2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 40 | Golden Skate

2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

Y’all can undervalue Sasha’s performance all ya like. It won’t change my opinion and I think her PCS going to rise next year and I’m gonna enjoy it :bullett:

I don't think that anyone can undervalue it anymore! Just look at the BV tables above - with one of her FS layouts, she can have BV of 69,48!!!, compared to 52,65 of Rika, the highest senior BV this season, which includes two triple axels. The difference between Sasha and everyone else is staggering; with such layouts, she can beat most of the men, actually.
 
You're very right! Part of the reasons to do a quad is that it gives you more room for greater permutation of jumps and jump combinations. I think my main point is that a quad ALONE, in and of itself is insufficient to be unbeatable. A good example of that at the moment is Elizabet, who has a 4S and her jump layout is otherwise fairly standard.
Beyond that, there's also a lot of other factors to consider.

1. Like I mentioned, high risk and high reward nature of the quad; falling on a quad is one thing, a fall on a 4Lz (-5 GOE) is one thing, but there is very high risk of underrotation or downgrades +/- a fall. We've seen it happen with Trusova and with Shcherbakova at points. For example, Shcherbakova's 1st 4Lz at GPF was both a fall and downgraded; her BV for that jump was 5.90. With a -5 GOE as per falls in this new protocol, her score for that jump was 2.95.

2. GOEs make a huge difference. Don't forget NEGATIVE base value. In a fall thats half the original base value. If its a downgrade or underrotation, that's negative GOE on top of the reduced GOE. If its a fall, that's half the base value of the downgraded jump. See above with Anna's <<4Lz. On the other hand, your competitors are getting positive GOEs on their jumps. Which is to say a 3Lz with +4 GOE is getting 8.26 for the same jump VS 2.95 – a 6 point difference. A <4Lz with a -3 GOE (6.04) or a fully rotated 4Lz with a fall (5.90) will still be disadvantaged against a well executed 3Lz.

3. In theory harder jump combinations, yes. But in practice the opportunity cost of attempting the quad is high. The inherent difficulty of the Quad, and the amount of power/energy required to attempt the jump means that ceteris paribus, you'll have less energy for the rest of your jumps; on tired legs, the skater may NOT necessarily be able to execute the higher value jumps PLUS the chances of messing up other jumps after the quad is not an insignificant one due to tired legs. A skater doing triples will inevitably have greater reserves to execute combination jumps in the bonus as well. The base value difference with the harder permutation jumps are really only about 2 or 3 points, a gap not insurmountable in the face of competitors positive GOE and (theoretically) putting all higher value combination jumping passes in the bonus. Also, while Shcherbakova's programme includes harder combinations, Elizabet's (with a quad) does not. So the inclusion of harder jump combinations really only go as far as the skater's ability to execute them consistently.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Quads, and I think it's great that Russian girls are really pushing the frontier with it BUT as there are benefits to including them, there are also downsides. Quads do not make the skater unbeatable by far; land the quad, and you'll wipe the floor and will almost surely win, but failing to do so, and its more or less fair game for everyone else – the probability of either happening is equally high. Alina with no quads was able to surpass Rika who had 5 BV higher at Worlds, Alena beat out Sasha who had a 19 point BV gap. There's no guarantee with quads.

The efficacy of a program with quads will come down to the ability to balance risk and benefit. Team Tutberidtze's decision to change up Shcherbakova's program to cut back on the quads (multiple) mid-season really helped to increase the stability of landing the jump and maximised the use of a quad in Anna's case.

I guess this was a lengthy post but I guess tldr is that
- In theory YES QUADS.
- In practice, much more complicated than that.

Actually, on Lizzy's quad...
I would say she had another advantage from it: PCs.

To start with, judges love high TES. See Zagitova her first senior year. See Kihira. For same reason, i have no doubt that Trusova's PCs will rise next year.
But for skaters from noname feds, a quad is a way to get noticed.

Tursynbaeva's PCs across the season
SC 31.52 + 60.91
Rostelecom 30.75 + 61.65
4CC 31.20 + 64.40 (4S fall)
Universiade 32.68 + 68.08 (4S fall)
Worlds 34.18 + 69.83 (4S landed)



On GOE

Lets look at Anna again =)

Jump BV + GOE, not counting the 4Lz so 1 jumping pass left: 45,51 + 7,53 = 53,04 at junior worlds

at senior worlds
Zagitova: 47,84 + 9,54 = 57,38. 4,34 points difference, any 4Lz will beat this.
Kihira: 52,65 + 7,82 = 60,47. 7,43 points difference, so the 4Lz should be not too messed up (still, negative GOE would beat this)
Medvedeva: 45,28 + 9,26 = 54,54. 1,5 points difference, literally anything except not jumping at all would give Anna higher TES+GOE


So even if she makes mistakes, the negative GOE will not put her that much behind the other top competitors. In fact, she may still beat them in TES+GOE, even with mistakes. Even if her quad was downgraded and she fell on it like in GPF, she would be quite near Alina in TES (a 1 point or so difference), ahead of Zhenya in TES, and just 4 points behind Kihira in TES.
Now, if she is clean, she will be easily like 10+ points ahead of them in TES.

Actually, imho, as long as a skater is able to skate clean everything else, regardless of what happens on the quad, a quad is not a high risc element. Even with mistakes, you still get a decent score, because of the overall harder possible layout.
 
Going back to the GoT game, I would add Marjaery Tyrell for Stanislava Konstantinova.
She is smart, beautiful, talented, power hungry, not naive, and plays the game extremely well.
Seems like the full package and, yet, something small is always missing, something is not enough for her to take the throne.
Hope Stanislava finally unveils her full potential next season!
 
I agree with you! The music is great and definitely suits Sasha’s powerful skating. Maybe she can develop a softer side for the less intense parts of the music too. I’d love to see her developing her artistic side! I was so excited when I saw the notification. Danny G did something really right!!

I actually love her fierce style-masculine style if you will. She reminds me a great deal of...Nathan Chen. I'm not sure we will ever see a softer side, but I do hope to see better spins and a bit more musicality. I think they wanted to announce the music quickly to discourage others from using it. Good idea.
 
So, Yasmina Kadryova posted a landed quad sal attempt on her instagram, I'm not sure whether its rotated because its from slightly far away. But its on her private so I can't post a link. (I can't even remember when I followed her private but :confused2:).
 
Out of curiosity I just checked out how The Night King sounds. I feel it is a difficult piece to skate to since the melody is not quite distinctive for the first half and it was quite slow. The the music gets super fast towards the end. I don't think anyone's spin speed can match the music. I guess the editing is going to be tricky.
Sasha does not have a soft style but she does listen to her music and her movements matched the rhythm of the programs she skated to.
 
Is that Latin? What does it mean?

american education system :thumbsup::biggrin:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carthago_delenda_est

"Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam"(English: "Furthermore, (moreover) I consider that Carthage must be destroyed").

"The term originates from the Roman Republic in the 2nd century BC, prior to the Third Punic War between Rome and Carthage. The expression was a call to arms by the party advocating destruction of Rome's ancient rival Carthage, which was thought to be rebuilding its capacity for further warfare. The phrase is particularly associated with the Roman senator Cato the Elder, who is said to have used it as the conclusion to all his speeches."

"A common modern use in order to emphasise to third parties the strength of one's opinion about a perceived necessary course of action is to add either at the beginning or the end of a statement the two opening words "Ceterum censeo…"
 
Its quite URd unfortunately.

Yeah almost << to me (but it’s hard to see because somebody skates by just as she lands it), but the fact that she’s trying 4S oitbof harbess already shows she’s a step above some others.
 
About the end of interview
Maria and other girl had to dance tango at New Year’s evening. Katia Gordeeva brought blue pants for Maria and she tried them on. She realized that she was too fat in them and couldn’t perform on stage in it. She had 5-6 days till the night and didn’t eat at all. After performance she stopped her ‘diet’.
 
Looks like Tukt is working with averbuk. Interesting? I predict she makes the worlds team this year.
 
Now Maria sometimes takes her students to her home for 5 days and helps them to lose weight. She proves them that they can lose weight (they say about not eat at home and gain weight)
 
Back
Top