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Original Dance

Part Two of OD Random Impressions.

Lower down the rankings, I thought the Austrians Barbora SILNA / Dmitri MATSJUK were so badly robbed of a higher place than 18th for the OD, in what was probably one of the best Tangos of the day for Interpretation and Choreography. They also skated very well throughout, with attack and panache, with difficult moves, so I was tres disappointed with their average scores, it was uncalled for. :'( I also enjoyed this couple's Waltz CD, they are new to me, and probably the best Austrian Dancers I've seen since the Becks [bro and sis], who were top 5 in the 1980s, so it's a pleasure to have them in the mix, and hopefully they'll be sent to Worlds, and skate well in the FD tomorrow. :)

Compare them to the 3rd Russians Ekaterina RUBLEVA / Ivan SHEFER who skated before them. It was quite amusing, as they could've been contemporaries of their Coach Alexander Svinin skating at Euros circa 1983 [where he won the Silver medal] instead of the 2007 event! Yes, lovely typically Russian style icedancing, nice edges and lines, but no Tango choreo or character at all, and bizarre bright flourescent costume. It was quite oldfashioned, and his other couple the 4th ranked in the OD Russians, Jana KHOKHLOVA / Sergei NOVITSKI ...well? All in the same vein - an entertaining showdance but excuse me isn't it supposed to be a Tango? ??? It was quite bizarre that their PCS scores for Choreo and Interp were so high, for what was clearly not a Tango but a Showdance highlighting her flexibility as a Gymnast and former Pairs skater, with Pairs skater lifts with her legs hooked round his neck rotating fast.....? So other people take the time and trouble to research the style, have Tango Ballroom lessons and create authentic choreo, and a couple comes out having done none of this but just accentuates what they're good at, and gets marked 4th? As I said earlier, if the Kerr's hadn't have had such glaring technical errors, their Interpretation would've won the day, I believe, judging by the PCS scores [the Kerr's were 4th best but 10th on TES]. But it's nice the crowd in Warsaw appreciated them, and cheered loudly, it would go down great in the Gala, but how much longer K&N can ignore the requirements of rhythm and get away with not doing it we'll see next season. Also their music couldn't been one of Svinnin's albums from the 1970s - lift muzak. :P

Moving on to Faiella-Scali, undoubtedly hugely better than their awful Waltz. They had superb Tango character throughout, very impressive presentation, and on the whole skated well, a few tentative moments, and I find this couple's technical difficulty sometimes lacking, but it was a good performance worthy of 4th on the day IMO. They were 5th behind K&N based on the TES, and queried their levels afterwards in an interview, in the same way that the Bulgarians did. I hope it is resolved, as it's a shame for them if they feel aggrieved. I don't think it was an entirely clean skate though.

Kamila HAJKOVA / David VINCOUR skated really well, cutting a pleasing figure on the ice, with effective costumes and choreo, nice Tango character, but need a bit more difficulty to climb the rankings. Good skaters though. :)

There were alot of average North Americans lower down, skating for Greece etc. due to parentage. The Canadian/Greeks said they were going to Worlds aswell, and representing Greece gave them the opportunity to go straight into international events now. It's not a loophole, it's in the rules, but one wonders if they were good enough to represent Canada would they have made the switch?
With the difficult requirements now in the OD, the lower ranked couples really struggled with the technicalities, and many of the routines were dull, Ice Dance is becoming like Figure Skating in that respect - no longer can we still see a *performance* regardless.

Finally the 2nd ranked Brits Phillipa TOWLER-GREEN / Phillip POOLE actually skated well, much better than the CD, with a pleasing routine, but had a 3.00 deduction dropping like a stone from 18th to 24th. It was very worrying that they looked baffled in the K&C as to the reasons why, as there was no fall or obvious stumble, so the deds must have been for infringements of the rules, which is not good, to get to Euros and not have those ironed out already at this late stage of the season - their biggest comp. With TS Marika H in the UK, you'd have thought they'd have taken the opportunity to get an assessment of their programme re the elements, so it's a huge pity. Hopefully they can come back in the FD, though even without the deds they'd have still dropped after the OD behind the Czechs.

Roll on the Freedance!
 
To La Rhumba about the costumes and the concept.
At the last competition i had to explain FD and it's the turn of OD.-------Well,the concept is simple-Maxim is the "macho",he is at the bar and he sees HER.He don't know anything about her.May be she is rich(probably)and his only aim is to attract her attention,and he does it!

Ah, I see you edited your post to change that she is rich now? Makes much more sense to me this way! :) Thanks.
 
I am thrilled for the French who for once get the place they are really worth of, but I am sure there is more to that. Call me negative if you wish, as I am, but in ice dance, politics counts more than you would like, and this looks like a very very strange thing to me.
It's not that I don't like the russians, it's just that they're just not there yet. Give them one or two seasons and they'll be there, but now is just not worth those marks.

Oh Marie, rejoice!! :clap: I am!! :)

If you watched, how can you not see that the Russians have improved tremendously and were clearly better than the Bulgarians on today's performances. Both technically and Artistically, it was fair judging.
 
kerrs = haven't solved the problem of how siblings can tango without creeping me out

This old chestnut! It's called acting! The Zaretski's skated a very good Tango aswell. Funnily enough, I don't remember these comments of being "grossed out" and "obscene", as I've read on other forums, about the Duchesnays - who danced one of the best Tangos of the 87/88 season. :cool:

No doubt when the Hubbells start to climb the rankings in Seniors, all such reservations will have magically disappeared from the lips of all the critics. :rolleye:
 
They received level 1 for the spin, same as in GPF. The worst part is what it seems they haven't asked why they got level 1 in St. Petersburg. A friend of mine has looked into that OD frame-by-frame and suggested that the reason is the entrance to the spin. Maxim is rotating on the entry before he sits down and apparently the spin is up in the air whenever or not he complete 1 revolution during this "spining entrance". If he does (or come close to), the spin is turned into a CoSp and got level 1 because it doesn't meet the requirements for the higher level for combination spin. If he doesn't the spin is called level 3 (or 4, I forget which) normal Sp.

But that's just an educated fan opinion, there is nothing official on the reasons from judges.

Thankyou so much for the explanation [especially as you're so busy]. :bow:
 
Oh Marie, rejoice!! :clap: I am!! :)

If you watched, how can you not see that the Russians have improved tremendously and were clearly better than the Bulgarians on today's performances. Both technically and Artistically, it was fair judging.

Domshabs have always been technically good, right from the start. This year they have worked a lot on step sequences which are clearly better now. Doubters should watch all their programmes on youtube from 2002 until the current season so they can see the improvement.
With you again here La Rhumba :laugh:
 
I don't think it's fair to single Kh/Nov out for not sticking to traditional interpretation of the required rhythm. For me their OD this year is very much like Den/Sta excellent ballroom dance from several years ago. Good as it was it wasn't whatever rhythm is was supposed to be (waltz/march?). At least those two are good programs, quite unlike Bourne/Kraatz pathetic excuse of the cell block tango.

Yes, they are playing to their strengths, but so does everyone else and I disagree that it isn't ice dance. It's not ballroom dance and neither is it classical ballet, but in my book (there dance is defined as expressing the character of the music through the movement) it quite a dance all right. They are right up there with the other leading teams in terms of integrating the required elements into the dance.
 
This old chestnut! It's called acting! The Zaretski's skated a very good Tango aswell. Funnily enough, I don't remember these comments of being "grossed out" and "obscene", as I've read on other forums, about the Duchesnays - who danced one of the best Tangos of the 87/88 season. :cool:

No doubt when the Hubbells start to climb the rankings in Seniors, all such reservations will have magically disappeared from the lips of all the critics. :rolleye:

LOL The Hubbells' Tango does not look like a brother-sister tango at all.
This type of reasoning would rule out all brother-sister combinations for 'sexy' latin dances, especially rhumba :)
 
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No doubt when the Hubbells start to climb the rankings in Seniors, all such reservations will have magically disappeared from the lips of all the critics. :rolleye:

The Whobells?
And the Duchesnays IIRC played their tango for laughs, something the Kerrs should have tried.
 
I don't think it's fair to single Kh/Nov out for not sticking to traditional interpretation of the required rhythm. For me their OD this year is very much like Den/Sta excellent ballroom dance from several years ago. Good as it was it wasn't whatever rhythm is was supposed to be (waltz/march?). At least those two are good programs, quite unlike Bourne/Kraatz pathetic excuse of the cell block tango.

Do you mean DenStav's Baroque dance of a few years ago? I thought that was very regal and fabulous choreography, plus they danced as a couple throughout. I don't think you can compare their OD to Kh/N's this season, not on any level.

Yes, they are playing to their strengths, but so does everyone else and I disagree that it isn't ice dance. It's not ballroom dance and neither is it classical ballet, but in my book (there dance is defined as expressing the character of the music through the movement) it quite a dance all right. They are right up there with the other leading teams in terms of integrating the required elements into the dance.

Yes, there are different forms of Dance, but theirs was clearly not a Tango, when that was the required rhythm for this season, and mostly I don't enjoy that the entire focus is on her, the requirement is to icedance as a couple, which they have yet to convince me of. We'll see how they develop. :)
 
The Whobells?
And the Duchesnays IIRC played their tango for laughs, something the Kerrs should have tried.

No thanks, when they cut out the errors and skate like they did at CoR, their Tango is perfectly fine as it is. If you can't appreciate it, that's your loss.

I got the wrong year and the wrong rhythm, I meant the D's Blues OD from 1991, which was super sultry and sexy, and a very good dance.
 
I am so excited that the French are deservedly in first place and I'd to see them rewarded for their great FD as well, if they do hold up to the pressure and skate it well! They should be on top here.

And I also think that Dom/Shab have a wonderful OD this season that suits the character of the tango with such intriguing positions and creative lifts. I feel like they put on a true performance!
 
I adored Del/Scho original dance. That's exactly what I like. I haven't liked so much an original dance since Anissina and Peizerat's 2002 original dance. I love their outfits too. They looked classy and which is very rare nowadays, unfortunately. They deserved to be first.
 
I adored Del/Scho original dance. That's exactly what I like. I haven't liked so much an original dance since Anissina and Peizerat's 2002 original dance. I love their outfits too. They looked classy and which is very rare nowadays, unfortunately. They deserved to be first.

two days ago:
I'm thrilled for Delobel and Schoenfelder. Finally they got what they really deserved. But I won't get my hopes too high. Probably tomorrow they'll finish 3rd and by the end of the competition they'll be 4th.

3rd....hmmm
just so happy that they are in 1st overall with the over scored teams below them...:rock:
 
I love Denk&Stav's OD. Too bad they didn't skate it well here. At the GPF, Barb Underhill said Maxim touched down his free foot ever so slightly, which would result in the spin being called a level 1. I am glad for Del&Shoe, though. They've been held down too long.
 
Can a level be miscalled? And if so, is there any recourse for the skaters? I'm just curious.

This was made on purpose.... They have the best spins,and for this one they are receiving level 4 exept in the OD at the GPF...I don't think there is any sense to discuss the result,it is tooo funnyyyy. As Julin said before the OD the only way Den/Sta could win the gold medal is to leave the judging to the people and not to the judges....
 
I am very suspicious of the 27 tech mark for the bulgarians, when they had over 30 all season long. I am thrilled for the French who for once get the place they are really worth of, but I am sure there is more to that. Call me negative if you wish, as I am, but in ice dance, politics counts more than you would like, and this looks like a very very strange thing to me.
It's not that I don't like the russians, it's just that they're just not there yet. Give them one or two seasons and they'll be there, but now is just not worth those marks.
Sad for Albena and Maxim, I wonder where they lost points : the steps or the spin ?

As i said it in my previous post,there is no reason to wonder why....their placement-the third place-was decided before the competition started,because there is no bulgarian judge in the panel,and the judges can do whatever they want(whatever they've been told to do) knowing that there will be nobody to ask them why??? Albena and Maxim also knew it,but as they said,they are competing for their own pleasure and because the people love them,because they're fighters...Off course they said they expected similar judging,but not that harsh though... As a comentator said,they are 6 judges who are on the french couple side,and six one the russian,so it will be intresting what will happen after the FD...the french or the russian block will prevail...I have the feeling that in the FD the 1st place will be given to Den/Sta-but they'll still be third(only because they would like to close the people's eyes with that),the second to the russians-and they will come up first overall,the french-3 on the night,but overall second....:)
I will be happy if the french win the tittle,but i would like this to have happened with less scandal judging
 
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