Gabriella Papadakis & Guillaume Cizeron

[Eleanor]

So while we are waiting for thursday, I'd like to have your opinions about their costumes. What's your favorite ? Which one did you dislike (if you did)? And what would you see them wearing this year (color ?strass or not ?)

I'll start. My favorite is the swing/blues dress. I love the top with the golden pattern but my favorite part is the skirt. When Gabby spins or do her twizzles, it's sooo gorgeous.
My fav for Guillaume would be...the swing/blues as well. So chic.

Least favourite so far is the 2015 SD costume. Black is harsh on Gabby. Makes her look strict and older.
For Guillaume...well, he kind of looks handsome in anything he wears :/ But I'll go for Oddudua. I am not a fan of the collarbone line. It's weird.

For this season and the tango...hum definitely no black for Gabby. I'd like to see some grey, I'm sure it'll look great on Gabby.
For Guillaume, well, he could come in pyjamas that I'll be okay with it . Maybe something close to what he wore at the olympics. it was gorgeous on him.

 

[Gotlev]

So while we are waiting for thursday, I'd like to have your opinions about their costumes. What's your favorite ? Which one did you dislike (if you did)? And what would you see them wearing this year (color ?strass or not ?)

Favourite costumes: the waltz/march ones they had at Worlds, also indeed the swing costumes at Worlds, certainly last year's rhumba but Guillaume's at Europeans while Gaby's at Worlds, also the paso doble costumes and absolutely also the Oddudua. All those costumes are absolutely brilliant im(pns)ho.

The only dresses I have issues with are Gaby's dress in the Mozart: something about the leotard made it seem as if she wore a diaper, and the MS dress: too bland without a gradient, and it very often swooshed between her legs which made it more of a distraction than an enhancement of her beauty: on several occasions, e.g. during the curved lift, if seen from her backside, it seemed as if she was wearing nickers-with-sleeves...

So for the new programs: plain colours only if the material is thick enough. When using voile fabric: ALWAYS gradients, and please consider how it moves during the program.
I don't care which colours, Guillaume always brings great colour combinations so anything he likes is fine with me.
Bling is OK as well, Guillaume will never make it look cheap.
Embroidered patterns are always good also.

 

[cocotaffy]

Finally their Olympic FD has been posted on YT with Tanith comments
https://youtu.be/p6CmUSlHK-w
I wish we could have all her comments but maybe it'll come. Enjoy !

 

[Gotlev]

Because of looking at their costumes I watched the swing again, about the only program I never watched again.
And still I cannot finish it. The most horrible music choice they made in their senior career so far. Again in my probably not very humble opinion (how humble can you be while claiming to be humble??), it will be hard to contest that that Bittersweet, no matter how interesting a song it may be in a bar after 11PM, is sleep inducing instead of attention grabbing, and the swing is not only too little too late, but also too ordinary to save the day.
That program will most probably never be dethroned as worst music choice of their career. Great costumes, but man, after the waltz, it seems almost incomprehensible that they came with such a thing. If only Christopher Dean had been in the picture back then, he would have knocked some sense into the routine.

Music choices can be such weird things. Like the Shibs or other couples that take a whole pop song from start to finish, because of some great musical development setting the rink on fire after you've thrown away 1.5 of your 4 precious minutes with the lethargic intro of the song.

Sorry for the negative energy in this post. Sometimes I just can't understand why teams don't get that every second of your 4 minutes that you don't bring 'wow' or captivate the audience, you're wasting precious time. Energy! Tension! Attention! Focus! Don't let the audience sit back and yawn, grab them, pull them in, show them something captivating, from second 1!

I'll stop blabbering now. :-D

 

[Gotlev]

Ah, dear Gotlev, your posts always make me smile (or full on laugh)!

I agree with you on how yawn-inducing a single bland pop ballad program can be, however I don't think that's nearly the case of the blues/swing SD. It seemed even then that people dismissed it for various reasons but I always liked it. I liked the blue dress but imo the first costumes fit the dance better thematically (yes! I remember a comment about Gabi's "ancient greek toga" dress but I found the late Belle Epoque/early Art Deco vibe super charming and very them, among all the american style swing interpretations) and I really liked the music too! I don't think Bittersweet was overpowering, especially since a big part of it was the pattern. The swing on the other hand is fun, lively and just the right lenght too, as a continuous up-tempo can become monotone in its own way.
For me the real problem of that SD was that it was never done to its potential. That season their confidence was a bit shaken and they never did it fully without any mistake, did they? I think that now, with all the growth in the past year, it could look vastly different. The blues deserves an even greater speed and power than they had then (but do now!), plus a stronger performance and thus more command on the ice and the public. Try to watch the video from Worlds and imagine the Bittersweet part done bigger and stronger, with more confidence. I really don't think the choreo itself was bad, nor the music/outfit choices. I think it just fell into an "unfortunate" time in their career - one that gets overshadowed by all of their arguably more impressive and remarkable stuff. But all things considered of that season, it was in no way awful.


Ps. The only costumes I really dislike are from their first senior season, both SD and FD. From then on, only the golden necklace/white jacket combo for the Waltz at Europeans was a miss for me but then the new Waltz ones at Worlds are among my very top, along with the To Build a Home ones. And no overly-drapey blouses for Gui please, I prefer the suits

Thanks for the kind words. I feel even more silly than I already am, but hey, laughing is a good thing!

I do think you are right in your analysis, but for me that music just doesn't help at all. I seem to have quite some idiotic frustrations about that season, my road to spiritual enlightenment and detachment is still very long. (I obviously will have to live until 160 or so to get ANY serious work done in that regard... whuf...) Somehow, I can't watch that program without immediately seeing V/M's Prince, which was just a guaranteed SD win from the first time they showed it. I wasn't aware of this or any other skate forum yet at the start of that season, so I wasn't well informed, but from the moment I saw the new programs, I knew that the SD would be won by V/M. Really, that was blatantly obvious, no? I'm a total nitwit and only go by the feel of stuff and how much I'm enchanted. But that Prince SD was mind-blowing, and GG did unfortunately come with something that was not totally miserable, but did not have that oomph that the waltz has. Some little voice inside me gives Marie-France rather dirty looks for I feel that she put more time and energy in V/M's SD than in GG's, but I suppose that GG would never have gone with Prince... And maybe the whole Oddudua choice already created a situation where MF was simply not able to feel as deeply connected or inspired or touched or involved (I'm trying to find a word that expresses the ability to 'feel' it, to get enthused and have a personal bond) with their programs as the year before.
That waltz is still an unbelievable program, where everything falls together perfectly: rousing music, dramatic performing, endless swirling and whirling, incredible speed, absolute grace, brilliant costumes (and super make-up for Gaby), dignity, drama, romance... It is real-life Disney. It's just impossible to add something to it, it is the perfect mixture of all ingredients to create a complete masterpiece. I can watch it endlessly.

I really pray that they have something similarly dramatic and enthusing this year.
Speaking of which: from what I can see in the schedule, they are not on the ice until 1PM on Friday, right? But their music will be posted before? On Thursday? Will that be announced somewhere on the Masters de France site?

 

[Eleanor]

I actually am very scared. What if I don't like the programs
And now you are telling me we have to wait till Friday :sad4:

 

[Eleanor]

Hey I laugh with you, not at you
I also find it funny how reciprocal our views on the two blues SDs are. I'm a huge Prince fan but I could barely get myself to connect with V/M even then. It's because of the music that this SD is the half in my one and a half V/M programs I don't dislike (the other being MR at the Olympics, that dance sure did what it had to do in the end). And still I admit that V/M had the superior SD that year. I don't want to get back into whose fault that was and *if* some were intentionally given better material because I don't know who lurks in this thread and I want it to remain the peaceful safe haven that it is in this forum. I don't disagree with you but the rocky 2016/17 season did deliver at the end and was invaluable in their development, so it's all good.




I was just going to write that somehow I'm not anxious, despite counting on them to deliver amidst all the disappointing choices this season so far. (Does that make me closer to spiritual enlightement? )
And to let you in on a secret, I didn't like Oddudua when I first saw it on a blurry video in its unfinished form at the Masters that year. And see how that turned out! So even if you don't like it, keep in mind it will most probably grow on you.


tl;dr
Is anyone going to see them in person?

I've been wondering the same for quite some times now. While I really adore the swing/blues, I can't help but wished I was a little mouse to know what happened at Gadbois. It must have been quite hard for MFD, she seems to genuinely like P/C but she definitely had to split herself in two to make things work for everyone. Besides, V/M are canadians and it might have had an influence on how things were at some point (besides what happened after Sochi..). But overall, I think they managed it quite well. P/C improved so much in the SD and were quite a threat to V/M by the olympics when they took 6 points in the teeth just a year before. And they evolve so much in the artistry department as well, I mean, from Ed Sheeran to Beethoven in a blink of an eye !!! Who else can do it so well ? So, while in public they were more alone than before, I truly believe that behind the scene, they had all the advice and the support necessary and that in the end, everyone tried their best

It took me awhile as well to like Oddudua and even the Moonlight Sonata ^^. P/C are like a good red wine. Weird at the beginning because, well, you prefer white wine. But then the more you try it, the more you like it. And in the end, you can only drink red; Goodbye rose and white wine. (ok comparing P/C to wine was an easy one )

 

[cocotaffy]

And to let you in on a secret, I didn't like Oddudua when I first saw it on a blurry video in its unfinished form at the Masters that year. And see how that turned out! So even if you don't like it, keep in mind it will most probably grow on you.

I had the same reaction except I immediately loved their music choice. and then it just became my favorite FD of them. This time around I'm afraid I won't like their music choice even though I have no doubt they can make it great #EdSheeranrealness. Still I just hope they won't pick a music in the style of their Belvedere Exhibition, the one music pick of theirs I just couldn't get on board with. Too slow and uninteresting. However, I have a great feeling for the Tango.
I would love if they can have an FD with the intensity and drama of their Waltz. I loved the fast pace and the build up.

 

[icetigger]

http://www.csndg.org/resultats/Masters2018/

 

[Roast Toast]

http://www.csndg.org/resultats/Masters2018/

Thanks. Do we still not have a clue where the stream will be, if any?

 

[Harriet]

Thanks. Do we still not have a clue where the stream will be, if any?

According to the FFSG Facebook it will be a live broadcast through their Facebook page on both 28 and 29 September. ETA: Or at least that's what I remembered them saying - the link I just added doesn't mention dates at all

If it does happen, though, both the RD and the FD will be broadcast, so I hope someone will be able to put them on YouTube! I'll be able to watch the FD live but not the RD, it's way too late at night. (If they don't broadcast on 27 September we'll miss the ladies' SP, though, which is a crying shame as I want to see Laurine's new programs).

Thanks for the results link, icetigger - I'll add it to the thread in the competition forums as well!

ETA: There's a new article up at L'Equipe, but it's behind a paywall, so a nice poster with access at FSU has been providing details, including:

• They're going to be skating an exhibition number rather than their FD at the Masters, so it looks like we have to wait longer to see that
• The FD is to two folk songs by Rachel Yamagata (I don't know her music, so I'll have to look her up, this will be interesting)
• No piano music in the FD
• The FD was indeed choreographed by Stephane Lambiel, as was surmised earlier in the off-season
• They're working on lifts with circus acrobats to create something new
• They want to make their style evolve

Sounds great! (Oh, and apparently Guillaume just got his driver's licence and a car!)

 

[StormyCloudss]

ETA: There's a new article up at L'Equipe, but it's behind a paywall, so a nice poster with access at FSU has been providing details, including:

• They're going to be skating an exhibition number rather than their FD at the Masters, so it looks like we have to wait longer to see that
• The FD is to two folk songs by Rachel Yamagata (I don't know her music, so I'll have to look her up, this will be interesting)
• No piano music in the FD
• The FD was indeed choreographed by Stephane Lambiel, as was surmised earlier in the off-season
• They're working on lifts with circus acrobats to create something new
• They want to make their style evolve

Sounds great! (Oh, and apparently Guillaume just got his driver's licence and a car!)

Yamagata is amazing. I am intrigued by what they mean by no piano music, given that many of her songs have piano accompaniment. Perhaps they mean no piano instrumentals/solos? So many questions! Much intrigue! Such a wait!

I am so, so excited to see their new lifts, which could really take them a step into a different direction. One of their very few weaknesses, imo, were their lifts (particularly the squat lifts in MS and Oddudua.) Despite being organic, I often felt that they were missing an "oomph" of sorts, particularly in the FD, when there are 3 lifts. MS was a step in the right direction already - 2nd and 3rd lift were sublime, was a bit more tepid regarding the first. Am looking forward to hopefully all new showstopper, elegant lifts!

I am disappointed that we'll only be able to see their new SD this weekend. Had this event marked down in my calendar for MONTHS, but they are perfectionists. Despite doing minor alterations throughout the season, I'm sure they want to make sure that both programs are of a "bulletproof competition standard," so to speak. I'm willing to wait for perfection, but can't help but be mildly miffed at having to wait even longer before seeing more brilliance from them.

 

[Harriet]

Yamagata is amazing. I am intrigued by what they mean by no piano music, given that many of her songs have piano accompaniment. Perhaps they mean no piano instrumentals/solos? So many questions! Much intrigue! Such a wait!

I suspect it probably means that neither piece is a piano solo/instrumental, yes. But I'm really looking forward to their more experimental side coming out again - and yes to looking forward to some intriguing new lifts!

I am disappointed that we'll only be able to see their new SD this weekend. Had this event marked down in my calendar for MONTHS, but they are perfectionists. Despite doing minor alterations throughout the season, I'm sure they want to make sure that both programs are of a "bulletproof competition standard," so to speak. I'm willing to wait for perfection, but can't help but be mildly miffed at having to wait even longer before seeing more brilliance from them.

Apparently they started training again at the beginning of August and have spent more time on the RD than the FD to date, so I can understand them not wanting to debut it here if they feel it's not competition-ready yet. By the time NHK rolls around at the start of November I'm sure they'll have it down cold though!

 

[cocotaffy]

According an article published in L'équipe, they will skate their FD on Rachael Yamagata's music but we have no more precisions except after four years of piano they want to steer away from it. They will skate the RD but not the FD at the Masters seeing they only started their training beginning of August. They even considered skipping the beginning of the season but thought why not ? (We got lucky there tbh, I can imagine a GP without them)
They tested and done lots of different stuff like getting his driving license for Guillaume who said it was much more life changing than an Olympic medal, that's such a down to earth tjing he would say.
She travelled France, he choreographed J/C SP. They finally had time to process their incredible 4 year journey to regain their motivation and earn a bit of money with some shows over the summer. However they don't enjoy participating to shows much. They prefer training for competition (again how luckyfor us, they might long in the sport).
So as we already knew, the RD is choreographed by Dean and the FD by Lambiel. No news on the RD music.
Here you go now discuss !

Another stuff, they want their style to evolve and are working with circus artists on their lifts. This is a long term plan till 2022. Hagenauer says they always had newish lifts but still turning around the same variations. They want to improve on the physical aspect of their programs.

ETA: I wrote that quickly in my car this morning (while parked of course ) and I just realized now all this info was already posted. Oups

 

[LaArdilla]

Interesting! I know French Masters is more of a test skate than a “real” competition but still, it has judges and scores. How are the judges going to score an Ex program rather than a FD, it surely won’t have all the required elements like twizzle sections, step sequences and such. And what will they show at the gala then?

 

[Harriet]

Another shot of that tango pose from Guillaume! https://www.instagram.com/p/BoOMVwRnhbX/?taken-by=guillaume_cizeron

Interesting! I know French Masters is more of a test skate than a “real” competition but still, it has judges and scores. How are the judges going to score an Ex program rather than a FD, it surely won’t have all the required elements like twizzle sections, step sequences and such. And what will they show at the gala then?

I think they might withdraw before the FD and just participate in the gala? Some North American couples did that at summer competitions in Canada when they had their RDs ready but not their FDs.

 

[LaArdilla]

I think they might withdraw before the FD and just participate in the gala? Some North American couples did that at summer competitions in Canada when they had their RDs ready but not their FDs.

Good point, you're probably right!

 

[Gotlev]

I've been wondering the same for quite some times now. While I really adore the swing/blues, I can't help but wished I was a little mouse to know what happened at Gadbois. It must have been quite hard for MFD, she seems to genuinely like P/C but she definitely had to split herself in two to make things work for everyone. Besides, V/M are canadians and it might have had an influence on how things were at some point (besides what happened after Sochi..). But overall, I think they managed it quite well. P/C improved so much in the SD and were quite a threat to V/M by the olympics when they took 6 points in the teeth just a year before. And they evolve so much in the artistry department as well, I mean, from Ed Sheeran to Beethoven in a blink of an eye !!! Who else can do it so well ? So, while in public they were more alone than before, I truly believe that behind the scene, they had all the advice and the support necessary and that in the end, everyone tried their best

I think my remark sounded harsher than I meant it. I seriously will be forever grateful to MFD for what she and Patrice did with GG. I'm convinced that they created the space in which GG's talent was able to blossom, and I think her choreographies were really great.

I don't mean at all to insinuate that she consciously chose to give less time or energy to GG in the Oddudua year. But I cannot shake off the feeling that that somehow happened, and I find that GG's talent should be treasured and cherished and nurtured and pampered and should be given attention to every single second of the day. They should have someone at their beck and call at all times. There should be someone who's life it is to think about their programs day and night, someone that is simply fully devoted to their talent and progress. Someone who is not spending time on others. This sounds probably insane, but I really do feel that such talent deserves no less. Handing over responsibility to them (as with the dress disaster) sounds mature and all, but I don't give a damn about it. They are prodigies and should be treated as such. Extraordinary talent calls for extraordinary care. They should get someone's undivided attention. Someone should be living for them to have the best program they can possibly have.

I'm not saying that she doesn't want to be that. It's just that she cannot be that. Unless she drops all of her other teams. Which is absurd obviously.
Is Hanyu Yuzuru not in a situation where people are simply there for HIM, for him alone, and for nobody else, to make sure he can perform at his best? I don't know if that's the case, but from the idolization I can hardly imagine it isn't.

I concede that I maybe wrong in wanting this and that I am considering only the show side and the outer perspective. Since it did not happen like that, the universe must have decided that their personality development and maturity - gained from harsh experiences - is more important.

(I have vague memories of already having had this discussion - am I connecting to an alternative universe or did we already go through this and am I simply rehashing old stuff?)

 

[Gotlev]

I had the same reaction except I immediately loved their music choice. and then it just became my favorite FD of them. This time around I'm afraid I won't like their music choice even though I have no doubt they can make it great #EdSheeranrealness. Still I just hope they won't pick a music in the style of their Belvedere Exhibition, the one music pick of theirs I just couldn't get on board with. Too slow and uninteresting. However, I have a great feeling for the Tango.
I would love if they can have an FD with the intensity and drama of their Waltz. I loved the fast pace and the build up.

Even with the crappy video from Villars, I was immediately blown away with the audacity of Oddudua. I loved that program from the start, and I think I like the GPF in Marseilles version the best. I really loved that last squat lift where Guillaume takes Gaby by her waist but from the front, and puts her on his leg and his back. I also preferred the kneeling ending. There are some moments where I feel the timing isn't in sync with the music, but it doesn't matter that much. I also immediately loved the costumes. They are still so great, simple but very frosty which somehow fits the program perfectly.

Belvedere is for me also too boring to watch.
And oh my god, if they could have something like the Waltz for an FD... That would be indescribable!

 

[LaArdilla]

Couldn’t agree more, Draka!