. So that brings us back to................ So only off topic for a second there. :)
 
the Jiri Kylian influence

;)

MS Choreography has a certain poetic quality and detailed hands movements.

However the general qualities of their skating the fluidity, seamless, polished elegance, beautiful swirling and whirling usually reminds me of choreographic style of Jiri Kylian.

Oh, the Moonlight Sonata does remind me of Jiri Kylian's choreography (especially the hand movements)! And it shouldn't really be a surprise because Jeffrey Cirio (who helped in finishing the Moonlight Sonata choreography) and his sister Lia have danced to Kylian. Below is Lia Cirio speaking about her performance to Kylian's 'Wings of Wax'. I would dream of Kylian himself creating a piece for Gabby and Guillaume! It would be so sublime!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hpR0U0OwK0
 
I just have one thing to say: they really deserve to be Olympic champions.

I know judges might go with Virtue/Moir story and nostalgia, but my God these two are the real winners here! Such grace is indescribable and they've been doing it constantly for almost the last 4 years, they truly deserve to win.
 
Oh, the Moonlight Sonata does remind me of Jiri Kylian's choreography (especially the hand movements)! And it shouldn't really be a surprise because Jeffrey Cirio (who helped in finishing the Moonlight Sonata choreography) and his sister Lia have danced to Kylian. Below is Lia Cirio speaking about her performance to Kylian's 'Wings of Wax'. I would dream of Kylian himself creating a piece for Gabby and Guillaume! It would be so sublime!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hpR0U0OwK0

Yes! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6S8xJ-7MT1U
 
That SD red dress was a perfection. :love: One of my favourite ice dance costumes (and the dance too, it's still my favourite SD of theirs). I don't know if you noticed, but Gabby wore that dress again. It was at Fantasy on ice in Kobe earlier this year. :)

I have no technical competence whatsoever, and I am not at all a skater, so whatever I say comes from a different angle (15 years of theatre). But I fully agree: the SD of 2015-16 was WOOOOOWWWWW. For me, much much more WOW than this year's. Probably because I'm not technically savvy? This does not mean that I am not very enthusiastic and excited about their present SD. I was soooo happy to see it at the Finlandia, because it simply looks very sturdy and solid, in contrast to last year's SD. When discovering the programs last year, it was immediately clear that V/M's Prince had a total WOOOOW factor, in stark contrast with Gaby and Guillaume's, which oozed discomfort and unwillingness. This year, if I may be so blunt, I found V/M's SD immediately not WOOOW. Very well done, and they are super skaters, but nothing to WOW about. Gaby and Guillaume's doesn't have that either, but it feels much more like one whole dance than V/M's to me. (Again: I have no technical baggage to judge any of that at all; but I am arrogant enough to think that I do know a thing or two about performing, being genuine in emotion and expression, and recognizing what is genuinely overwhelming and what is faking it - regardless of whether it works or not.)
I fully understand that Gaby and Guillaume feel restricted and forced with the SD (to be fittingly renamed Rhythm Dance from next year?), but with their talent, I am convinced that they can find music with the required rhythm that they love and feel connected too. I know that the dance pattern step sequences will not leave much space for choice in gliding and smoothness, but still, I hope that they will have the confidence to know that they can take any rhythm and do their magic with it. They can then express themselves in the SD as freely and genuinely as they do in the FD now: feel more free and have real fun.

I will never fight with Alain who knows them and speaks with them, but from what I can see in the video’s, they are not really having fun (yet) in their SD. It is obvious to me that they are doing all they can to fake the fun and sell the program, and they do it VERY well, luckily, but what I am not seeing is confidence, being at ease, genuine fun, owning, being the music, the moves, the message, which creates the magic of their FD. If you look at their faces at the start, the SD has two forced smiles and overacted seductive faces; while the FD has two totally concentrated, genuine, transparent, open, quiet, undisturbed faces without any faked or overlaid emotion. In the first, they are going to sell their program just like all other teams do and have done with great success for many many years. In the second, the Gods of Ice Dance are going to skate magic.
I am fully confident that they can turn any SD into the same Gods of Ice Dance magic, as, for me, they did with the Waltz/March. OK, due to the circumstances they couldn't make it technically work as well as their SD this year (and with V/M and Olympics that simply is a non-negotiable), but still, technique without magic is just technique, but magic without technique still is magic! And technique with magic is... Gaby and Guillaume. :hap57:
 
I will never fight with Alain who knows them and speaks with them, but from what I can see in the video’s, they are not really having fun (yet) in their SD. It is obvious to me that they are doing all they can to fake the fun and sell the program, and they do it VERY well, luckily, but what I am not seeing is confidence, being at ease, genuine fun, owning, being the music, the moves, the message, which creates the magic of their FD. If you look at their faces at the start, the SD has two forced smiles and overacted seductive faces;

I can agree with the seductive faces at the beginning. Actually I thought they were having so much fun, especially at the end of the program, and you're right, at the beginning (just right before the pattern) I don't see as much fun. But it's the first time that they seem to enjoy the SD so much (minus their SD at TDF 2016 where I thought was so good). But like you said it can so much better, and I hope to see that during the season !!
 
I have no technical competence whatsoever, and I am not at all a skater, so whatever I say comes from a different angle (15 years of theatre). But I fully agree: the SD of 2015-16 was WOOOOOWWWWW. For me, much much more WOW than this year's. Probably because I'm not technically savvy? This does not mean that I am not very enthusiastic and excited about their present SD. I was soooo happy to see it at the Finlandia, because it simply looks very sturdy and solid, in contrast to last year's SD. When discovering the programs last year, it was immediately clear that V/M's Prince had a total WOOOOW factor, in stark contrast with Gaby and Guillaume's, which oozed discomfort and unwillingness. This year, if I may be so blunt, I found V/M's SD immediately not WOOOW. Very well done, and they are super skaters, but nothing to WOW about. Gaby and Guillaume's doesn't have that either, but it feels much more like one whole dance than V/M's to me. (Again: I have no technical baggage to judge any of that at all; but I am arrogant enough to think that I do know a thing or two about performing, being genuine in emotion and expression, and recognizing what is genuinely overwhelming and what is faking it - regardless of whether it works or not.)
I fully understand that Gaby and Guillaume feel restricted and forced with the SD (to be fittingly renamed Rhythm Dance from next year?), but with their talent, I am convinced that they can find music with the required rhythm that they love and feel connected too. I know that the dance pattern step sequences will not leave much space for choice in gliding and smoothness, but still, I hope that they will have the confidence to know that they can take any rhythm and do their magic with it. They can then express themselves in the SD as freely and genuinely as they do in the FD now: feel more free and have real fun.

I will never fight with Alain who knows them and speaks with them, but from what I can see in the video’s, they are not really having fun (yet) in their SD. It is obvious to me that they are doing all they can to fake the fun and sell the program, and they do it VERY well, luckily, but what I am not seeing is confidence, being at ease, genuine fun, owning, being the music, the moves, the message, which creates the magic of their FD. If you look at their faces at the start, the SD has two forced smiles and overacted seductive faces; while the FD has two totally concentrated, genuine, transparent, open, quiet, undisturbed faces without any faked or overlaid emotion. In the first, they are going to sell their program just like all other teams do and have done with great success for many many years. In the second, the Gods of Ice Dance are going to skate magic.
I am fully confident that they can turn any SD into the same Gods of Ice Dance magic, as, for me, they did with the Waltz/March. OK, due to the circumstances they couldn't make it technically work as well as their SD this year (and with V/M and Olympics that simply is a non-negotiable), but still, technique without magic is just technique, but magic without technique still is magic! And technique with magic is... Gaby and Guillaume. :hap57:

I know. The superb choreography and music choice, costumes, basically everything. :biggrin: I don't want to rave about it too much as this SD is already 2 years old, but it is a pure perfection (even though not so technically clean as it should be.) Next year's theme should be tango... :devil:
I'm not the biggest fan of this year's short dances (all teams). But I was pleasantly surprised already after Finlandia that G&G seemed to be enjoying themselves while dancing their latin SD. It got even better last week at the COC. My only problem is that they still seem to be quite reserved during some elements and don't go for it just like V/M do. At least that's what I feel when this team is dancing their SD. However, G&G got their personal best score last week, so that should be a huge confidence boost and should help them to stop worrying and just go and dance like the whole world would depend on that moment. :biggrin:
 
We must not forget that it is a competition program:) with a specific theme, elements to perform, stress, competitors ... they do not go out just dancing with friends. It was their first grand prix, there was pressure (last year, it was complicated on the SD for levels), they had to "answer" to Virtue/Moir.
I like this SD and the choice of Ed Sheeran: yes it's modern, it's not a traditional Latin dance and it's complicated for some people on the forums and on twitter:scratch2: but seriously to have it seen 2 times in the stands, it's a great choice, the end of the program comes too fast:sad4: (they make you want to dance with them:laugh:)
 
Next year's theme should be tango... :devil: I'm not the biggest fan of this year's short dances (all teams).

Same here, Latin really isn't the best choice for the Olympic season. I get that the ISU want to spark the interest of the general public, but if we look at the SDs as a whole, it is rather underwhelming, especially compared to the great diversity in SDs last season. How I wish we had Tango as the SD theme this season...

We must not forget that it is a competition program:) with a specific theme, elements to perform, stress, competitors ... they do not go out just dancing with friends. It was their first grand prix, there was pressure (last year, it was complicated on the SD for levels), they had to "answer" to Virtue/Moir.
I like this SD and the choice of Ed Sheeran: yes it's modern, it's not a traditional Latin dance and it's complicated for some people on the forums and on twitter:scratch2: but seriously to have it seen 2 times in the stands, it's a great choice, the end of the program comes too fast:sad4: (they make you want to dance with them:laugh:)

Exactly how I feel. While the SD could use some more mileage, they still have to overcome whatever fear there might be about the SD being their "weaker" point. They seem comfortable with it and will be even more now that they know they can get the technicalities of it cleanly done. I've grown to like the SD, it's very current, follows the trend of Ballroom Latin (music-wise), and they dance the hell out of it! :)
 
I wonder, there seems to be a huge negative bias against Ed Sheeran's music. I don't know his music apart from the Shape of You and that second one in their SD. It's obviously not the best compositions ever but shape of you is fun enough with a very catchy beat to it, I don't get all the hate. It's at least something rather new and current compared to many older choices this season. Anyways, I don't like latin on ice, Gaby was right, it just doesn't translate well, ISU should get rid of it imo.
Meanwhile, their FD is really creating the sensation, I think they have a massive hit on their hands as that Eurosport video has now hit 13 millions views in just a week and their YT video passed the 200 000 views. It won't affect the scores but it's good for the ice dance world to attract that type of attention.
Also, thanks for all the videos about dancing, very interesting. Thanks to their collaboration with Cirio, I think the ballet world might take notice and hopefully some more intriguing collaborations could happen.
Another question, I didn't read anywhere if they intended to compete at Worlds this year. I know some athletes skip it because it's just too much. Alain, would you know ?
 
Meanwhile, their FD is really creating the sensation, I think they have a massive hit on their hands as that Eurosport video has now hit 13 millions views in just a week and their YT video passed the 200 000 views. It won't affect the scores but it's good for the ice dance world to attract that type of attention.

It's great for them, it's so deserved:clap:. The "buzz" came without "publicity" (although Eurosport broadcast the competition, there was no news report on TV, in the newspapers not much). I guess for Grenoble, there will be some TV reports.
In the rink, people are rather excited with Ed Sheeran's music, clap their hands to accompany the music. Everyone can not like, it's normal and thankfully:laugh:! (but I suspect some people of hating this SD because it is that of P/C).
For the world championships, I think it will depend a little on the results of the Games, if they are tired ... It's finally pretty soon after the Olympics (one month later).
 
I really hope that all camera angle recordings of Gaby and Guillaume's dances are being kept safe. The official cut of the Worlds in Helsinki was very unsatisfying, and the same goes for the COC. But as we can clearly see at the start of the slow-motion recap of COC, there are real gems recorded, hopefully kept for some future editor to share with the world.
That first short slow-motion scene of the beginning of MS is so unbelievably beautiful, really worthy of the big screen. The camera couldn't follow the up and down movement well enough, but still the beauty is classic, a scene out of a Greek tragedy!
 
For the world championships, I think it will depend a little on the results of the Games, if they are tired ... It's finally pretty soon after the Olympics (one month later).

It's probably my zero experience as a skater, but how on earth could they consider NOT competing at the Worlds? They have a real opportunity of becoming 8 or 10 times World Champions in a row. Isn't that something you will not miss for the world?

My very simple prediction (and I hope the V/M fans by now simply ignore me for lack of intelligence or something like that) is that in 30 years from now, V/M will be remembered mainly as 'the couple who took that one World Championship out of Gaby and Guillaume's unparalleled winning streak of 12-in-a-row'.
 
It's probably my zero experience as a skater, but how on earth could they consider NOT competing at the Worlds? They have a real opportunity of becoming 8 or 10 times World Champions in a row. Isn't that something you will not miss for the world?

I don't know the exact rules, but certainly if skaters are really tired/ill, they skip the event. For example, both elite teams V/M and D/W didn't compete at the 2014 Worlds after Sochi. My personal wish is to see both teams, P/C and V/M and the Worlds too, but it's too early to predict this as their main goal is Pyeongchang.
 
To me, other teams have ticked/ tick all the boxes of the IJS. What Gabi and Gui have done is come along and ticked the boxes the IJS didn't think of; and it may well be what we get to see this season is a re-evaluation at an informal level of the boxes that do exist so that they include those new boxes within themselves. When two teams or skaters are getting a lot of tens for PCS, the one that brings the newer dimensions won't increase their PCS score, but rather begin to deflate that of other teams....
 
It's November 12 hence happy birthday Guillaume :)

Wish you an iron health, a strong mental and a golden 2017-2018 season with Gabriella
Last but not least, a maximum of fun on the ice and in your life.
You fully deserve it for all your talent, hard work and commitment to ice dance
 
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