2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating
- Thread starter Spirals for Miles
- Start date
- Joined
- Oct 23, 2005
Where else are they going to put her so she has a better chance of winning than Latvia? Not in Chelyabinsk against Valieva or against Liu in Poland, I can tell you that. They are going to bet on back to back in Croatia and Italy when Kanysheva isn’t the most consistent to begin with? Who are they protecting her from in Latvia that wouldn’t be present at any of those other events? She doesn’t need the quad to win there, she just needs to go clean and she can clear Haein and Rion as I believe her PCS is similar to Valieva. I just don’t believe that’s the reason.
As for Maya, I just don’t think RusFed is that generous even to one of Eteri’s girls. They have to draw the line somewhere and she was a mess in France. I think Ksenia Sinitsyna deserves that wide open shot at a win more than Maya but maybe there is some kind of reason she couldn’t be ready in time after the issue from JGP USA. I think she lucked into it by others being unable to compete there and if it was a power move in her favor I think it was highly unfair to other skaters.
- Joined
- Feb 18, 2019
I've seen this statement "but everything will be ok soon" in a couple different places now; Does that mean that the original source said this and that the injury isn't too severe?
Also, I kind of wish they gave Ksenia the Riga spot instead of Maia. I'm happy that Maia is getting a second spot, but I think it would make more sense to give Ksenia a first spot before Maia gets two, especially since Ksenia was prepared to compete last week already and Maia is still apparently recovering from injury/competed very recently. Then Maia could compete at Chelyabinsk instead of Ksenia (where she would be competing against Valieva and Vasilieva but an otherwise weaker field than Poland).
And I'm saying that you don't have enough evidence to make that sweeping statement. There is evidence that some of the top Russian girls could defeat at least Korea's #2-#5 with two clean skates (at least in some competitions). There is evidence that Valieva can outjump all the Korean girls. But there is no evidence that all the Russian girls on the JGP can defeat all the Korean ladies on the JGP with head-to-head clean skates.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2014
We have been incredibly spoiled the last few years with the Russian girls performance on the junior level. Especially the last two years by 3A. I would not give up on this crew they're having a few issues just like girls from any other country. And Russia arguably still has the best Junior girl in the world in KV. Alena2 needs a chance to get going she was very impressive in the Junior Grand Prix final last year. She's different than the other she's tall and willowy and she has a new coach and she may be injured. I certainly think she has a very bright future.
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2014
Actually, the translation was published here by FS Online:
https://fs-gossips.com/evgenia-medv...rted-to-appear-this-greatly-added-confidence/
Curious as to what Evgenia Medvedeva's programs layouts will be like. She said in an interview today that she is replacing the loop with a lutz in the short program and instead of 2 flips in the FS she'll just do 2 lutz jumps. TSL said in their latest episode that she is going for the Quad Sal this season in her skate which would be great but I'm not sure where they're getting this info from. In the interview that I read today she said she is working on it and its not yet there and that she's only been training it for 1.5 months. Guess we'll maybe find out at the test skates?
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2017
The only thing we know is that her triples are not as consistent as Sasha's. Sasha hasn't failed on any triple in international competition, AFAIK. But Anna and Alena both have had their share of mistakes (major step outs, falls, pops, etc.). This is only 1 competition for Kamila so time will tell. But she doesn't have edge issues where as both Anna and Alena do, and have been called internationally.
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2018
That’s what was said on Instagram, so I assume so.
- Joined
- Jan 18, 2017
Of course. As your nickname would have said "...the ice is broken..."
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2018
If you look at the competitions they took part, they (Maiia, Daria, Ksenia) are definitely capable of doing 70 in SP and 130 in FP if clean, so around 200 in total. In those lower domestic competitions there is hardly any "domestic bonus" so I can think it can be taken as a measure. Koreans, even clean, were below this bar, around 190.
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2019
Instead of childhood - Chiming brass.
Instead of childhood - Chiming Brass. Will Kamila Valiyeva survive three years of adoration?
Bambi method
Until the last two or three seasons, junior, and especially, children's figure skating, existed according to the Bambi method.
In the wild, newborn deerlings at first seem to not exist for the outside world. They don’t even give off a scent, they don’t feel the wild beasts surrounding their taiga nests. The deerlings' legs are still too weak to follow their mother, and therefore they quietly lie in a secluded place, waiting for her to return and feed them. Only after getting bolder and gaining strength, the deer begin to leave their liar to meet the dangers and lead an independent life.
Competitions and training of young skaters used to take place - in invisibility. Children, their failures and successes were known only to parents and coaches, and from strangers only judges and random spectators watched them, wandering into empty stands.
From junior age, the skaters jumped out in front of a large audience, like a little Jack-in-the-Box'es. And everyone begins to take a closer look - now what is this new upspring? 13 year old Aleksandra Trusova with her quad jumps forced us to look at girls in junior figure skating with even greater interest than at the female adults. Then Anna Shcherbakova and Alyona Kostornaya joined Trusova, and while they were still children, from behind their backs the next “crystal pieces” started to glitter, the brightest of which among the girls was Kamila Valiyeva.
Kazan
Valiyeva was born in 2006 and began figure skating in Kazan. Her first coach was Kseniya Ivanova.
Kamila is not the only student of Ivanova who joined the group of Eteri Tutberidze. In Khrustalniy for two seasons (2017-19) trained Maksimil'yan Yermolin (born 2005) while continuing to represent Tatarstan. Currently, the skater has changed region, school and coaching staff, moved to St. Petersburg, where he trains with Roman Usatov and Yevgeniy Rukavitsyn.
Kseniya Ivanova herself also changed her workplace and now coaches junior groups at the Moscow 'Plushenko's Angels' Academy of Figure Skating.
Moscow
The Valiyev family moved to Moscow in 2012, when their parents changed jobs, and Kamila continued to take part in figure skating in the Moskvich sports school. From 2012 to 2018, she changed coaches three times: up to 2014, she was with Marina Kudryavtseva, in the 2014/15 season - with Igor Lyutikov, and in 2015-18 with Nataliya Dubinskaya and Stanislav Kovalyov.
Natalya Dubinskaya highly appreciated the potential of the skater: “I realized with her all the ideas that I had wanted for a long time, but could not with other students due to different circumstances.” Nevertheless, Kamila showed psychological instability, she could win some competitions, and others - to the same rivals - she lost without a fight.
Valiyeva's 2017/18 season turned out to be nondescript due to injury. The athlete’s state of mind required measures, and her parents decided to present Kamila to Sambo-70. So, in the summer of 2018, after assessment, Kamila Valiyeva got into the group of Eteri Tutberidze.
"Girl on the Ball"
The coaching staff of Tutberidze staged two new programs for Kamila in the 2018/19 season, in which the skater was able to show herself from her most winning sides. The first half of the season went to the skating itself and the selection of costumes, and in all her splendour Valiyeva performed in January 2019 at the Moscow Cup and Championship. Moreover, any child's routine could go unnoticed if Eteri Tutberidze did not name Kamila's short program, “Girl on the Ball,” her favourite of the season.
And then the general insanity began. “incredible”, “unearthly”, “kissed by God”, “marked from above”, “created for figure skating” - even those kinds of epithets were not good enough in describing Valiyeva.
It would seem that only after the 2019 Russian Championship went by, where everyone gasped at the “ballet” of Anna Shcherbakova, at Trusova’s jumps and Kostornaya’s sliding skills, but Tutberidze gave everyone, including her 4A (Alina, Aleksandra, Anna and Alyana) a clear signal: 'work, it won’t be easy'.
Three months later, a new bomb was detonated: Valiyeva performed a quadruple Toeloop in training. And again, it was Eteri Georgiyevna who announced this.
Was this a calculated move? Did Tutberidze intentionally put Kamila under searchlights and microscopes around the world? Rather yes than no. Like one uses a calculator to calculate the value of a program, one uses the stopwatch to verify the timing of a performance, it was decided to bring down this avalanche of attention in advance, three years before the Olympics. If Tutberidze and staff can independently simulate fire and water at the rink, outside help is still needed for testing the brass fanfare.
Now, after the Russia junior national team Test Skates and the first stage of the Junior Grand Prix we can talk about Kamila still needing to learn a lot, to hold on to the spectators, to concentrate and keep herself in hand under those evaluating and not always benevolent looks.
Yes, in Courchevel she won and jumped the quad Toeloop, which received the highest marks in the history of female figure skating. But at the same time, there were falls on the triple Lutz and the triple Toeloop, and as a result, a shortfall of at least 20, or even 25 points in total. What is good for others (receiving 200.71), for Valiyeva, despite the gold medal won at this stage, it was a 4-- performance.
In addition, another star grows overseas in the same age group, who is also called the future winner of the 2022 Olympics. Alysa Liu already has a triple Axel and a quadruple Lutz in her arsenal, and a change in the rules regarding under rotation is in her favour.
The American demonstrates a completely different, athletic style of sliding: if Valiyeva’s sliding is art, then Liu’s programs are pure sport. But who will end up being stronger? Both Kamila and Alysa will move into the adult category in the 2021/22 season and have two more junior seasons to look at each other.
Total points scored / Free program / Short program
1st stage of JGP 2019/2020, 1st place Kamila Valiyeva (Russia) 200.71 / 138.40 / 62.31
2nd stage of JGP 2019/2020, 1st place Alysa Liu (USA) 208.10 / 138.80 / 69.30
Handing out Olympic gold so long before the Beijing Olympics, even to applicants from Russia, even from the USA, even from Japan, is a waste of time. Two and a half seasons is a huge period in which anything can happen.
At least you first need to qualify for the Olympics. While in the United States rivals in Liu’s technical content have not yet been sighted, in Russia eight people from the Tutberidze group alone, two of Mishin’s students and five or six other figure skaters from other coaches will apply for those three Olympic spots in the women. The level of competition in the first half of the 2021/22 season will be simply unimaginable.
And for this very autumn of 2021 and the winter of 2022, Valiyeva has begun to prepare herself from January 2019 on.
Nine girls (including Elisabet Tursynbayeva) train with Tutberidze alone to win the 2022 Olympics. Every one of those in her own way is beautiful, unique and worthy of the first place. They all go through their brass fanfares now. With all the hatred, the adoration, the popularity, and supporting roles must also be learned to endure and how to live with those in one way or another.
"Хейтеры" of Zagitova by ear (??), the skater herself and her coaches for a year were looking for an antidote to this, learned how to accept the punches, but what about love? Russia is far removed from the ecstasy which in Japan is caused by any appearance of Yuzuru Hanyu or Shoma Uno, but, for example, Alyona Kostornaya has a group of fans who periodically collect money, prepares and presents gifts to the athlete, because she is “their Alyona”, their adored idol.
How did a 15-year-old girl relate to such worship last season? What is normal to experience with these gifts - awkwardness, humility or gratitude? What is normal to do at that moment - to rejoice, be embarrassed or amuse vanity? This is not a stuffed teddy bear or a bunny throw on the ice after skating, it is a real offering of gifts to the altar of this deity, who so far in her sports biography, unlike Zagitova, still does not have big victories. How can one not recall the words of Tat'yana Tarasova, one of the reasons for Shoma Uno's failure at the 2019 World Championship, was that he was “loved to death” by Japanese fans? And with this fanatical worship, one also needs to learn to live, as does Uno, and Kostornaya, and Valiyeva.
Each of their photographs, each publication in social networks, each appearance in public is disassembled into molecules. Leading TV channels shoot skaters, shoot everywhere - at competitions, at shows, in television shows, at training sessions, in locker rooms, everyone wants to get photos, videos, comments and interviews. Public attention - serious stress, when your pulse quickens, your mouth goes dry, your hands and feet begin to tremble. If you think this is easy - try it yourself, go out in front of a large audience, read poetry or dance, check if your voice and body still listen to you, even if you do not need to jump quadruple or triple jumps. Valiyeva, like all Tutberidze skaters, is now getting used to living under a glass dome, and in this direction training is now going on without interruption.
Once in an interview, during the heyday of the yellow press in post-Soviet Russia, Alla Pugachyova, who was always an object of increased public interest, said that she was always ready: if paparazzi with cameras burst into her at a time when she is taking a bath, then she’s not just lies in the water - she lies beautifully. This is how “Khrustalniy” trains its athletes for the Games - on all fronts. And the one who is ready for everything and who cannot be unsettled by paparazzi, censored word here, unfriendly journalists, pre-hung medals, excessive expectations, mountains of plush hearts or huge banners in support of other athletes will win the Olympics.
Kamila Valiyeva in the juniors is ahead and overshadows the other “Crystals” Dar'ya Usachyova, Maya Khromykh, Alyona Kanysheva, as well as Kseniya Sinitsyna, the student of Svetlana Panova and Tatyana Moiseyeva, although their programs also have something to look at.
Yuliya Lipnitskaya was washed away by a wave of popularity after the 2014 Olympics team event. Tutberidze took this error into account, and now Alina Zagitova has won the 2018 Russian Championships, the 2018 European Championships, survived the entire 2018 Olympics, but turned out not to be ready for the 2018 World Championships.
Aleksandra Trusova “lit up” at 13, Kamila Valiyeva at 12, Sof'ya Akat'yeva and Veronika Zhilina at 10. Learning is progressing, so the next student of Eteri Tutberidze will one day be ready to win the “Grand Slam” of figure skating in a single season. Will it be Kamila Valiyeva, whether the 4A will allow her to do this, today's juniors of Tutberidze or any of the other contenders to become victorious? We will find out in the ongoing Olympic season.
-----
From: https://prostoprosport.ru/figure-sk...erzhit-li-kamila-valieva-tri-goda-obozhaniya/
Instead of childhood - Chiming Brass. Will Kamila Valiyeva survive three years of adoration?
Bambi method
Until the last two or three seasons, junior, and especially, children's figure skating, existed according to the Bambi method.
In the wild, newborn deerlings at first seem to not exist for the outside world. They don’t even give off a scent, they don’t feel the wild beasts surrounding their taiga nests. The deerlings' legs are still too weak to follow their mother, and therefore they quietly lie in a secluded place, waiting for her to return and feed them. Only after getting bolder and gaining strength, the deer begin to leave their liar to meet the dangers and lead an independent life.
Competitions and training of young skaters used to take place - in invisibility. Children, their failures and successes were known only to parents and coaches, and from strangers only judges and random spectators watched them, wandering into empty stands.
From junior age, the skaters jumped out in front of a large audience, like a little Jack-in-the-Box'es. And everyone begins to take a closer look - now what is this new upspring? 13 year old Aleksandra Trusova with her quad jumps forced us to look at girls in junior figure skating with even greater interest than at the female adults. Then Anna Shcherbakova and Alyona Kostornaya joined Trusova, and while they were still children, from behind their backs the next “crystal pieces” started to glitter, the brightest of which among the girls was Kamila Valiyeva.
Kazan
Valiyeva was born in 2006 and began figure skating in Kazan. Her first coach was Kseniya Ivanova.
Kamila is not the only student of Ivanova who joined the group of Eteri Tutberidze. In Khrustalniy for two seasons (2017-19) trained Maksimil'yan Yermolin (born 2005) while continuing to represent Tatarstan. Currently, the skater has changed region, school and coaching staff, moved to St. Petersburg, where he trains with Roman Usatov and Yevgeniy Rukavitsyn.
Kseniya Ivanova herself also changed her workplace and now coaches junior groups at the Moscow 'Plushenko's Angels' Academy of Figure Skating.
Moscow
The Valiyev family moved to Moscow in 2012, when their parents changed jobs, and Kamila continued to take part in figure skating in the Moskvich sports school. From 2012 to 2018, she changed coaches three times: up to 2014, she was with Marina Kudryavtseva, in the 2014/15 season - with Igor Lyutikov, and in 2015-18 with Nataliya Dubinskaya and Stanislav Kovalyov.
Natalya Dubinskaya highly appreciated the potential of the skater: “I realized with her all the ideas that I had wanted for a long time, but could not with other students due to different circumstances.” Nevertheless, Kamila showed psychological instability, she could win some competitions, and others - to the same rivals - she lost without a fight.
Valiyeva's 2017/18 season turned out to be nondescript due to injury. The athlete’s state of mind required measures, and her parents decided to present Kamila to Sambo-70. So, in the summer of 2018, after assessment, Kamila Valiyeva got into the group of Eteri Tutberidze.
"Girl on the Ball"
The coaching staff of Tutberidze staged two new programs for Kamila in the 2018/19 season, in which the skater was able to show herself from her most winning sides. The first half of the season went to the skating itself and the selection of costumes, and in all her splendour Valiyeva performed in January 2019 at the Moscow Cup and Championship. Moreover, any child's routine could go unnoticed if Eteri Tutberidze did not name Kamila's short program, “Girl on the Ball,” her favourite of the season.
And then the general insanity began. “incredible”, “unearthly”, “kissed by God”, “marked from above”, “created for figure skating” - even those kinds of epithets were not good enough in describing Valiyeva.
It would seem that only after the 2019 Russian Championship went by, where everyone gasped at the “ballet” of Anna Shcherbakova, at Trusova’s jumps and Kostornaya’s sliding skills, but Tutberidze gave everyone, including her 4A (Alina, Aleksandra, Anna and Alyana) a clear signal: 'work, it won’t be easy'.
Three months later, a new bomb was detonated: Valiyeva performed a quadruple Toeloop in training. And again, it was Eteri Georgiyevna who announced this.
Was this a calculated move? Did Tutberidze intentionally put Kamila under searchlights and microscopes around the world? Rather yes than no. Like one uses a calculator to calculate the value of a program, one uses the stopwatch to verify the timing of a performance, it was decided to bring down this avalanche of attention in advance, three years before the Olympics. If Tutberidze and staff can independently simulate fire and water at the rink, outside help is still needed for testing the brass fanfare.
Now, after the Russia junior national team Test Skates and the first stage of the Junior Grand Prix we can talk about Kamila still needing to learn a lot, to hold on to the spectators, to concentrate and keep herself in hand under those evaluating and not always benevolent looks.
Yes, in Courchevel she won and jumped the quad Toeloop, which received the highest marks in the history of female figure skating. But at the same time, there were falls on the triple Lutz and the triple Toeloop, and as a result, a shortfall of at least 20, or even 25 points in total. What is good for others (receiving 200.71), for Valiyeva, despite the gold medal won at this stage, it was a 4-- performance.
In addition, another star grows overseas in the same age group, who is also called the future winner of the 2022 Olympics. Alysa Liu already has a triple Axel and a quadruple Lutz in her arsenal, and a change in the rules regarding under rotation is in her favour.
The American demonstrates a completely different, athletic style of sliding: if Valiyeva’s sliding is art, then Liu’s programs are pure sport. But who will end up being stronger? Both Kamila and Alysa will move into the adult category in the 2021/22 season and have two more junior seasons to look at each other.
Total points scored / Free program / Short program
1st stage of JGP 2019/2020, 1st place Kamila Valiyeva (Russia) 200.71 / 138.40 / 62.31
2nd stage of JGP 2019/2020, 1st place Alysa Liu (USA) 208.10 / 138.80 / 69.30
Handing out Olympic gold so long before the Beijing Olympics, even to applicants from Russia, even from the USA, even from Japan, is a waste of time. Two and a half seasons is a huge period in which anything can happen.
At least you first need to qualify for the Olympics. While in the United States rivals in Liu’s technical content have not yet been sighted, in Russia eight people from the Tutberidze group alone, two of Mishin’s students and five or six other figure skaters from other coaches will apply for those three Olympic spots in the women. The level of competition in the first half of the 2021/22 season will be simply unimaginable.
And for this very autumn of 2021 and the winter of 2022, Valiyeva has begun to prepare herself from January 2019 on.
Nine girls (including Elisabet Tursynbayeva) train with Tutberidze alone to win the 2022 Olympics. Every one of those in her own way is beautiful, unique and worthy of the first place. They all go through their brass fanfares now. With all the hatred, the adoration, the popularity, and supporting roles must also be learned to endure and how to live with those in one way or another.
"Хейтеры" of Zagitova by ear (??), the skater herself and her coaches for a year were looking for an antidote to this, learned how to accept the punches, but what about love? Russia is far removed from the ecstasy which in Japan is caused by any appearance of Yuzuru Hanyu or Shoma Uno, but, for example, Alyona Kostornaya has a group of fans who periodically collect money, prepares and presents gifts to the athlete, because she is “their Alyona”, their adored idol.
How did a 15-year-old girl relate to such worship last season? What is normal to experience with these gifts - awkwardness, humility or gratitude? What is normal to do at that moment - to rejoice, be embarrassed or amuse vanity? This is not a stuffed teddy bear or a bunny throw on the ice after skating, it is a real offering of gifts to the altar of this deity, who so far in her sports biography, unlike Zagitova, still does not have big victories. How can one not recall the words of Tat'yana Tarasova, one of the reasons for Shoma Uno's failure at the 2019 World Championship, was that he was “loved to death” by Japanese fans? And with this fanatical worship, one also needs to learn to live, as does Uno, and Kostornaya, and Valiyeva.
Each of their photographs, each publication in social networks, each appearance in public is disassembled into molecules. Leading TV channels shoot skaters, shoot everywhere - at competitions, at shows, in television shows, at training sessions, in locker rooms, everyone wants to get photos, videos, comments and interviews. Public attention - serious stress, when your pulse quickens, your mouth goes dry, your hands and feet begin to tremble. If you think this is easy - try it yourself, go out in front of a large audience, read poetry or dance, check if your voice and body still listen to you, even if you do not need to jump quadruple or triple jumps. Valiyeva, like all Tutberidze skaters, is now getting used to living under a glass dome, and in this direction training is now going on without interruption.
Once in an interview, during the heyday of the yellow press in post-Soviet Russia, Alla Pugachyova, who was always an object of increased public interest, said that she was always ready: if paparazzi with cameras burst into her at a time when she is taking a bath, then she’s not just lies in the water - she lies beautifully. This is how “Khrustalniy” trains its athletes for the Games - on all fronts. And the one who is ready for everything and who cannot be unsettled by paparazzi, censored word here, unfriendly journalists, pre-hung medals, excessive expectations, mountains of plush hearts or huge banners in support of other athletes will win the Olympics.
Kamila Valiyeva in the juniors is ahead and overshadows the other “Crystals” Dar'ya Usachyova, Maya Khromykh, Alyona Kanysheva, as well as Kseniya Sinitsyna, the student of Svetlana Panova and Tatyana Moiseyeva, although their programs also have something to look at.
Yuliya Lipnitskaya was washed away by a wave of popularity after the 2014 Olympics team event. Tutberidze took this error into account, and now Alina Zagitova has won the 2018 Russian Championships, the 2018 European Championships, survived the entire 2018 Olympics, but turned out not to be ready for the 2018 World Championships.
Aleksandra Trusova “lit up” at 13, Kamila Valiyeva at 12, Sof'ya Akat'yeva and Veronika Zhilina at 10. Learning is progressing, so the next student of Eteri Tutberidze will one day be ready to win the “Grand Slam” of figure skating in a single season. Will it be Kamila Valiyeva, whether the 4A will allow her to do this, today's juniors of Tutberidze or any of the other contenders to become victorious? We will find out in the ongoing Olympic season.
-----
From: https://prostoprosport.ru/figure-sk...erzhit-li-kamila-valieva-tri-goda-obozhaniya/
Last edited:
- Joined
- May 27, 2018
Just to clarify, TSL didn’t say definitively that Evgenia was going to put the quad sal in her programs this season. They discussed that she was training it this season and hadn’t landed a clean one yet but would be pleased to fall on a rotated one at this point (basically just reiterated what Evgenia herself said in that recent interview).
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2017
That's the result of only picking from literally 2-3 groups in the entire Russia. I hope they are now realizing that was not a great idea.
The average Korean girl is getting better than the average Russian, yes Kamila Valieva is still better than maybe all of them but what about the others?
- Joined
- Jul 3, 2018
Does someone know why the new Eteri girls don't do a 3+2T+2T or 3+2T+2Lo combo? I noticed that all of them just do a 3+2T combo now. I know the second 2T and 2Lo don't add a lot of points, but those are 1.30 or 1.70 points in BV left on the table, which could mean the difference between first and second place.
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
Because they are doing +Eu+3S as their 3 jump combo so they can’t also do a +2T+2T
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2018
Disagree. What's an "average korean girl"? To be honest, I doubt many people would know korean girls who were not picked for JGP, while we know many russian girls who may not be even picked for JGP, though they would have the abilities for that. We saw two korean girls who got before two russian girls when they made mistakes. We also saw one korean girl who did not get before russian girl even when she made mistakes (and was slighly robbed by judges in FP IMO).
Also "picking from literally 2-3 groups in the entire Russia" - and from whom they should pick when there's no doubt that Eteri's school is above all and Panova's and Davydov's schools are still above the rest in juniors.
You people write as if:
- there were tons of schools in Russia with skaters above those who are "picked for JGP" - no, there aren't. Just look at Nastya, she was better with Eteri than with Plushenko and before what she is now (while it still doesn't mean she is bad, but the quality of the top school against the rest is obvious). Also, look at the discussion St. Petersburg vs. Moscow - the fact is Moscow schools are stronger in ladies, it is that simple.
- skaters who were picked are unable to jump, spin, make step sequence, while Koreans are some state of the art - again, no, they aren't. Korean girls this year are definitely not better than anything we have seen coming from that country within last two or three seasons. What they performed is pretty solid skate, but nothing special, nothing unbeatable. If what Russians have performed was their maximum, than OK. But they were far beyond their capabilities in those two (is't it funny, people are becoming doomsdayers after two competitions where all Russians medalled) competitions.
Just because there is no 3A coming from Russia every year it doesn't mean that contemporary russian juniors are weak. People are spoiled by the last two seasons with 3A and they think it is FFKKR to blame for that they have no new Trusova in store just now. Well, seems like I'm defending FFKKR, who would believe that two months ago
They made a lot of decisions I disagreed with but as I've said, they can't create skater from the air, and they can't create a high quality school from the air.
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2019
Inna Goncharenko: Radionova jumped out like Valiyeva, but the judges answered us
The Junior Grand Prix series has just started, but has already outlined the future competition between young and adult skaters. In a conversation with Anatoly Samokhvalov, the Honored Trainer of Russia, Inna Goncharenko singled out the three main juniors of the country at the moment and compared them with more experienced athletes, with whom she also associates a mature female skating.
In our women's skating, not everybody is feminine
Q: Inna Germanovna, one of our contenders for the Final of the Junior Grand Prix Kseniya Sinitsyna could not fly to the tournament in Lake Placid because of visa problems, but she will perform at the stage in Chelyabinsk, which protects her opportunity to start in the main December Final.
A: It is good that she was given a chance not to lose the second stage start. In my opinion, the short program of Sinitsyna is the best of those I saw among juniors this season, including participants in the Test Skates of the junior team. In the idea, the staging and, I would put it, unbiased choreography - unusual, this program is simply of perfect quality. The program is saturated with steps and is very suitable for the girl herself, 100% a hit.
Q: And even better than “Girl on the Ball” by Kamila Valiyeva?
A: "Girl on the Ball" - an original program. But with all original things, someone likes them, someone doesn't. I am more impressed with the Sinitsyna program. Perhaps I just got accustomed to “Girl on the Ball” in the second year, as I closely follow figure skating. Also, in my opinion, Valiyeva’s short program has too many leg lifts.
Q: But Kamila performs these elements beautifully and almost impeccably.
A: Wonderful performance, with the feeling that we are observing something cosmic. But everywhere there should be a measure, even in an incomparable stretch. Because the "parts" work effectively only when there aren't too many. But Valiyeva is a diamond girl. And diamonds are not to be repeated. And this diamond sparkles by itself in different facets, but I want to see them in harmony. Sinitsyna's is also individual, but hers is more ordinary than Valiyeva's. And when I saw Kseniya's program, I was completely delighted: “Mo-lo-dtsi!” Because both the coach Svetlana Panova and the director did not replay their roles but developed the skater in her most favourable light. Valiyeva, as I understand it, is the leader of our junior team, having learned her 'ultra-si' elements, her components, yet we can not watch and evaluate only one single person, since the team should be a team.
Q: Alena Kanysheva, who switched from Panova to Eteri Tutberidze, also looks like one of the leaders of this team.
A: Kanysheva has always been good on components, but so far I can not talk about her with the same enthusiasm I speak about Valiyeva and Sinitsyna. Yes, she’s great, but she’s always been pretty and sweet. Watchable and feminine. You see, in our women's skating not everybody is that feminine. But in Kanysheva always has been this refinement.
Judges remember the title of Tuktamysheva
Q: Vice President of the International Skating Union (ISU) Alexander Lakernik and ISU Technical Specialist Alexander Kuznetsov noted that the level of current participants in junior competitions is completely un-childish.
A: I totally agree. The girls are very well wrought, feeling their skating runs. And some skate gorgeously. They are much better than other older ones, but I would not overpraise them either. Of course, they are still girls, just with a modern base. But they have to grow and form.
Q: If you put Valiyeva, Kanysheva, Sinitsyna on one side of the balance scales, and on the other, for example, Elizaveta Tuktamysheva, Stanislava Konstantinova and, say, Sof'ya Samodurova, who outweighs the other?
A: In the same order. Last year, Samodurova fired off due to her stability, tenacity and the dance program that was produced by Ilya Averbukh, which was very suitable for her. But she still lacks this really good skating that would allow her to compete with the best. There are no clean rockers, counters, step sequences, where she could stretch her legs. Against the afore mentioned juniors, I will give Sof'ya the odds in this regard.
Q: Her coach Alexei Mishin does not like to exaggerate the value of the connecting elements over the jumps.
A: Yes, he never bothered on this subject, but how will they be judged? If a girl comes out straight after a not very strong athlete in terms of skating and connections, the assessment may be normal. But if she comes out after a nice and interesting sliding girl, for some of the judges it will be hard to look at. Yes, if we talk about Samodurova, they give her credit - she is a fighter, a staunch skater, and this helps her, but she must show how versatile a skater she is.
If we talk about Lisa Tuktamysheva, she is an experienced athlete. Yes, without the necessary connecting elements, but she added in something else. She clearly knows how to present herself and does this quite successfully. She has a kind of individual choreography, she is a person with a title that cannot be taken away.
Q: But with clean skates, will Lisa get the better score or this new generation?
A: The judges remember that Lisa is the world champion, and this will play a role if she skates clean. But at the same time, preference will probably be given to more watchable skating.
Again, with a clean skating opponent. Lisa always had a problem with the spins, her back hurts, so with regard to grabs, intercepts, bends, it will be difficult for her, because she always has a limited position. She cannot once again strain her back so she must use her speed, but the beauty of her positions - stretches, Bielmann's ... In this regard, it will be difficult for her.
Q: Surely these three girls - Sinitsyna, Kanysheva, Valiyeva - will make their way to the adult championship of Russia this season.
A: Yes.
Q: Coming December, will they create competition to the eminent names?
A: We do not know what the refereeing will be. After all, Radionova and I stood out in our time, when Lenka was the same as Valiyeva. At that moment, she jumped such the older girls didn't even try. But the components were rewarded with a small score, although Lenka was artistic, a dancer, all bendy by herself. Nevermind! When I asked the judges why they gave her so little, they answered me: "Well, where are you going in such a hurry? She is so small. Grow up, but for now let the girl just skate." At that championship of Russia, our limit was fifth. Fifth meant gold.
And all the same, back to Valiyeva, Kanysheva and Sinitsyna
Q: Tuktamysheva got her program staged by Canadian choreographer Shae-Lynn Bourne.
A: Liza has a lot of movements from Shae-Lynn, but Liza has already passed everything through herself and interpreted it in her own way. You can read Shae-Lynn Bourne in these movements already with difficulty. Lisa did not do it right, but how she used to do it.
Q: They staged contemporary but it turned out "Gypsy".
A: It turned out typical Liza. Let's see what will happen in the season.
Q: Radionova perfectly understood the themes of Shae-Lynn.
A: You see, it’s not enough to stage a program, you need to work it out correctly. This is a whole story, because the director in this case does not work for you as a full-time choreographer. Therefore, it happens that at first the program goes in a rush, and then at guard.
Q: Liza admires the Shae-Lynn program, but at the same time changes music to the seasoned piece Oblivion by Astor Piazzola, stipulating that the movements will remain the same.
A: The Mishin team has their own opinion, they believe they are right. Apparently, they got a production of Shae-Lynn Bourne, but could not digest it. This moment is very important, because you need to be able to rise to the level of Shae-Lynn to work with this program. But as to the question “Why?” It probably comes down to: "We are so good."
Q: Is it possible to keep Shae-Lynn’s movements under Oblivion?
A: You see, Shae-Lynn Bourne precisely subscribed every musical measure - every head movement, every approach to an element, the roll out of it. How can I take and transfer this work to other music? Personally, I do not understand this. But everyone has their own opinion.
Q: Returning to our general topic, I ask: will there be five Russians and one American Alysa Liu in the Final of the Junior Grand Prix?
A: Let's not rush into the finals, already the sport is traumatic, and there is no need to rush to predictions.
Q: But the leading trio - Valiyeva, Sinitsyna, Kanysheva?
A: Yes, because Nastya Tarakanova is a very strong girl, but personally I always referred to her calmly.
Q: Power skating? In Lake Placid she cleanly skated her free program, but from her skating itself arose the feeling of hard work.
A: Tarakanova began to take shape, began doing her elements clean, but maybe she has not yet reached the right psychological level. If Valiyeva is naturally sensitive to figure skating, since she is so refined in every action. Kanysheva, being this elegant girl, feels music like a real woman. Sinitsyna takes her accuracy, but Nastya still lacks this. Maybe she need to get to this level. But she knows how to reach it. Regarding Lake Placid, she must be congratulated on the fight to the end. Well done!
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Source: https://rsport.ria.ru/20190903/1558194783.html
The Junior Grand Prix series has just started, but has already outlined the future competition between young and adult skaters. In a conversation with Anatoly Samokhvalov, the Honored Trainer of Russia, Inna Goncharenko singled out the three main juniors of the country at the moment and compared them with more experienced athletes, with whom she also associates a mature female skating.
In our women's skating, not everybody is feminine
Q: Inna Germanovna, one of our contenders for the Final of the Junior Grand Prix Kseniya Sinitsyna could not fly to the tournament in Lake Placid because of visa problems, but she will perform at the stage in Chelyabinsk, which protects her opportunity to start in the main December Final.
A: It is good that she was given a chance not to lose the second stage start. In my opinion, the short program of Sinitsyna is the best of those I saw among juniors this season, including participants in the Test Skates of the junior team. In the idea, the staging and, I would put it, unbiased choreography - unusual, this program is simply of perfect quality. The program is saturated with steps and is very suitable for the girl herself, 100% a hit.
Q: And even better than “Girl on the Ball” by Kamila Valiyeva?
A: "Girl on the Ball" - an original program. But with all original things, someone likes them, someone doesn't. I am more impressed with the Sinitsyna program. Perhaps I just got accustomed to “Girl on the Ball” in the second year, as I closely follow figure skating. Also, in my opinion, Valiyeva’s short program has too many leg lifts.
Q: But Kamila performs these elements beautifully and almost impeccably.
A: Wonderful performance, with the feeling that we are observing something cosmic. But everywhere there should be a measure, even in an incomparable stretch. Because the "parts" work effectively only when there aren't too many. But Valiyeva is a diamond girl. And diamonds are not to be repeated. And this diamond sparkles by itself in different facets, but I want to see them in harmony. Sinitsyna's is also individual, but hers is more ordinary than Valiyeva's. And when I saw Kseniya's program, I was completely delighted: “Mo-lo-dtsi!” Because both the coach Svetlana Panova and the director did not replay their roles but developed the skater in her most favourable light. Valiyeva, as I understand it, is the leader of our junior team, having learned her 'ultra-si' elements, her components, yet we can not watch and evaluate only one single person, since the team should be a team.
Q: Alena Kanysheva, who switched from Panova to Eteri Tutberidze, also looks like one of the leaders of this team.
A: Kanysheva has always been good on components, but so far I can not talk about her with the same enthusiasm I speak about Valiyeva and Sinitsyna. Yes, she’s great, but she’s always been pretty and sweet. Watchable and feminine. You see, in our women's skating not everybody is that feminine. But in Kanysheva always has been this refinement.
Judges remember the title of Tuktamysheva
Q: Vice President of the International Skating Union (ISU) Alexander Lakernik and ISU Technical Specialist Alexander Kuznetsov noted that the level of current participants in junior competitions is completely un-childish.
A: I totally agree. The girls are very well wrought, feeling their skating runs. And some skate gorgeously. They are much better than other older ones, but I would not overpraise them either. Of course, they are still girls, just with a modern base. But they have to grow and form.
Q: If you put Valiyeva, Kanysheva, Sinitsyna on one side of the balance scales, and on the other, for example, Elizaveta Tuktamysheva, Stanislava Konstantinova and, say, Sof'ya Samodurova, who outweighs the other?
A: In the same order. Last year, Samodurova fired off due to her stability, tenacity and the dance program that was produced by Ilya Averbukh, which was very suitable for her. But she still lacks this really good skating that would allow her to compete with the best. There are no clean rockers, counters, step sequences, where she could stretch her legs. Against the afore mentioned juniors, I will give Sof'ya the odds in this regard.
Q: Her coach Alexei Mishin does not like to exaggerate the value of the connecting elements over the jumps.
A: Yes, he never bothered on this subject, but how will they be judged? If a girl comes out straight after a not very strong athlete in terms of skating and connections, the assessment may be normal. But if she comes out after a nice and interesting sliding girl, for some of the judges it will be hard to look at. Yes, if we talk about Samodurova, they give her credit - she is a fighter, a staunch skater, and this helps her, but she must show how versatile a skater she is.
If we talk about Lisa Tuktamysheva, she is an experienced athlete. Yes, without the necessary connecting elements, but she added in something else. She clearly knows how to present herself and does this quite successfully. She has a kind of individual choreography, she is a person with a title that cannot be taken away.
Q: But with clean skates, will Lisa get the better score or this new generation?
A: The judges remember that Lisa is the world champion, and this will play a role if she skates clean. But at the same time, preference will probably be given to more watchable skating.
Again, with a clean skating opponent. Lisa always had a problem with the spins, her back hurts, so with regard to grabs, intercepts, bends, it will be difficult for her, because she always has a limited position. She cannot once again strain her back so she must use her speed, but the beauty of her positions - stretches, Bielmann's ... In this regard, it will be difficult for her.
Q: Surely these three girls - Sinitsyna, Kanysheva, Valiyeva - will make their way to the adult championship of Russia this season.
A: Yes.
Q: Coming December, will they create competition to the eminent names?
A: We do not know what the refereeing will be. After all, Radionova and I stood out in our time, when Lenka was the same as Valiyeva. At that moment, she jumped such the older girls didn't even try. But the components were rewarded with a small score, although Lenka was artistic, a dancer, all bendy by herself. Nevermind! When I asked the judges why they gave her so little, they answered me: "Well, where are you going in such a hurry? She is so small. Grow up, but for now let the girl just skate." At that championship of Russia, our limit was fifth. Fifth meant gold.
And all the same, back to Valiyeva, Kanysheva and Sinitsyna
Q: Tuktamysheva got her program staged by Canadian choreographer Shae-Lynn Bourne.
A: Liza has a lot of movements from Shae-Lynn, but Liza has already passed everything through herself and interpreted it in her own way. You can read Shae-Lynn Bourne in these movements already with difficulty. Lisa did not do it right, but how she used to do it.
Q: They staged contemporary but it turned out "Gypsy".
A: It turned out typical Liza. Let's see what will happen in the season.
Q: Radionova perfectly understood the themes of Shae-Lynn.
A: You see, it’s not enough to stage a program, you need to work it out correctly. This is a whole story, because the director in this case does not work for you as a full-time choreographer. Therefore, it happens that at first the program goes in a rush, and then at guard.
Q: Liza admires the Shae-Lynn program, but at the same time changes music to the seasoned piece Oblivion by Astor Piazzola, stipulating that the movements will remain the same.
A: The Mishin team has their own opinion, they believe they are right. Apparently, they got a production of Shae-Lynn Bourne, but could not digest it. This moment is very important, because you need to be able to rise to the level of Shae-Lynn to work with this program. But as to the question “Why?” It probably comes down to: "We are so good."
Q: Is it possible to keep Shae-Lynn’s movements under Oblivion?
A: You see, Shae-Lynn Bourne precisely subscribed every musical measure - every head movement, every approach to an element, the roll out of it. How can I take and transfer this work to other music? Personally, I do not understand this. But everyone has their own opinion.
Q: Returning to our general topic, I ask: will there be five Russians and one American Alysa Liu in the Final of the Junior Grand Prix?
A: Let's not rush into the finals, already the sport is traumatic, and there is no need to rush to predictions.
Q: But the leading trio - Valiyeva, Sinitsyna, Kanysheva?
A: Yes, because Nastya Tarakanova is a very strong girl, but personally I always referred to her calmly.
Q: Power skating? In Lake Placid she cleanly skated her free program, but from her skating itself arose the feeling of hard work.
A: Tarakanova began to take shape, began doing her elements clean, but maybe she has not yet reached the right psychological level. If Valiyeva is naturally sensitive to figure skating, since she is so refined in every action. Kanysheva, being this elegant girl, feels music like a real woman. Sinitsyna takes her accuracy, but Nastya still lacks this. Maybe she need to get to this level. But she knows how to reach it. Regarding Lake Placid, she must be congratulated on the fight to the end. Well done!
-----
Source: https://rsport.ria.ru/20190903/1558194783.html
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