Tuktamysheva's scores

[macy]

Agreed. People really don't understand jump mechanics if they think a skater could really jump with the assistance of the FULL blade. Yes, some skaters will use more of the blade to assist in their takeoff but the reality is, the skaters are using their picks. You think these skaters who apparently take off with their full blade could do a quad/triple flip or lutz off of toe-pickless hockey skates?!

I find it a bit sad that Tuktamysheva can only come 3rd with such a consistent 3A... however, her programs really do need better content. She's a veteran and her skating still looks a bit sloppy. She's not exactly a skater whose artistry has improved a ton as her career progresses however, her 3A ability obviously has. Look at her interpretation/composition scores... theres a reason she's still getting some 7's, and mid 8's at best, in spite of being a World champion. She's got a bit of a Plushenko/Joubert complex going for her, IMO.. where in spite of earlier career success, the quality of the overall skating stagnated and the PCS suffered as a result. At some point the judges will get you for resting on your laurels - it's more than just about the jumps.

if it really was "full blade" they'd all be doing one of these

https://youtu.be/4lRnGqDet2s?t=5

plus, the skaters weight is still over their toe through the whole thing. there is literally NO way anyone could jump even a double off their blade.

 

[Alex65]

if it really was "full blade" they'd all be doing one of these

https://youtu.be/4lRnGqDet2s?t=5

plus, the skaters weight is still over their toe through the whole thing. there is literally NO way anyone could jump even a double off their blade.

It can be possible if you put on your skates backwards.

 

[NadezhdaNadya]

if it really was "full blade" they'd all be doing one of these

https://youtu.be/4lRnGqDet2s?t=5

plus, the skaters weight is still over their toe through the whole thing. there is literally NO way anyone could jump even a double off their blade.

You obviously have not seen the close ups of Yuzu, Nathan and Jin quads then. Bye bye.

 

[solani]

I think the answer to the question "Why do Tuktamysheva's scores get lower an lower?" is quite simple. Too many really good female Russian skaters in the senior circuit. Tennell is US No. 1, so she certainly gets a boost. This ist very frustrating and I can understand her reaction to the scores she is receiving. Her strategy is good, she needs those jumps in order to stay relevant in Russia. Nice improved skating won't do the trick. I like her attitude and her programs. Last season I was sure that she would retire because of all those girls going senior. I'm glad that she's still around. If she delivers consistantly, her scores will rise again. I love that 3A!

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

if it really was "full blade" they'd all be doing one of these

https://youtu.be/4lRnGqDet2s?t=5

plus, the skaters weight is still over their toe through the whole thing. there is literally NO way anyone could jump even a double off their blade.

For an edge jump like an axel maybe... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVkQS370KAk But not a jump where you vault off the pick like a flip or lutz.

The most amusing suggestions are those saying that a flip/lutz that uses part of the blade instead of solely the pick is really the skater doing a loop jump. If you look at actual the mechanics involved with these jumps it's a rather absurd comparison.

I still acknowledge of course that a takeoff that uses the blade instead of solely the pick is less than ideal technique, but that should be taken into account in terms of GOE. Liza's technique is pretty good, especially on her lutz... but I think she leaves points on the table elsewhere, particularly with spins (and doing a sequence on her 3Z).

BTW -- was that the first ever 3Z+2A sequence ever done by a woman?

 

[Ophelia]

She was totally underscored. No way will 2 two triple axle program lose to one without none. Bradie Tennell was overscored.

Helloooo, Asada regularly lost despite her 3As.

 

[anonymoose_au]

3A 3A 3A. What else does Tukt have about her skating besides 3A, which isn't even the best 3A right now?

And thereby lies the point with her scoring.

I hear this a lot, my answer is Liza has charisma and performance ability. I love to watch her programs! She's sassy and fun.

Also her Lutz is beautiful!

Honestly I wouldn't be nearly so irritated about her scores if the judges gave her credit for her jumps. Give her 5 for transitions, I won't complain, but give her a 0 for a beautiful high Lutz from a transition (I'm looking at you, Finnish Judge from...Nepela? Can't remember now) and I'm gonna call BS.

(Seriously, I want to see how that Finnish judge judged all the other ladies jumps, if they're a low scorer generally, alright... otherwise they should get a talking to.)

 

[draqq]

I'm going to make a strange comparison but I think of Liza as Ashley Wagner with better jump technique. She has sass, emotional presence, and a fighting spirit, but she doesn't have difficult transitions, great spins in speed or position, fast speed across the ice, nor complex choreography beyond arm movements.

 

[Skater Boy]

Liza's current (Lombardia/Skate America FS) base value is 67.62 assuming all levels on spins/footwork.

She can actually increase the base value to 70.01 if she went for the following jump layout:

3a-2t
3a
3z
3f
----
2a-euler-3s
3z-3t
3r

Doable, but is she willing to put in the work?

I wonder if Eteri would take her for 4 mos? or perhaps bradie's coach who is good for maximizing everythhing. Otherwise she's left battling with a quadless, axeless and lutzless Evgenia for fifth and xixth in Russia

 

[Skater Boy]

Helloooo, Asada regularly lost despite her 3As.

Well Asada didn't land her triple axels as consistently and she had other issues ie the lutz. But while there are issues with Liza's skating they seem to be a bit harsh on her GOE wise I sometimes can't tell how all the judges seem soconsistent with oneanotheryet you scratch your head - they must be right but sometimes you just so disagree. Ie Nathanis great but come on 94 for pcs almost 4 pts more than Jason.. I think people should enjoy Liza's skate now. She probably won't make the GPF. And we won't see her at Euros or worlds. I personally like her non princessy approach to staking. I do think she needs to skate bigger and faster. I hope she improves and shows the world that she deserves to go to worlds.

 

[NAOTMAA]

Helloooo, Asada regularly lost despite her 3As.

I still remember her Vancouver SP with clean 3A in combo and all and score wise she still didn't come close to Yuna. Instead she had to watch out for Joannie Rochette nipping at her heals, who the judges were clearly trying to push past her for silver :roll5: So for the SP at least the 3A pretty much meant nothing to the judges

 

[sailormoon]

Tuktamysheva's TES score (74.39) in free skate was not really bad. But her PCS score was 64.30, which was only ranked 4th behind Kaori Sakamoto, who earned 67.36 with the Matrix routine. Bradie Tennell beat Anna Shcherbakova 69.16 to 67.96 in PCS.

https://twitter.com/SkatingScores/status/1185801306532929537

 

[Elucidus]

If you want to find the perpetrator - seek the beneficiars. And the most blatant ones are either USFSF and/or ISU themselves - because they are extremely interested in making non-allrussian GPF as much as possible. Otherwise it would mean lack of interest from many countries to translate GPF, breaking TV contracts with them, loss of money. Nothing personal - just the business. Considering that with all Eteri girls and Tuktamysheva and Medvedeva being assessed as usual - this scenario would be highly likely - it's inevitable they are going to make some steps to avoid it at any cost. So they (mostly Tech Panel, which probably was negotiated with before the competition) tried to underscore both top Russians in SA simultaneously. They managed to win against Liza (thus making more chances for both Brady and Rika to get to GPF). Anna managed to win against them though (considering the circumstances it was truly a heroical deed).
For that exactly reasons I fully expect overly strict judging for Medvedeva and/or even Trusova in Canada while having lenient one for both Rika and Brady there. Just like it was here. Mark my words.

P.S.: trying to seriously justify this ridiculous protocols with persuading themselves that judges suddenly begin to see Liza's traits somehow differently now and thinking up some explanations based on a current rules is making me laugh tbh. It's just delusional naiveness and making yourself a fool. All hints are on the surface - don't turn the eyes.

 

[Mathman]

To me, fans of the Russian ladies should be hugging themselves with happiness. They've got 4 more or less sure things in the Grand Prix Finals race, and two maybes. This is no time for moaning and wailing about how everybody's picking on us.

 

[lzxnl]

If you want to find the perpetrator - seek the beneficiars. And the most blatant ones are either USFSF and/or ISU themselves - because they are extremely interested in making non-allrussian GPF as much as possible. Otherwise it would mean lack of interest from many countries to translate GPF, breaking TV contracts with them, loss of money. Nothing personal - just the business. Considering that with all Eteri girls and Tuktamysheva and Medvedeva being assessed as usual - this scenario would be highly likely - it's inevitable they are going to make some steps to avoid it at any cost. So they (mostly Tech Panel, which probably was negotiated with before the competition) tried to underscore both top Russians in SA simultaneously. They managed to win over Liza (thus making more chances for both Brady and Rika to get to GPF). Anna managed to win over them though.
For that exactly reasons I fully expect overly strict judging for Medvedeva and/or even Trusova in Canada while having lenient one for both Rika and Brady there. Just like it was here. Mark my words.

If you're a fan of Russian ladies and you want to complain about biased judging, a decent proportion of the skating community will not be sympathetic.

 

[IndiaP12]

Tuktamysheva's TES score (74.39) in free skate was not really bad. But her PCS score was 64.30, which was only ranked 4th behind Kaori Sakamoto, who earned 67.36 with the Matrix routine. Bradie Tennell beat Anna Shcherbakova 69.16 to 67.96 in PCS.

https://twitter.com/SkatingScores/status/1185801306532929537

74 TES is pretty bad for a clean program with 3As that was just as concerning as her PCS [emoji23]

 

[Mathman]

74 TES is pretty bad for a clean program with 3As that was just as concerning as her PCS [emoji23]

I think her TES score was fair. Although Liza did two triple Axels , she needed to pile on the points with a triple-triple. Shcherbakova did two quad Lutzes but still needed extra tech content to nail down the victory.

As for the PCSs, I would give Liza 9.5s for presentation and choreography just on general principles.

 

[eterialskater]

I'm going to make a strange comparison but I think of Liza as Ashley Wagner with better jump technique. She has sass, emotional presence, and a fighting spirit, but she doesn't have difficult transitions, great spins in speed or position, fast speed across the ice, nor complex choreography beyond arm movements.

If she was an American then she'd be the next best thing since apple pie. She is just not good when you compare her to other Russians. For someone who does not have much choreography and transitions in the way she is noticeably slow (not that speed skating ala Sakamoto or Osmond is any good). She also lacks finesse, nuance and unmusical. Outside of her supposed excellent jumping technique which has not been true for several seasons now. She has nothing that could draw you in. In simple terms she has no wow factor.

 

[yume]

I'm going to make a strange comparison but I think of Liza as Ashley Wagner with better jump technique. She has sass, emotional presence, and a fighting spirit, but she doesn't have difficult transitions, great spins in speed or position, fast speed across the ice, nor complex choreography beyond arm movements.

It's exactly that. Just that Wagner once received 73 PCS in her career (2016 worlds). More than Asada ever got....
And outside candy shop that is WTT the highest Liza ever got is 68.

 

[yume]

If you're a fan of Russian ladies and you want to complain about biased judging, a decent proportion of the skating community will not be sympathetic.

Because Russian ladies are rarely the ones blatlantly underscored. I would be more than surprised if Medvedeva gets calls and not other skaters, and pcs below 36/72, without too many visible mistakes.